$2.04 per gallon

[Roundabout]

Same station that I mentioned yesterday that was $2.39 is today $2.45. That one station alone has gone up $0.16 in just three days.

I am aware of gas prices in Europe, having driven across the continent several times. However, as we also know, the price of gas is higher there due almost completely to taxes, not because it's cheaper to import here in the USA. A price of a barrel of oil is the price of a barrel of oil, worldwide. It's even priced in dollars.

At the last time I drove across France and Germany to the Czech Repubic, it was around the equivalent of US$4.00 a gallon until I got across the Czech border. Then it was "only" US$2.20/gal.

At the same time in the USA, gas was about $1.09/gal. so even in the lower taxed CZ, it was still double what it was in the USA. However, the car I was driving in Europe was a Ford KA, extremely economical. So, though I was paying a lot more for gas, it seemed like less somehow, because I didn't drive the car as much. I only filled the car up twice between Paris and Prague (about 1000KM, or 625 miles), so the hit on price didn't seem so bad.

In the cities, I parked the car and rode public transportation. I like using subways and buses, but here in the USA, in most cities, public transport sucks, to put it mildly. There's really no incentive for the average Joe to park his car and ride the bus.

I agree about one thing that EddyH said, and that is about the multi-car families here in the USA. The entire time I was growing up, not one person or family we knew had more than one car. Now everyone has two or more. A friend of mine has four! That's totally ridiculous in my mind. Whatever excess fuel was available in the past has been sopped up by gas-hogging SUV's, ATV's, boats, jetskis, and other gas powered toys that people feel like they have to have.

Common sense, when there's no surplus of a product and high demand, the price goes up. Speculators jump on the bandwagon, and off we go - to the poorhouse! We've only been lucky so far because there's been enough surplus to keep the price low, but now that China and other countries like India are growing and increasingly demanding oil, there's no large surplus left.

The price may come down somewhat when people start driving a bit less due to the high prices, but we might not ever see sub $1.50/gal. gas again in our lifetime. Whether we do or not is dependent on a lot of internal and external factors, which makes it impossible to predict with and degree of certainty.

For the short run, for sure, we're in for much higher prices.

[shelbyGT]

When was the last time a new oil refinery was built... 70's? 80's? That tells you something right there, doesn't it? The oil companies WANT these higher prices. It's no coincidence they all had their highest years of profit EVER last year.

[flaninacupboard]

I agree about one thing that EddyH said, and that is about the multi-car families here in the USA. The entire time I was growing up, not one person or family we knew had more than one car.

It's all the housewives who had to get jobs....

There's five people in my house, one of whom does not drive. There's six cars.

1x 2 seat smart car.
1x 2 seat astra van.
1x 5 seat ford
1x 5 seat nissan
1x 5 seat alfa romeo
1x 2 seat ronart, racing car

[EddyH]

what are the Ford and Nissan, though? Fiesta and Micra (conceivably 5 seats..), or Scorpio and Primera?

at least it's good that there's two Smarts, the Astra is a works vehicle (pretty good choice too, environmentally / fuel-wise, especially if it's diesel), and the Alfa is a lightweight sporty type hatch most likely?

But if i am to be honest i'm also in a 3 car household right now (4, seeing as the VW hasn't been sold yet? ... 3 in use) .... my mothers, mine, and my brother's. We *could* easily car share, and often do (e.g. during the week, my place of work is only a small detour from mum's route*), it's just a lot of the time we have to go off in different directions and the public transport is less than convenient.

* recently i have done a fair bit of driving to work on my own - as she's been away in the states, and i was unable to quite get out in time to get on the right train... city driving i must say wasnt one of my favourite tasks and now is even less so, as it is so incredibly variable even compared to our rubbish train service... one day, i can get the 10 miles across town from a northern suburb to a south semi-central hospital in 25 minutes, actually beating the train... the next day... it takes twice as long and i'm late! being able to find clever shortcuts and skip out a large part of the lemming-parade traffic is a small joy, but still doesnt make it much less of a pain. the asians have the right idea - scooters, for inner city travel, and electric ones if the journeys you make are within it's range! (a 30mph top speed is more than you think, if you dont have to stop anywhere near so much).
Plus i've switched from a 850kg, 1000cc car to a 1100kg 1600cc at exactly the wrong time for such escapades... when going to a 700kg, 700cc smart would have been a far better idea.

Before this gets butt-achingly long again, another thing I've just spotted, on only BP filling stations so far but it may yet spread - they've (quite roughly!) pasted new titles over their "premium unleaded" and "city diesel" price sign-boards......... now they read regular unleaded and regular diesel. Now, this may be some ill-advised renaming, as the "regular" known in the USA and some parts of Europe is relatively low-octane stuff compared to the usual lowest grade available in the UK - 95 "RON" Premium.... odd, of course, to have Premium as the lowest grade, and Super (97 or 98 RON) as high, but it ensures and marks out that we are not actually buying that cheap stuff - Regular is usually supposed to be 93 RON, which should work in most UK engines without much trouble (power output may reduce in those with a knock sensor, or some slight pinking under load may occur in those that don't), particularly older ones (such as in the VW, whose engine was built to run on pretty much anything an impoverished east german farmer might put in the tank...)......... or, it may be lower, 91 RON is usual in the USA is it not? I've seen of it being as low as 89 RON e.g. in some Spanish places where all the cars line up for Super and all the scooters go for Regular.... running a modern car that expects Premium on Regular is going to lead to performance and possibly longevity problems.

Plus, the price didn't change when the "Regular" sticker went on.

I may well have to go in and ask about that, becuase it's not just that it's always been like that and i've only just noticed - the "regular" text is quite plainly a sticker that's been applied over the moulded /coloured plastic board, and without much skill either in a lot of places.

[flaninacupboard]

what are the Ford and Nissan, though? Fiesta and Micra (conceivably 5 seats..), or Scorpio and Primera?

at least it's good that there's two Smarts, the Astra is a works vehicle (pretty good choice too, environmentally / fuel-wise, especially if it's diesel), and the Alfa is a lightweight sporty type hatch most likely?

Urm...

1x 2 seat smart car. (only one, not two!)
1x 2 seat astra van. (yep, diesel. done over 500,000 miles.)
1x 5 seat ford (escort, 1.6)
1x 5 seat nissan (primera)
1x 5 seat alfa romeo (166. this thing is big.)
1x 2 seat ronart, racing car (with a V8 5.3L engine....)

[EddyH]

Hehe... ok, point made

For starters, I read the (2-) Seat Ronart as a Smart Roadster, just typo'd

So it's a three big car, one small car, two medium car/van family

Tip: Don't write them all with the seat numbers first next time, flanno. It got difficult trying to tell if you were on about various spanish VW knockoffs or not..

Is the Ronart for road use, or just a track day missile on a trailer?

I can't imagine even the biggest Alfa being as heavy or thirsty as the majority of american vehicles, or as nasty to drive. The italians simply wouldn't stand for it

500k miles? That's surely some kind of new record, can you prove it? I've seen high miler diesels before, but damn........ would you like my old Polo for free (for when the escort conks out)? You obviously know how to look after cars, or the driver of the van does anyway.... and it needs its piston rings sorted before i go crazy trying to sort the neccessary tools out.

And i guess driving a 1.6 astra i can't complain at a 1.6 escort. Except to say: See you at the lights... and then in the mirror! (test drove 1.6 escorts, they felt like didnt want to get out of bed - good job i resisted the initial suggestion of a 1.4...)

[MackemX]

jus came across this

Makes one think, and puts things in perspective.

Diet Snapple 16 oz $1.29 ......... $10.32 per gallon
Lipton Ice Tea 16 oz $1.19 ....... $ 9.52 per gallon
Gatorade 20 oz $1.59 ............. $10.17 per gallon
Ocean Spray 16 oz $1.25 ......... $10.00 per gallon
Brake Fluid 12 oz $3.15 ........... $33.60 per gallon
Vick's Nyquil 6 oz $8.35 ......... $178.13 per gallon
Pepto Bismol 4 oz $3.85 .......... $123.20 per gallon
Whiteout 7 oz $1.39 ............... $25.42 per gallon
Scope 1.5 oz $0.99 ................. $84.48 per gallon

and this is the REAL KICKER......

Evian water 9 oz for $1.49 ........ $21.19 per gallon.

(get me a beer please)

$21.19 FOR WATER! ....and the buyers don't even know the source.

So, the next time you're at the pump, be glad your car doesn't run on
water, Scope, or Whiteout, or God forbid, PEPTO BISMOL or NYQUIL!!!!

[pchan]

It demand > supply. Peak Oil is here. Most of the oil wells are drying up. No new discovery. Recent trend, rich oil companies are buying over smaller oil companies just for the oil wells. Shell revised down their inventory not just once but several times.

[ViRaL1]

jus came across this

Evian water 9 oz for $1.49 ........ $21.19 per gallon.

(get me a beer please)

$21.19 FOR WATER! ....and the buyers don't even know the source.

So, the next time you're at the pump, be glad your car doesn't run on
water, Scope, or Whiteout, or God forbid, PEPTO BISMOL or NYQUIL!!!!

EVIAN spelled bacwards is NAIVE.

[ChrisX]

The price of gas is a record here in Australia and going up.

It is US$3.50 a gallon or AUD$1.20 a liter as so expensive.

[enstg8er]

When was the last time a new oil refinery was built... 70's? 80's? That tells you something right there, doesn't it? The oil companies WANT these higher prices. It's no coincidence they all had their highest years of profit EVER last year.

contradictory. oil companies want higher prices? duh. they are restrained by competition. why don't they charge $5.00 a gallon? because you'll buy it cheaper acrss the street. they only sell at the price you will pay and they can afford. they are a business not a charity.

When was the last time a new oil refinery was built... 70's? 80's? That tells you something right there, doesn't it?
possibly. refineries can only be built be gov't issued permits. that represents the length of time the gov't banned the construction of refineries. in an exxon world they would have a dozen more refineries feeding lines of people buying $5 gas.

It demand > supply. Peak Oil is here. Most of the oil wells are drying up. No new discovery. Recent trend, rich oil companies are buying over smaller oil companies just for the oil wells. Shell revised down their inventory not just once but several times.

oil reserves are at an all time high. supply is restricted by many factors. gov't regulation- america, gov't ineptness- mexico, gov't instability, venezuela and most african, weather- gulf of mexico, market manipulation- opec, expensive- canada, corruption- russia, terrorism- iraq, access- azerbaijan......
companies buy out smaller companies because it is cheaper and more reliable than the other obstacles.

[shelbyGT]

I'm sorry, but I don't see competition like you speak of it. When was the last time you saw a gas station with a price match guarantee? No, they know they have an inelastic good and use that to their advantage. One station goes up 2 cents, so does the one down the street, etc. If he's making more, then why shouldn't I?
And how can you simply say there is no corollary between higher prices at the pump and Big Oil making the most money it's ever made in profit?

[enstg8er]

I'm sorry, but I don't see competition like you speak of it. When was the last time you saw a gas station with a price match guarantee? No, they know they have an inelastic good and use that to their advantage.

just because the price ghoes up doesn't mean there is no competition. gas is one of the rare commodities that you must purchase. this is different from cable tv. still, knowing you will buy, they haven't raised to $5. why? competition prohibits it. of course, they do take some advantage of this situation. in a capitalist, free market society all private business does.

One station goes up 2 cents, so does the one down the street, etc. If he's making more, then why shouldn't I?

why shouldn't they? if you don't like the station go elsewhere.

And how can you simply say there is no corollary between higher prices at the pump and Big Oil making the most money it's ever made in profit?

i never claimer that. in a supply and demand economy, the greater the demand to supply the greater the profit. take a baseball for example. there are tons of them sitting on the shelves waiting for a home. you can fin one for a coulpe of dollars anywhere. now consider the final out ball from the red sox world series. only one. lots of people want it. the price would be somewhat higher than a coupkle of dollars.

in the days of greater supply to demand, the prices were low and profits were likewise. recall that factored for inflation, gas is a bargain over the years. complaining about oil company profits will do little to offer you cheaper gas. four things will impact your cost- 1) less use (unlikely with developing countries like china and india) 2) more supply (environmental concerns hamper this domestically) 3) more stable production market ( this is iffy, it is difficult to stabilize every foreign produceer) 4) restrained government ( less tax, regulation, mandated formulas and such).

[Sportster Freak]

http://wcco.com/localnews/local_story_099161018.html

[shelbyGT]

still, knowing you will buy, they haven't raised to $5. why? competition prohibits it.

Wrong, laws prohibit that. On 9/11 gas stations all across the U.S. were selling at $4-$5 per gallon. These stations had to then refund the difference in price or get hammered with other fines.

The whole situation is playing on fear and fear alone. Yes, I realize the price/barrel has gone up. But, I think we can factor fear into that equation as well.

edit - please be aware, my beef is not with the particular station operator/owner. They have very little control over what they sell it for and don't make the biggest % of their income from it. It's with their suppliers/refiners/wellers etc etc...

[flaninacupboard]

Hehe... ok, point made

For starters, I read the (2-) Seat Ronart as a Smart Roadster, just typo'd

So it's a three big car, one small car, two medium car/van family

Tip: Don't write them all with the seat numbers first next time, flanno. It got difficult trying to tell if you were on about various spanish VW knockoffs or not..

Is the Ronart for road use, or just a track day missile on a trailer?

I can't imagine even the biggest Alfa being as heavy or thirsty as the majority of american vehicles, or as nasty to drive. The italians simply wouldn't stand for it

500k miles? That's surely some kind of new record, can you prove it? I've seen high miler diesels before, but damn........ would you like my old Polo for free (for when the escort conks out)? You obviously know how to look after cars, or the driver of the van does anyway.... and it needs its piston rings sorted before i go crazy trying to sort the neccessary tools out.

And i guess driving a 1.6 astra i can't complain at a 1.6 escort. Except to say: See you at the lights... and then in the mirror! (test drove 1.6 escorts, they felt like didnt want to get out of bed - good job i resisted the initial suggestion of a 1.4...)

Apparently a '66 volvo has done over 2,000,000 miles
http://www.is-it-a-lemon.com/make/volvo/high.htm
but yes, it is a high mileage. all the way to the moon and back.....
The owner has been a mechanic for over thirty years, so he's kept it in good shape. it's only a 1995 model, he did most of the miles end of the nineties doing courier work (crazy workload. he would go from the midlands to london, to glasgow, to the midlands to cardiff in a day! even did a few trips to the continent.)

The ronart is actually not qute complete - it's a kit car. it's supposed to be done by this summer (it was also supposed to be done by last summer...) but will indeed go on the road. not very practical, as it has no roof. or radio. or door locks. or a boot.

[glockjs]

screw smuggling drugs into the country, im gonna start smuggling oil and gas

[zzyzzx]

When you think about it, every time you buy something made in China, you help raise the price of gas. Really.

[shelbyGT]

I'm turning Amish, screw all this!

[glockjs]

i got some funny comic strips i'll post later. but yeah. prices are getting stupid. BUT, nobody is making fun of me driving a saturn anymore....suuuuckers

[ChrisX]

I'm turning Amish, screw all this!

You can ride a horse or ride a bicycle to work.

[glockjs]

[flaninacupboard]

Wow, that's a lot of cartoon based whining.

stiiiillll $5.70 a gallon here.

[enstg8er]

Gas prices are at record highs again. Many think oil companies are to blame. In fact, a May 2004 poll showed that 77 percent of Californians believed this to be true. However, this just shows the media have failed to properly inform people about who's causing high gas prices.

One thing is certain: oil companies are not to blame for high gas prices. These companies are responsible for producing the gasoline we need. In California, where gas prices are among the nation's highest, the oil industry has been repeatedly investigated to find evidence of "price manipulation" and none has ever been found.

http://www.signonsandiego.com/uniontrib/20050411/news_mz1e11simpso.html

Wrong, laws prohibit that. On 9/11 gas stations all across the U.S. were selling at $4-$5 per gallon. These stations had to then refund the difference in price or get hammered with other fines.

price gouging laws. these are most common after natural disasters (like the florida hurricanes recently) that saw necessities such as hotel rooms, water, building supplies.... see instant price inflation. if the holiday inn wanted to raise its rated to $300 a night today, the law wouldn't care. it would let the supply and demand handle it.

http://wcco.com/localnews/local_story_099161018.html

anti-dumping laws. mostly these laws are used to keep someone from taking losses to capture a monopoly on the market.

[shelbyGT]

I can read the same papers you do. Perhaps I am just a conspiracy theorist, who knows. However, the price fluxes we've seen from one year to the next are not, in my mind, out of "someone's" hands to stop. I still say the industry is playing on people's fears and are not doing enough to try and curb the tide of raising prices.
I've said my peace.

[flaninacupboard]

oil companies make billions in profit. i think they can afford to lower their prices a little..... or a lot.

But then G.W's retirement fund would be gone....

[shelbyGT]

http://money.cnn.com/2005/04/12/markets/oil.reut/index.htm

Light crude for May delivery finished $1.85 lower at $51.86 a barrel, after Monday's 39-cent rise that had ended a week-long losing streak. In London, Brent crude closed $1.61 lower at $51.98 a barrel.

Prices are down more than 9 percent from last week's all-time high of $58.28.

Funny, the prices at the pump haven't gone down 9% from last week!

[pchan]

Given time, it may reach $100 per barrel. There is simply not enough supply to meet growing demand for crude oil. There is not conspiracy. If there is, President Bush can easily open up the strategic reserve floodgate. Congressman Roscoe Bartlett presented to Congress about peak oil.
http://www.energybulletin.net/5080.html

[enstg8er]

I still say the industry is playing on people's fears

the industry plays on their own fears. they buy oil on the speculative market and sell accordingly. when it appears there will be reduced production either because opec announces a cutback, or russia seizes control of their oil compaany or storms strike offshore rigs, they speculate the cost to obtain oil will rise. they raise the cost at the pump. when it appears there will be a glut they spculate the price will drop but hold the price until they are sure it has before they pass it down to retailers.

this speculation has become very specialized. many fund managers pay top dollar for weather experts to advise on weather forcasts. as an example- they forcast several hurricanes hitting the us coast next year. using the data, the fund manager buys heavily into home depot stock. if the storms hit, rebuilding supplies reach high demand. home depot stock rises accordingly and the fund manager smiles.

are not doing enough to try and curb the tide of raising prices.

i think they can afford to lower their prices a little..... or a lot.

both are true. they could be equally responsive to surplusses and shortages. to do so would be a gamble with profits and no one has taken the lead. much like airline fares, if one announced price cuts, others would quickly follow.

[pchan]

One thing for sure, oil rig and drill makers reaping profits and lead time for parts are more than 12 months. Becuase, at this price, even the low yield wells are profitable.

The fact is crude oil supply is finite. Consumption will increase as the cars and human population increase. When will crude oil supply runs.. that's debatable.

Crude oil and natural gas statistic.
http://www.eia.doe.gov/oil_gas/petroleum/info_glance/resources.html