Jack FM Stinks!

[Roundabout]

I don't often go on a rant, but this is too much. Last Thursday afternoon, the best local classic rock station here in L.A. changed formats to "JACK FM". Their motto: "We play what we want" (never mind what the listeners might want...).

This "formatless format" started in Vancouver BC on 96.9 FM, and has spread across Canada and is now on several stations in the USA. Up until last week, 93.1 here in L.A. was "Arrow 93", classic rock. Everyone I knew listened to it, and no one I know likes this new format of 'Jack'. The music is a hodge-podge of stuff from the 60's, 70's, 80's, 90's and some from today. They mix Richard Marx with Duran Duran and Led Zeppelin.

It's all on tape, no live DJ's, just soul-less computers churning out any junk from anytime, all in the name of being different. It's not even a real format, there's no name for it, unlike AOR, Oldies, or whatever. It's a sign of desperation by Infinity Broadcasting, they are losing audience share to XM and Sirius satellite radio, so they're willing to try anything at this point.

The only alternative now is KLOS here, they still play classic rock, but too much metal mixed in for my taste. Guess I'm gonna have to go to listening to my own mix CD's and forget radio. There's nothing good left here on the radio anymore.

Note: If this hasn't come to your town yet, odds are it will soon. It's spreading fast, like cow dung that's been freshly plopped...

Sorry for bitching here, had to get it off my chest. There, I feel better now

/rant

[lordsmurf]

There is a JACK FM here too. Sucks I think. Don't listen to it much. I hate all radio these days, about 25% commercials.

[lumis]

we also have a jack FM in my region too, it sucks out loud. they're only being "commercially different", which is just saying you're different but doing the same crap. the only radio that i listen to on a consistent basis is talk radio.

[Faustus]

WE have jackFM. they are ok, about half the time there might be something on I want to listen to.

I had an idea for the same type of station but with more of a "playing what WE want" concept. Meaning the playlist could be directly affected by the listeners by participating at the website.

We worked out alot of the tech details of how it would work but of course it takes cash to start a radio station and cash it something I don't have.

[SquirrelDip]

It's just a fad and won't last. They're playing up on the whole anti-establishment thing which is quite popular right now.

People are tired of being told what to do - no smoking, drive smaller cars, caffeine free, diet… Jack is all attitude – it won’t last long before people are sick of it.

[jackal70058]

Never heard of this before. I listen to the radio all the time.

[MackemX]

I hate radio ads! , in fact I just hate adverts altogether as some just insult your intelligence as they are so pathetic. It's amazing the advertising guys actually release them and get away with it

[Faustus]

I hate radio ads! , in fact I just hate adverts altogether as some just insult your intelligence as they are so pathetic. It's amazing the advertising guys actually release them and get away with it

XM Radio!

[smearbrick1]

I really hate radio jocks. If you are ever in Harrisburg, PA just listen to 105.7 in the morning, you'll know why. Just listen to any station around here... A computer operated station would be a welcome change.

[Faustus]

Thats exactly what I wanted to do. The only live voice you might here means something has gone wrong. Its more techs then disk jocks so operating cost stay down a bit and you air min. commercials to pay everyone and pocket a little cash for the company.

The idea is dead today but basicly its a station ran out of a love of music and not of OMG major cash flow by all radio station.

Also as I said before XM Radio owns.

[Xylob the Destroyer]

one of our local stations 'converted' to Jack FM about a year ago
it's crapola

[yoda313]

Hello,

Never heard of it.....

Sounds horrible...

But what I would like to see is a "b side" radio station. You know where they only play the "non hits" of stars. There are tons of excellent tracks on albums that never get air time. It would be nice to get them played instead of always hearing the same old same old.

THOUGH our local lite rock station 100.3 wnic (infinity radio) plays a "flashback weekend". Its great they dig up the old 70's and 80's tracks that don't get played much. BUT they always play disco and they always play the bee gees. They don't cycle enough of the older noncirculated tunes....

Kevin

[Roundabout]

"Jack Crap" is playing in Dallas, Indy, Jackson MS, Kansas City and NYC...more cities to come. It's even on at least one station in Ireland! Infinity loves this format, no DJ's to pay, just a PC running 24/7.

There's already signs in car windows here "Bring Back Arrow" and "Jack Sucks". Lots of people are pissed off and tuning out.

Here's an article from the local LA rag about it:

Arrow bows to a radical new radio format


Los Angeles radio listeners don't know Jack unless they've recently tuned in to the now-defunct Arrow 93.1, KCBS-FM.
Infinity Broadcasting flipped the Los Angeles classic rocker to "Jack-FM" late last week, now offering a slightly modified version of its 11-year-old predecessor. Along with acquiring a new name, the station said goodbye to its disc jockeys and put the needle to a broad swath of music that encompasses The Police and No Doubt.

The format was created by -- and named for -- "Cadillac Jack" Garrett, a veteran radio personality on the East Coast.

Defined as "a mile wide and an inch deep," Jack plays a wide range of music, but doesn't go any deeper than the top pop hits of the past three decades.

"It's like your iPod on shuffle," said Jeff Federman, the station manager who also touted Jack's playlist of more than 1,200 songs. "And the fact that Jack is difficult to define makes it almost more appealing. It's playing what we want."

But equally important, the arrival of Jack and demise of Arrow mark a transformation in terrestrial radio as satellite counterparts pose competition and beckon a new era for the medium.

So far, Jack-FM is surfacing in markets across the country, attempting to draw listeners with creative marketing and a tuner-friendly name. The format recently arrived in Indianapolis with songs spanning the 1970s and 1990s. Dallas has its own version of Jack. And so does Jackson, Miss.

"This shows how desperate radio is right now, and I think they (terrestrial radio) are afraid of what satellite can do," said Richard Neer, a talk-show host and author of "FM: The Rise and Fall of Rock Radio." "With devices like the iPod, people are seeing alternative ways of enjoying music that terrestrial radio isn't supplying."

It's too early to tell whether Jack can tickle the ears of Los Angeles listeners. Viacom-owned Infinity is certainly hopeful, especially on the heels of lackluster performance at the corporate level. Revenues from radio were virtually flat for Viacom in 2004. At the same time, the radio segment posted an operating loss of $10.7 billion last year compared with an operating income of $252.2 million in 2003. The culprit: weakness in the local advertising market and higher contractual talent.

Based on those factors, it's not surprising Los Angeles radio stations such as Indie 103.1, KDLD-FM, are virtually free of disk jockeys, Neer said. "But terrestrial radio has long abused its audience with tight play and not even identifying the songs they play."

On Monday morning, Jack-FM didn't identify the songs it played. A pop-oriented ear could easily tell that Tom Petty and Depeche Mode were among the artists. Federman said the station has yet to decide whether or when Jack will have a DJ. Until then, Infinity is going to let the music define the station's persona.

The target demographic is 35- to 44-year-olds, a whole decade below Arrow's aim. And while the Jack format started in Vancouver about three years ago, "a lot of issues that now exist here did not exist there," said Sean Ross, vice president of music and programming for Edison Media Research in Somerville, N.J. "But most listeners who don't like classic rock will be fine with the new change."

Ross characterized the rise of Jack stations as a "land rush." He said it's almost as if Jack "is this sort of K-Earth for the next generation."

The question is whether Los Angeles will welcome a format similar to what is already heard on Star 98.7, KYSR-FM. A station favorite at Star is U2, the same band that Jack-FM is headlining on its playlist.

Angela Perelli, program director at Clear Channel-owned Star, said the station isn't concerned about competition from Jack, even though it might be the "hot format du jour."

"It's more important for us to have jocks and content that is more compelling."

Don Barrett, editor of LARadio.com, lauded Jack's Los Angeles digs. "All of the sudden, someone is busting loose and doing something different; I commend that," said the editor of the electronic newsletter.

But regardless of Jack-FM's future, the format will be difficult to chart. Kevin Carter, pop editor at Radio & Records in Los Angeles, said the genre is too far-reaching, "not really a chart kind of format. And maybe we shouldn't try to define it."

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

There's also copycats of Jack out there: Ben (BEN-FM in Philly, Frank?)

Jack, Bob, Frank: This is Creative Programming?

This concept of calling the above-named radio formats "new" is getting out of control. It was first brought up, here, in September 2004 after Entercom Communications CEO, David Fields, claimed "lack of radio innovation is unadulterated garbage," followed closely by Greater Media President/CEO, Peter H. Smyth, being quoted "...that creative new formats are being launched." Jack and Bob were used as examples. (We should note that Mr. Smyth's passion for the industry helped win him the 2005 Radio Wayne Awards’ Broadcaster of the Year.)

I haven't changed opinion since either gentleman made his comment. Radio has created nothing. It has added to a short playlist which, by default, means it is playing songs people haven't heard for awhile. But "creating" hasn't happened. Talents are still reading off liner cards. There's no show prep that's obvious on anything but morning drive programs. And in the evening we still have a constant stream of music because the time is not sold, not because radio has "created" programming.

Back to Jack. Readers know legendary FM programmer John Gorman and I converse regularly. I'll share with you a snippet of an email John sent yesterday: "The penguin should be the official bird of radio. Like penguins, radio programmers blindly follow who's ever in front of them. In this case, Jack-FM."

He then asks, "Remember when many stations had an average 1200 titles in rotation?"

If radio is to stay in the fight - and be aggressive - it needs to use the word "create" appropriately. If you turn to Webster, that means "to produce through imaginative skill."

Quadrupling a playlist doesn't fall into this category.

[AlecWest]

"The penguin should be the official bird of radio. Like penguins, radio programmers blindly follow who's ever in front of them. In this case, Jack-FM."

My avatar resents that remark.

[Faustus]

I like the fact that it plays alot of different stuff. Its a real ROCK channel like in the old days. I normal over the air radio that try's to over specialize, it never works. Slowly they have format creep.

It works great on XM though, enough stations that DO NOT COMPETE with each other means each thing can get and stick with its own type of music.

[jackal70058]

XM Radio!

No way I'm paying for radio. It's meant to be free.

And "satellite" means "no local" anything. Trust me I had Crap TV service before.

I guess I not see what is wrong with a radio station that plays everything. I listen to almost every category of music, old and new, and It would't bother me.

[Roundabout]

But what I would like to see is a "b side" radio station. You know where they only play the "non hits" of stars. There are tons of excellent tracks on albums that never get air time. It would be nice to get them played instead of always hearing the same old same old.

Yoda,

That's almost exactly what I said to the station management at the station. All they had to do is fix the short playlist that they had (where they kept playing the same 250 songs in rotation) and add some b-sides or deeper album cuts to keep it interesting.

Seems simple enough to me, and to you too.

I don't know why they can't figure out something that's so simple. There used to be a station in the late 70's here that did that. KEZY-FM in Anaheim used to have a great PD (Program Director) that understood the audience more than any other station I've heard before or since. They had what I considered to be a perfect mix of well known album tracks, but they would throw in the occasional lesser known song (known, but not heard much).

But, like everything else, they decided to change one day, and fired the PD...and it was never the same again.

There's only one rock station left in L.A. now, and who knows how long it will last? I'm glad I've got all my CD's and MP3's to listen to. Soon radio will be worthless, except for traffic reports in the morning.

Ah well, you can't fight change. They'll never learn.

Meanwhile, I've tuned out this Jack station permanently.

[glockjs]

can't complain much for my radio market area..phoenix az...radio isnt bad at all.

btw they lookin for ya at the other forum mr round

[yoda313]

Hello,

Yoda,

That's almost exactly what I said to the station management at the station. All they had to do is fix the short playlist that they had (where they kept playing the same 250 songs in rotation) and add some b-sides or deeper album cuts to keep it interesting.

Seems simple enough to me, and to you too.

Glad I'm not alone

Kevin

[jackal70058]

Hello,

Yoda,

That's almost exactly what I said to the station management at the station. All they had to do is fix the short playlist that they had (where they kept playing the same 250 songs in rotation) and add some b-sides or deeper album cuts to keep it interesting.

Seems simple enough to me, and to you too.

Glad I'm not alone

Kevin

Yeah, there a radio station here just like that. WDVW-FM 92.3 plays the same few songs over and over. And they have commercial to say that they don't do that!

I do enjoy listening to the radio, though. It is may main source of information.

[Faustus]

XM Radio!

No way I'm paying for radio. It's meant to be free.

And "satellite" means "no local" anything. Trust me I had Crap TV service before.

I guess I not see what is wrong with a radio station that plays everything. I listen to almost every category of music, old and new, and It would't bother me.

Look around at the state of radio. The only thing thats really truely local anymore is your antennas.

[MOVIEGEEK]

Hey Roundabout you still have 95.5 KLOS :P .
I miss the old 94.7 KMET,105.5 KNAC and 100.3 Pirate radio.

[jackal70058]

XM Radio!

No way I'm paying for radio. It's meant to be free.

And "satellite" means "no local" anything. Trust me I had Crap TV service before.

I guess I not see what is wrong with a radio station that plays everything. I listen to almost every category of music, old and new, and It would't bother me.

Look around at the state of radio. The only thing thats really truely local anymore is your antennas.

But I get local news, weather, traffic, and local talk shows on my radio. There has many local programming on the radio. Sure, some of the station have companies from up North, but I not paying for radio service that is not specific for where I live.

[Roundabout]

btw they lookin for ya at the other forum mr round

Wow, someone actually missed me? I hadn't logged in there for a little while when I got distracted post whoring at the "other" forum. Wish I had my cable internet conn. still, it's hard on a 26.4Kbps dial-up to spend a lot of time on all the forums I like to post in.

Ah well, maybe sometime I'll be able to afford it again.

Hey Roundabout you still have 95.5 KLOS .
I miss the old 94.7 KMET,105.5 KNAC and 100.3 Pirate radio.

Yep, only one rock station in all the L.A. area. Hard to believe that when there's something like 15 million people here, they can't support two rock stations. Even in smaller markets like Vegas, they have several. We got lotsa Mex stations, though.

KMET was great, when it became the "Wave", I was listening at the moment they changed formats. I couldn't believe anyone would listen to elevator music like that, but it's still going today.

I could be wrong about the Jack format too, but I still won't be listening. I'm mad they took away the best station in this area to put this junk on. If they'd taken KIIS or KOST and done this, it would have been an improvement

There's already quite a bit of backlash against this format change, and it remains to be seen how long they'll stick with this before they change to something else. I think six months will show whether they will sink or swim. It'll be interesting to see the Arbitron ratings on the change, when it comes out.

I was actually one of the Arbitron raters recently, before this change, and I put KCBS-FM (ARROW) in the diary even when I wasn't listening, so I did my part to try and keep them going

Guess it wasn't enough in the end. There used to be a lot of good stations here, now there are none. KLOS is O.K. but it's not great. Since there's no other alternative except KOLA (San Bernardino rock & pop oldies station), guess I'll be listening to it mostly. I only need two presets on my FM radio now. The rest of the buttons are no longer needed.

[shelbyGT]

I don't mind Jack FM. play a lot of random stuff, much like my playlists at home.

[Faustus]

XM Radio!

No way I'm paying for radio. It's meant to be free.

And "satellite" means "no local" anything. Trust me I had Crap TV service before.

I guess I not see what is wrong with a radio station that plays everything. I listen to almost every category of music, old and new, and It would't bother me.

Look around at the state of radio. The only thing thats really truely local anymore is your antennas.

But I get local news, weather, traffic, and local talk shows on my radio. There has many local programming on the radio. Sure, some of the station have companies from up North, but I not paying for radio service that is not specific for where I live.

If you live in a major city then XM likely has weather and traffic for your area on its on repeating station. Local news and talk... no so much.

Like I said I love my XM Radio, Dallas is a large radio market but for some reason its really stinks (more so in the last 5 or so years) and XM is my Savior. Plus its killer for roadtrips.