Netflix Finally admits it slows down shipping for High Users

[chas0039]

After many attempt to find out why there are so many delays and problems with shipping from Netflix I finally have in writing, an admission that they delay and prioritize shipping to user who rent too much. Here is a direct quote from the email received yesterday.

"In determining priority for shipping and inventory allocation, we give priority to those members who receive the fewest DVDs through our service. As a result, those members who receive the most movies may experience next-day shipping and receive movies lower in their Queue more often than our other members. By prioritizing in this way, we help assure a balanced experience for all our members. Those that rent a lot of movies get a great value and those with lighter viewing habits are able to count on our service to meet their limited needs."

[Xylob the Destroyer]

those bastards....
I KNEW IT!!
when I first joined, I was getting 6 movies a week (yes, I know.... I have no life)
now i'm lucky to get 2 a week

[flaninacupboard]

If you have that much free time you probably have time to actually -go- to blockbusters.

[Xylob the Destroyer]

yep, they're just up the street
it's a filthy pig-sty of a shithole
it's tiny
their selection is shit
and they never have anything but 'new release' main-stream crapola in stock

[tgpo]

yep, they're just up the street
it's a filthy pig-sty of a shithole
it's tiny
their selection is shit
and they never have anything but 'new release' main-stream crapola in stock

Amen

[Ward River]

Netflix Finally admits it slows down shipping for High Users

How the hell do they know if I'm high or not?

[Supreme2k]

"In determining priority for shipping and inventory allocation, we give priority to those members who receive the fewest DVDs through our service. As a result, those members who receive the most movies may experience next-day shipping and receive movies lower in their Queue more often than our other members. By prioritizing in this way, we help assure a balanced experience for all our members. Those that rent a lot of movies get a great value and those with lighter viewing habits are able to count on our service to meet their limited needs."


Seems fair to me (if this is an actual email). Looks like a "10 Item Or Less Lane" system. If I'm interpreting the wording correctly, as long as you keep your queue packed, you will get your movies quickly, just not in queue order (if you have "hot" movies at the top).
It's bad enough that there are the "keepers" who really take the No Late Fee to heart, but then you have the 8-out people who want every movie in existance.

How the hell do they know if I'm high or not?

Duuuude, the three bags of Doritos and the satanically red eyes gave you away. 8)

[chas0039]

Supreme2k, this is an actual email.

Here is the entire text.

"Dear ***,

Thanks for your message.

Here is how we process and ship our DVDs:

We receive rental returns Monday through Friday, except holidays. We process
nearly 100% of returns the same day we receive them. When we check-in a return,
an e-mail is automatically and promptly sent to you to let you know that we have
received your DVD.

Our goal is to ship you the DVDs listed highest in your Queue. We try to ship
you DVDs from the distribution center closest to you so that you get movies
quickly. Often, on the same day that we receive a DVD from you, we will ship
the next available DVD from your Queue. In certain instances, your next
available DVD will not ship until the next business day following our receipt of
your returned movie. This can occur, for example, when your top choices are not
available to you from your closest distribution center or the number of
shipments to be processed by the distribution center on that day has been
exceeded. When this happens, your DVD will ship on the next business day and
may come from an alternate distribution center.

In determining priority for shipping and inventory allocation, we give priority
to those members who receive the fewest DVDs through our service. As a result,
those members who receive the most movies may experience next-day shipping and
receive movies lower in their Queue more often than our other members. By
prioritizing in this way, we help assure a balanced experience for all our
members. Those that rent a lot of movies get a great value and those with
lighter viewing habits are able to count on our service to meet their limited
needs.

When we ship you another DVD we automatically and promptly send you an e-mail
letting you know that it's on the way and telling you the estimated arrival
date.

If you have any further questions or concerns, please feel free to contact us.

Thanks,
Lisa,
Netflix Customer Service"

[jimmalenko]

I call that good business sense

The low users are the majority, so keep them happy in masses - pretty understandable from a business point of view I would've thought.

[jackal70058]

Renting movies online is much more trouble that going to the video store of you choice. If you don't like BlockBuster, go somewhere else.

Remember if you renting movies online than they are not having a store in your town that is paying tax and your community suffers.

[Xylob the Destroyer]

... or the number of
shipments to be processed by the distribution center on that day has been
exceeded. ...

this is something I had not taken into consideration....
it makes sense that they may have a 'cap' or 'max' on outgoing shipments per day and if they exceed it, they may have to pay more
this is another example of good business sense (on the part of the USPS this time -- after all, they may not be a Gov't agency anymore, but they still know how to stick it to ya)
all of NetFlix little envelopes are preprinted with a barcode like dealy for the postage -- there's got to be some way of limiting how many they send out this way, otherwise they could totally screw the postal service over with HUGE mass mailings, all paid for in advance for one low price

jackal70058:
going somewhere else is not necessarily an option.
BlockBuster is a monopoly in many areas, literally killing the mom & pop stores sometimes. then what??
&, if you use Netflix, you DO pay local sales taxes (which happens to be 10% where I live. 10 freakin' percent! so you ain't gonna make me feel guilty for skipping out on paying it if I had the chance), just like you would if you went to BlockBuster/Hollywood Video/etc -- it's the same as if you were to purchase from BestBuy online. as long as there's a BestBuy in your state, you pay that state's sales tax on your online purchase. if there's a BestBuy in your ZIP code, you also pay that local sales tax.

have you ever shopped online or used NetFlix??

[jackal70058]

have you ever shopped online or used NetFlix??

No I haven't. Someone told me you don't pay the local sale tax. Guess he didn't realize he is.

I still find it more trouble though, than just picking it up from your store. I hate having to wait for stuff in the mail/from FedEx so I just go to stores to get it.

[Shocker Milwaukee]

Netflix Finally admits it slows down shipping for High Users

How the hell do they know if I'm high or not?

[Xylob the Destroyer]

nah, one of the big things that they emphasize when you sign up (they tell you like 3 freakin' times!) is that you have to pay your local sales taxes on their service.
it's also part of their FAQ -- something along the lines of
Q "Why do you charge my credit card $YY.YY when your site said the monthly fee was $XX.XX?"
A "You will notice a slightly higher credit card charge than the monthly fee because we have to charge you for the local sales tax associated with your ZIP code."

As far as picking it up from you local store, all I can say is you're damn lucky. DON'T MOVE AWAY, because you may be seriously dissappointed when you find that the vast majority of BlockBuster and Hollywood Video's are exactly as I described them above.
I've moved a lot in the past 10 years and I'm drawing on a lot of experience with a bunch of these stores.

[samijubal]

I've got a good Hollywood by me and a lousy Blockbuster. BB is twice as far away anyway. The MVP at Hollywood beats the crap out of any online rentals. They don't have as much stuff for sure, but for the same price as BB online and less than Netflix, I can rent dozens of movies if I want, instead of the 13 or so in a month of online rentals.

[lordsmurf]

go somewhere else.

This does not apply to most people, as there is nowhere else.

Blockbuster sucks, the brick-n-mortar stores are pathetic remnants of an era now left mostly dead. The online store is barely any better than Walmart.

When you go into BB, odds are what you want is unavailable.

[chas0039]

To make it clear my reason for posting this; I am not annoyed with Netflix for doing this. I am annoyed that they lied about it for so long. Very early on I recognized that their business model guaranteed that they would lower profits as they increased efficiency. It is difficult to give good customer service when this costs them profit. What they are doing here is creating a ceiling on the number of rentals you get each month while still trying to market the service as "unlimited" rentals. My guess is that they kick in the slow down when you are getting more than 10 per month. This is the point where they lose money on you.

[Xylob the Destroyer]

I feel this is a clear-cut breach of contract.
Don't tell me I can have "unlimited rentals" when you are obviously going to limit my rental activity!
dammmit.....
It's like telling me I can't go through the line twice at an all-you-can-eat buffet.

[jimmalenko]

I think they key is to not take the word "unlimited" too literally. While to the letter it is probably false advertising to a degree, for the majority of their customers, it is unlimited. It's only a small percentage of heavy usage customers who think "unlimited" means "instantly available".

[Noahtuck]

Renting movies online is much more trouble that going to the video store of you choice. If you don't like BlockBuster, go somewhere else.

Ahhh... but the problem with me is most of the stuff i want to watch or rent they never carry localy and the only way to get it for rent is through online service's... and i have many many many diff. locations all within a 10 minute drive of my home... blockbuster, family video, eyeon video, ect. at least 5 diff. locations of every name store, not to mention all the mom & pop stores.... but no one carries say, SG-1, Voyager, ect.
I can't even find Escape from L.A. anywhere!!!! out of a dozen store i only found ONE that had lilo and stitch for rent on dvd there is a ton of stuff i want to watch that is even new realease in the last year that nobody carries!!!!!!!!!

And the thing about NETFLIX slowing down for certain people.... that is SUCH OLD NEWS!!!!!!!!!

[ViRaL1]

I don't see anything contemptable in that letter. I don't even see anything that says they're 'slowing down shipping' for high volume users. The fact that high volume users' movies don't ship same day doesn't mean they're intentionally delaying them, it means that they can't ship everyone's movies out the same day. So when someone has to take the hit, it will be the one-movie-a-night user, not the one-movie-a-week user. They're not limiting you any more than they're limiting low volume users. They're just saying that if you're a high volume user you may not always get first pick on the more popular titles as lower volume users. If they allowed this, a handful of users would suck up all the good rentals and low volume users would seldom get their picks. The low volume users are where they make the greatest margins, so they're not going to shut them out to accommodate the user who's receiving 3 movies and shipping them back the same day. If you keep your queue full of movies (not just new releases), you probably get a pretty good turnaround. Is it perfect? No. Is it going to make everyone happy? No. Is it going to keep them in business and in the black? Yes. If a business can make money AND keep all it's customers happy, then I applaud them, but the truth is, Netflix is in BUSINESS to make money, not friends.

[AlecWest]

I think the perceived unfairness seen by high-end renters lies in the fact that some businesses deal with consumers on a first-come first-served basis ... or customer service departments that tell you to "take a number" when you walk-in, serving them in order. NetFlix policy is more businesslike in that they give preference to those they make the most money off of ... namely, the low-end renters.

This is really a no-brainer. Assuming two customers pay the same amount of money for services ... and one customer demands service less often than another customer ... it's only natural to cater to the customer who demands service less often. In fact, while they certainly wouldn't admit it, I suspect that NetFlix would just as soon "lose" a few high-end renters if, at the same time, they could keep and satisfy a consumer base of low-end renters. Fewer problems ... and a better bottom line. Brilliant policy.

If a high-end renter becomes dissatisfied with NetFlix, they'll probably leave. NetFlix will probably send them an email, saying they're sorry to see them leave ... but in reality, translates to, "Don't slam the door on the way out."

[lordsmurf]

I don't see anything contemptable in that letter. I don't even see anything that says they're 'slowing down shipping' for high volume users. The fact that high volume users' movies don't ship same day doesn't mean they're intentionally delaying them, it means that they can't ship everyone's movies out the same day. So when someone has to take the hit, it will be the one-movie-a-night user, not the one-movie-a-week user. They're not limiting you any more than they're limiting low volume users.

Exactly. All that letter has proven is that the "Netflix delay tactics" are all BS myth. The issue is simply one of mail and ability fill up the "outbox" for the day. Typically, only the people that try to "work the system" are the ones complaining.

I have had all the way from 3 to 8 at a time. It comes when it comes, usually within mere days. I'm never without entertainment. Cheaper than DirecTV, and I get to choose what I watch.

This topic has been beat to death on this forum.

[lumis]

netflix does use delay tactics for high volume users. i've experienced it myself.. but even with their delay tactics they're still head and shoulders above BB & WM online dvd rentals.. their selection of available movies (in my experience) is much much better & their shipping is much much faster.

when i first signed up for netflix i could do this.

monday: NF ships out 3 dvds
tuesday: I recieve 3 dvds & ship them back
wednesday: NF recieves 3 dvds, ships out 3 more dvds
thursday: i recieve 3 dvds & ship them back
friday: NF recieve 3 dvds & ships out 3 more dvds
saturday: i recieve 3 dvds & ship them back
sunday: no activity
monday: NF recieves 3 dvds, ships out 3 more

and the cycle continues.. thats 9 dvds a week.. 39 dvds a month if you work it right & dont have holidays interfere.

but they catch on pretty quickly and it takes an extra day for them to recieve the dvds (or put it in their system), and sometimes they'll wait til the next day to ship your dvds after they recieve the previous 3.. your monthly intake drops down to about 24 to 30 dvd's a month.. its still a good deal. $18 for renting 30 dvd's is still pretty damned good..

if they're paying 37 cents to ship a dvd and you can get 39 dvds a month, thats $14.43, leaving them with $3.57 to pay for materials (envelopes, handling, etc)..

in my opinion netflix is good for 2 to 4 months to "watch" all the dvd's you can think of.. after that there would only be a few dvd's a month you'd really want.

[Xylob the Destroyer]

my activity was similar to lumis's
when I first signed up I was getting about 6 to 8 discs a week
now i'm lucky to get 2 a week

[chas0039]

Sorry smurf. They have also confirmed to me over the phone that this IS a delay. They used to delay shipping of popular titles to high users now they will delay all titles of movies to high users. This only happens when they reach their "limit" at the distribution center. This has nothing whatsoever to do with the USPS.

The main thing I see here as a problem in the business model. I cannot, offhand, think of another business that sells services at a flat rate per month and yet retains the control of the amount of this service in the hands of the business. Every other flat rate service places the control of use in the hands of the customer. If there is a maximum limit it is clearly spelled out. Most people would never sign up for anything at a flat rate where "all you can use" is actually limited at some unknown cap.

Picture signing up for a health club. You pay a flat rate and you go as much as you want. They are open for a number of hours per day and there are no surprises. Now assume that they could lock the doors whenever they wanted to for certain customers with no advanced notice. Your access code would just be locked out for a day while the guy next to you could get in. How long would you stay a member?

In no way is this working the system. And while this topic has been covered a few times, this is a new revelation. Never before has there been an admission from Netflix.

This is not random ranting and griping. I am pointing out information. I am much less annoyed now that I am aware of this. I, and many others, just want to know what they are paying for. If they are limiting me to a certain cap per month, I am fine with that.

[Xylob the Destroyer]

I would be "fine" with it if they had not deceived me from the very beginning....
I'm sticking with what I said earlier:
I feel this is a clear-cut breach of contract.
Don't tell me I can have "unlimited rentals" when you are obviously going to limit my rental activity!

[Guest]

I feel this is a clear-cut breach of contract.
Don't tell me I can have "unlimited rentals" when you are obviously going to limit my rental activity!
dammmit.....
It's like telling me I can't go through the line twice at an all-you-can-eat buffet.

Hear,hear!

[samijubal]

Everyone keeps putting down BB, they are better than Netflix for me. I get 3 discs per week, no more no less from both. But BB gives 2 coupons and has more new release TV series available than Netflix. The day series are released they are available at BB almost always, it can be a week or more before the first disc is available at Netflix. Maybe it's different in different locations, but where I am and the discs I rent BB is better. I can also take those 2 coupons to Hollywood and use them there too, giving me 4 in store rentals. I've even used the coupons more than once at Hollywood.

[ViRaL1]

netflix does use delay tactics for high volume users. i've experienced it myself.. but even with their delay tactics they're still head and shoulders above BB & WM online dvd rentals.. their selection of available movies (in my experience) is much much better & their shipping is much much faster.

when i first signed up for netflix i could do this.

monday: NF ships out 3 dvds
tuesday: I recieve 3 dvds & ship them back
wednesday: NF recieves 3 dvds, ships out 3 more dvds
thursday: i recieve 3 dvds & ship them back
friday: NF recieve 3 dvds & ships out 3 more dvds
saturday: i recieve 3 dvds & ship them back
sunday: no activity
monday: NF recieves 3 dvds, ships out 3 more

and the cycle continues.. thats 9 dvds a week.. 39 dvds a month if you work it right & dont have holidays interfere.

WOW!!! I wish I had a job that would let me watch 3 movies every other day and ship them right back.

but they catch on pretty quickly and it takes an extra day for them to recieve the dvds (or put it in their system), and sometimes they'll wait til the next day to ship your dvds after they recieve the previous 3.. your monthly intake drops down to about 24 to 30 dvd's a month.. its still a good deal. $18 for renting 30 dvd's is still pretty damned good..

if they're paying 37 cents to ship a dvd and you can get 39 dvds a month, thats $14.43, leaving them with $3.57 to pay for materials (envelopes, handling, etc)..

in my opinion netflix is good for 2 to 4 months to "watch" all the dvd's you can think of.. after that there would only be a few dvd's a month you'd really want.

While a whole $3.57 for a MONTH'S worth of processing and handling is generous, your math is off. Although thier bulk rate mailing is less than 37 cents, $14.43 is only accounting for mailing ONE WAY. Netflix pays for shipping BOTH WAYS.

As for issues with being 'limited' go, you're not being 'limited,' you're being prioritized. Take a grocery store for example. TECHNICALLY you have the ability to buy UNLIMITED groceries (which is really only limited by their inventory and the money you have to spend). You CAN grab 500 items in a trip if you want (high volume shopper), BUT by doing so, you aren't going to be able to use the express lane, which means that you have to wait longer to get checked out. This isn't keeping you from buying groceries, or closing the normal lanes so you can't buy. What I think people are missing here is that the flow of movies in and out is not constant, it changes from day to day. What this means is that if there are 1000 movies to ship out from the distribution center and low volume users get 'the express lane' (i.e. being shipped first) SOME high volume users may not get their movies shipped out that day if the number of discs to ship out may exceed what they can actually ship that day.

Nowhere have I seen anything akin to, 'yes, your movies are ready and we're able to ship them, but we're going to hold on to them for an extra day to slow you down.' If they have the labor available to ship them all out, and they don't, they're wasting money on labor by having processors standing around with nothing to do while your movies sit dormant at the distribution center.