Content vs. Come-On

[AlecWest]

Last night, I set my PVR150 up to capture the ABC News special with Peter Jennings, "UFOs: Seeing Is Believing." It was a 2-hour program. But, when I snipped out all the commercials, I was left with a one-hour twenty-seven minute show ... meaning that 33 minutes during that two-hour timeslot were dedicated to commercial time (a near 3:1 ratio of content to come-on). And, I've found that ratio is true of other shows on network shows.

Just for my info, I'm wondering if this is something under regulation ... if there is any kind of limit to commercial time during a given program. Or, are networks given a free hand to see how much commercial time they can "get away with" during any program? Also, I'm curious if this ratio is better or worse that ratios in other countries (outside the U.S.).

[housepig]

that's only slightly worse than most prime-time half-hour or hour shows (23 and 46 minutes of program, respectively).

I don't know how much regulation there is - how would the infomercial channels work? a solid 60 minutes of paid advertising, every hour on the hour...

[AlecWest]

I don't know how much regulation there is - how would the infomercial channels work? a solid 60 minutes of paid advertising, every hour on the hour...

Good question. But, I was referring primarily to the alphabet networks (CBS, NBC, ABC, FOX, UPN) as opposed to cable-only channels. I imagine cable-only channels can get away with a lot more.

[reboot]

There is some regulation. I think, in Canada, there can only be x number of minutes of advertising per hour, and x number of times the station MUST display a station ident of some sort. I forget what the numbers are.

[bugster]

There is certainly regulation in the UK as to how much time can be used for advertising on the 5 main terrestial channels, not sure about Sattelite or cable only channels. One problem though, promos for other programmes on the same channel or other 'services' offered by the channel operator such as interactive or program guides etc do not count as Advertising and this takes up quite a chunk of the time available. I don't think we have quite as bad a 'Come-on' to 'content' ratio as the US, but it seems to be getting closer.

Long live PVR's.
I have Sky+ PVR and most of the TV I watch is recorded on this. This means I can FF the Ads and watch what I want, when I want. I don't watch 'live' TV very often these days.

[doppletwo]

Just for my info, I'm wondering if this is something under regulation ... if there is any kind of limit to commercial time during a given program. Or, are networks given a free hand to see how much commercial time they can "get away with" during any program?

There only rules for this in the USA are for childrens programing.

The rules limit not only the amount of commercials, but also the commercials cannot be for the what ever the program is.

That second rule I mentioned is called the "He-Man Rule", because parents complained that children couldn't tell which parts were commercials and which parts were the actual show.

[housepig]

But, I was referring primarily to the alphabet networks (CBS, NBC, ABC, FOX, UPN) as opposed to cable-only channels.

I know - I think that aside from the children's programming issues, there's more self-regulation rather than outside regulation. It's also a balance of profit - if ABC could make the same money from advertisers by showing a test pattern for 46 minutes out of every hour, they'd do it.

[flaninacupboard]

It's nice watching on the non-commercial channels over here. Hour shows like ER, Xfiles, Stargate etc are 45 minutes.

[lordsmurf]

Stargate is only a 42-43 min show. Uncut.

[AlecWest]

One problem though, promos for other programmes on the same channel or other 'services' offered by the channel operator such as interactive or program guides etc do not count as Advertising and this takes up quite a chunk of the time available.

That kind of crap is common in the U.S. now (didn't used to be). For years, I'd gotten comfortable watching the ending credits of a show or film roll by ... to see if I could recognize certain actors and such. But now, at the ends of shows/films, almost every network "squinches" the ending credits into a tiny box, removes its sound, and fills the rest of the screen (and speakers) with promos of upcoming shows on the same network/channel. God, I HATE that! It's just as bad as DJs on radio stations who "talk over" the beginnings and ends of songs. Sigh. I guess that's the price for "free" entertainment nowadays.

[yoda313]

One problem though, promos for other programmes on the same channel or other 'services' offered by the channel operator such as interactive or program guides etc do not count as Advertising and this takes up quite a chunk of the time available.

That kind of crap is common in the U.S. now (didn't used to be). For years, I'd gotten comfortable watching the ending credits of a show or film roll by ... to see if I could recognize certain actors and such. But now, at the ends of shows/films, almost every network "squinches" the ending credits into a tiny box, removes its sound, and fills the rest of the screen (and speakers) with promos of upcoming shows on the same network/channel. God, I HATE that! It's just as bad as DJs on radio stations who "talk over" the beginnings and ends of songs. Sigh. I guess that's the price for "free" entertainment nowadays.

Hello,

DUDE! I HATE THE SAME THING!!!!!

Remember when shows used to make music for the ENDING of the show too????? Or like they'd have a special title screen or stills from the show....

I mean how desperate are they for ad revenue that they push to the last millisecond?????

And I HATE POP UP LOGOS!!!!! Those damn animated "preview" popups are annoying as hell.....

It forces you to buy the dvds.... Because your tapes are so screwed by the onscreen clutter....

Kevin

[Shadow57]

I mean how desperate are they for ad revenue that they push to the last millisecond?????

Kevin

That sentence sums it all up.

In the 60's there was a 1 or 2 second pause between the
program and the commercial. Today the commercial starts
in the next frame, so 1/30 of a second pause.

Sometimes the commercials and programs are blended into
one big mess that runs 24/7. The Benny Hill show is a good example.
It's hard to figure out where the show ends and the ad begins.

Dave

[Roundabout]

DUDE! I HATE THE SAME THING!!!!!

Remember when shows used to make music for the ENDING of the show too????? Or like they'd have a special title screen or stills from the show....

I mean how desperate are they for ad revenue that they push to the last millisecond?????

And I HATE POP UP LOGOS!!!!! Those damn animated "preview" popups are annoying as hell.....

Kevin

And shows like Malcom in the Middle, which I've noticed in reruns on Fox, don't even play the intro theme at all. All they show is one frame of the intro and three words of the theme song "Life is unfair....."

Not that I really care that much about that theme song, but it exemplifies how the entire industry is going. On shows like CSI and NCIS, there's the short intro, but what I hate is the producer credits, etc. go into the show as much as five minutes (with a credit appearing at the bottom of the screen every few seconds seemingly forever). They do this so they don't have to waste any time at the end of the program showing credits. Since they know they will eventually be "squished" like AlecWest mentioned, the credits are still seen.

Between all that, and the pop up ads after every commercial, and the commercials themselves, there isn't much show left to see. Every year it gets worse, too. It started with the network "ghost logos" at the bottom of the screen (which I saw in Europe long before it appeared in the USA, and unfortunately we copied them) until now some of the pop up ads obliterate the bottom third of the screen for several seconds. And the time the stay on screen seems to get longer and longer too.

One wonders where it will all lead to - and how much worse it can get.

[yoda313]

Hello,

One wonders where it will all lead to - and how much worse it can get.

Just look at any of the cable news channels - ugh.... Not a pretty picture - no video anymore just globs of text and logos....

Kevin

[lordsmurf]

I must be getting "videohelp" old. I've seen this rant at least 2-3 times in the past.

[yoda313]

I must be getting "videohelp" old. I've seen this rant at least 2-3 times in the past.

Hello,

Yeah but it still bugs the hell out of us.....



Kevin

[Shadow57]

I must be getting "videohelp" old. I've seen this rant at least 2-3 times in the past.

It's called a re-run.....just like on TV!

[yoda313]

Hello,

That is funny!

Though maybe it should be called a "RERANT"

Kevin

[northcat_8]

I'm trying to remember "exactly" here but we use to have 10 ft satalite dish (until lightning hit it ) and I had a chipped receiver board so I didn't pay for programming. (yea it was illegal, spare me the surmon).

But one of the cool things (other than free pRon channels) was that on some satelites you could catch the programming going out the regional affiliates. Of course the show itself was taped but instead of commercials the show would fade to black, then have a still image that said "insert national commercials" then the show would resume. Then after that segment there would be "insert local commercials". The stills were on the screen for 10 seconds or so, enough for TV stations to splice in the commercials. I'll still see them every once in a while on network TV if the producer naps at the controls and doesn't stop tape on time.

There are 2 commercial breaks in a 30 minute program and 3 in a 60 minute program. The first commercial break is the shortest and the last one is the longest.

I use to know the exact time (minutes into the program) of the commercial breaks. It's slightly different for every program.

Sadly, I had my illegal satelite dish before DVD burners came out...actually before DVDs were out so it was a ways back.

[AlecWest]

It's nice watching on the non-commercial channels over here. Hour shows like ER, Xfiles, Stargate etc are 45 minutes.

Just curious. Are shows over there on a "45 minute" schedule ... or do they schecule it as a one-hour show and insert "filler" programming at the end of a show (public interest type programming) to complete the hour?

[yoda313]

Hello,

I'm trying to remember "exactly" here but we use to have 10 ft satalite dish (until lightning hit it ) and I had a chipped receiver board so I didn't pay for programming. (yea it was illegal, spare me the surmon).

Don't worry - looks like someone UPSTAIRS already took care of the punishment

Kevin

[Roundabout]

Don't worry - looks like someone UPSTAIRS already took care of the punishment

Classic!

(BTW: I'm guilty of some rerants (great word) myself, I know :P

But like we said, it just gets worse and worse every year. Just when you think they can't add any more crap to the program, there's more. Like Yoda said, the news channels are so bad that you can't hardly see the news anymore. The only defense is watching the (usually very dull) NewsHour on PBS, at least there's no commercials during the program and they spend more than 30 seconds on a story. I'm no fan of PBS, but, at this point, often I end up watching the NewsHour if I want more info about a big story.

Maybe someday there'll be an option (with all the digital possibilities, it could happen) of getting network programs without all that, by paying a fee, just like HBO (and unedited too, as a bonus). If it's not too expensive, I'd pay something just to not have to suffer all the garbage that they overlay on the screen, and to not have commercials.

/rerant 8)

[yoda313]

Don't worry - looks like someone UPSTAIRS already took care of the punishment

Classic!

(BTW: I'm guilty of some rerants (great word) myself, I know :P

But like we said, it just gets worse and worse every year. Just when you think they can't add any more crap to the program, there's more. Like Yoda said, the news channels are so bad that you can't hardly see the news anymore. The only defense is watching the (usually very dull) NewsHour on PBS, at least there's no commercials during the program and they spend more than 30 seconds on a story. I'm no fan of PBS, but, at this point, often I end up watching the NewsHour if I want more info about a big story.

Maybe someday there'll be an option (with all the digital possibilities, it could happen) of getting network programs without all that, by paying a fee, just like HBO (and unedited too, as a bonus). If it's not too expensive, I'd pay something just to not have to suffer all the garbage that they overlay on the screen, and to not have commercials.

/rerant 8)

Hello,

THANKS

I like that two compliments in one post! (rerant and the jab at northcat ).

Kevin

[offline]

Come to Ozstralia! Here the free to air stations
are self-regulated and there are only 3 commercial
networks with a stranglehold on the entire market.

You often sit down to a series of ads with some
movie in it or a half hour show reduced to 18 minutes plus "information breaks".

[Conquest10]

And shows like Malcom in the Middle, which I've noticed in reruns on Fox, don't even play the intro theme at all. All they show is one frame of the intro and three words of the theme song "Life is unfair....."

You'd be surprised if you watch an episode of the Simpsons then flip on the DVD and see how much actually gets cut off in syndication.

[Faustus]

Here in Dallas we have our own local "Howard Stern like" radio guy who does drive time radio. I say howard stern like because the guy in question is actually really funny.

Anyway the program is a smash hit and has been for years. Here is the problem. I think it might just be half commercials at this point. ITS THAT BAD. I'm not making this up, I've seen a 20min commercial break at some points in the show, then it seems ike they are back on for 10 min, then in commercials for another 10-15 making the last one seem short in comparison.

How stupid is that? I have my XM radio no, commercials be damned. What TV I watch in on my PVR so I skip those also. I can no longer stand TV in realtime.

[lordsmurf]

Russ Martin? Sometimes yes, sometimes no. It almost seems like commercials breaks and length depends on how the disc jockey feels that day.

[Faustus]

Russ Martin?

That would be the guy.

[AlecWest]

You'd be surprised if you watch an episode of the Simpsons then flip on the DVD and see how much actually gets cut off in syndication.

This might be the start of a trend ... taking programs fit to certain timeslots for commercial purposes and "re-editing" them (abridged version?) to allow for even more commercials. And, I wonder how long it will be before the current 3:1 ratio of content to commercials becomes 2:1 (or worse, 1:1). How much is the alphabet-channel watcher willing to put up with before "broadcast" TV dies under its own weight?

[glockjs]

for some reason i think adult swim has less than the normal amount of commercials. but it could just be in my head