dv camcorder to vcd

[daamon]

Good plan... Just in case.

[burnman99]

Actually, contrary to the stereotype, they've got a fair amount of decent beers here...

Yeah, we keep all the decent beers to ourselves. The stereotype is Fosters and XXXX - the reality is, we export most of them to the Brits & Yanks because they taste like shit. No-one drinks them over here ... bar a few people up pac's way ...

I'd have to agree with the above. I had Swan lager in Australia before and it beats the pants off of Fosters. Alas, there is nowhere near here that sells it. I like NewCastle from UK but i'm sure the real version is much better than the import.

Have fun stormin' the castle!

Rog

[daamon]

I like NewCastle from UK but i'm sure the real version is much better than the import.

Well, having only had the original (Brown Ale) - and in Newcastle - I can't really say much about the import... Apart from I'd put money on agreeing with you!!!

[Josef K]

I can't really say much about the import... Apart from I'd put money on agreeing with you!!!

I live a short drive/bus ride/walk away from Newcastle and all I have to say about Brown Ale is YUCK! Some things just don't get better the closer to home they are.

[daamon]

Some things just don't get better the closer to home they are.

Except Guinness...

[Josef K]

Except Guinness...

True... I did say some things...

[tmh]

This one seems to be dragging on too long. What did you use to convert the WMM DV AVI type 1 file to type 2? I use DVDate which is a tiny little program that does a fine job for me. As a type 2, it should be bery easy to finish the job. What codec does the AVI file show (gspot)?

Maybe you should try DIKO or The Film machine to convert. TMPGenc is a bit more complicated but once you master it will give better results.

[dmcg501]

ok checked with gspot,

*once I have added the transitions gspot says this file is a non avi file of type unknown.

*I then checked the unedited file just after it had been imported into wmm ( ie just before I added transitions ) gspot says it is a multipart open dml avi.

Can anyone solve this?

I feel a bit stupid but as Ive said Iam a beginer and a lot of this is still very confusing yet.
Thanks again

[dmcg501]

ps im using dv converter

[burnman99]

dmcg, it seems that tmpgenc doesn't like the transitions added by wmm. You may want to try them with another program like avisynth (Don't think vdub can do transitions but not sure).

Good Luck!

Rog

[daamon]

Hi dmcg501,

Here's what I've done as a trial, coz this is puzzling and shouldn't be happening.

1. Captured from my DV cam using WinDV to Type 2 DV AVI.

2. Used both AVICodec and the beta version of GSpot to get file details (note the 90% quality):

(Don't worry if your four letter code for the codec is different to "dvsd" - that means my DV AVI was shot by a Sony. Post yours, just in case...)





3. Loaded the original DV AVI file into Windows Movie Maker (v2.1.4026.0). Dragged the video onto the timeline and saved as a "DV-PAL" file.

4. Again, used both AVICodec and the beta version of GSpot to get file details (note the 50% quality):





5. Added a transition to the timeline and saved as a "DV-PAL" file.

6. Again, used both AVICodec and the beta version of GSpot to get file details (note, still the 50% quality):





7. In turn, loaded the original DV AVI clip, the WMM DV AVI clip (without transition) and the WMM DV AVI clip (with transition) into TMPGEnc.

Each clip previewed OK and encoded OK. No errors, no problems. Here's my "Environment Settings" in TMPGEnc (v2.52.34.129):




Copy my TMPGEnc settings (don't worry about the "QuickTime Movie Reader" setting - shouldn't have an impact), and follow my steps to the letter and see how you get on.

As an aside: I'm not sure what the "Quality: 90% / 50%" is actually referring to, but I doubt a quality of 50% is a good thing compared to 90%. Maybe someone can enlighten me / us?

[dmcg501]

EUREKA!!!

Thanks Daamon, Ive found whats wrong. i didnt know what AVIcodec or GSpot were till u suggested them.

I now understand where all the disk space goes on these movie files, as i went thro all the proccess with my clip I did not realised how many copy files were being made.

Not being sure of what I was doing i saved everything when prompted. When u finish putting transitions in in wmm it askes if u want to sav as wmm project. I said yes and saved it.

As i was going to convert in TMPGEnc Im trying to find the file with the transitions in it, logically to me i go for the one with the wmm icon on it with the appropriate file name.

The reason TEMPGEnc couldnt open it is because I was trying to open the wrong file ie a wmmproject file. Anyway got there now.

Am i right in thinking this is why some people prefer frame serving as it saves all these temp files

I hope all the other users out there do appreciate that trying to learn this complex and varied subject is awkward enough if you are a computer professional but if you are computer illiterate like myself even the simplest of things can trip u up.

Anyway not to get too serious, did anyone know about the 90%/50% thing
as the quality could b a bit better. Then again methinks I had better come back to playing about with that in a few days time as she who must be obeyed thinks I hav been on the pc too much in the past few weeks.

Daamon thanks again mate you are a gentleman, if it wasnt for your help i would hav given up days ago.

[daamon]

EUREKA!!!

Thanks Daamon, Ive found whats wrong. i didnt know what AVIcodec or GSpot were till u suggested them.

The reason TEMPGEnc couldnt open it is because I was trying to open the wrong file ie a wmmproject file. Anyway got there now.

No problem.

I admire your honesty - still, if you don't know it's wrong then it's easily done. That's how we learn... Glad you're OK now.

I now understand where all the disk space goes on these movie files, as i went thro all the proccess with my clip I did not realised how many copy files were being made.

Am i right in thinking this is why some people prefer frame serving as it saves all these temp files

Every time you create a transition and render it, an appropriate file is created for each transition. These files will be in DV AVI and, as you've noticed, will build up quite quickly.

This happens whether you frameserve or not. However, you're close to the truth. Instead of then saving the wjole project to a DV AVI file, people frameserve - this bypasses the need for taking up even more diskspace because the whole project isn't saved as a DV AVI.

Anyway not to get too serious, did anyone know about the 90%/50% thing
as the quality could b a bit better.

I too would be interested to know what an impact this has...

Daamon thanks again mate you are a gentleman, if it wasnt for your help i would hav given up days ago.

Hey, don't forget the others...

[dmcg501]

Ihave now aquired a copy of pinnacle v8,can anyone give me their opinion of how the quality of my finished movies would differ, time involved, HD space used etc on dvd using both methods,

ie 1. using pinnacle for whole project and
2. using separate software ( windv, virtualdub, TEMPGEnc, and TEMPGEnc dvd author )

many thanks

[daamon]

Using Pinnacle v8...

1. Quality - I've not used it, so can't fully comment, but I'd say that it won't be any better than using separates.

Others are of the opinion (as am I, though have never done a comparison but it makes sense to me) that "all-in-ones" produce lesser quality because they don't allow as much flexibility and are "Jack of all trades" (i.e. average) - especially the encoding.

Whereas, using separate tools (where each is dedicated and only focussed on it's specific function) means that the output from each tool is better before it's used as an input to the next tool.

2. Time involved - Using an "all-in-one" is quicker to learn, quicker to get to final DVD etc.

For spearate tools, you have to learn each one, go through pain and mistakes with each one, and (thinking of the encoding here) because they allow greater flexibility and options can take (sometimes much) longer to produce their ouput (I'm thinking 2-pass VBR with filters in TMPEnc as an example).

3. HD space - Not much difference between the two I'd say (can't think of anything that would differentiate).

All I'd say is to make sure you clear out all the files used during the process - for either method - whe nyou're sure you don't need them. Then defrag the HDD.


4. Summary - Basically, it's a trade off of quality vs time. You'll be hard pushed to get excellent quality in a short time.

And "quality" is subjective - what you like may not be what someone else likes. Try both methods on a sample clip (30 mins minimum is good) and decide...

Try to have fast scenes, zooms, light and dark etc. in the clip - to best "excercise" the software.

Hope that helps...

[dmcg501]

Cheers Daamon

that helps and gives me a good start. I'll get on with it now and get some more of these tapes done.

ps what happened to your team in the cricket

[daamon]

No problem - Keep us posted...

ps what happened to your team in the cricket

I don't follow cricket to be honest, just what I catch on the news... If you mean the Aussie team, I thought they were doing good?

If you mean England, last I heard they were doing well too... What happened?

Here's a clue as to my nationality and preference of game...





Where are you? (Hint: Update your profile...)

[dmcg501]

Sorry forgot to ask, i've now got the hang of the basics of virtual dub, I was cutting a long clip today ( 62min) I got about half way thro and had to leave it. I saved as avi, anyway I did the other half later and noticed on the video tab the "compress" option had a look at it, thought theres a good idea, sweated a bit, thought about all that editing I had done!, sweated a bit more, thought about loosing all that editing I had done if I made a tit of it, then thought if I dont try things Im never going to learn so I compresed it to panasonisc dv.

Now not being too sure what I was doing i noticed later on that the uncompressed file was 3mins long but 5.41GB??? ( I thought one of the other guys here said to me video would use 178MB/min?) and the one I had compressed was 20min long but 4.1GB

1. Was I doing the right thing trying to compress the file

2. Why as much as 5.41GB has it saved all the cuts as well

3. Anyone know of any forums where i can get advice on using my camcorder better?

Yes I did notice the English Rose and the fact you were a cockney and my razor sharp mind quickly deducted you were............................Australian
Where r u from in London, I stayed there 4 10yrs, mostly Ealing and Romford.

BTW I also left a little clue on my original post of my origins

Cheers

[daamon]

Hi dmcg501,

1. Yes. And, what's more, you used the right codec (a DV one). See, you are picking things up...

2. No - That's pure, totally uncompressed AVI. It's HUGE!!!

DV AVI is approx. 13.5 GB per hour.

3. Try www.camcorderinfo.com - it's a good site. Also, this recent post of mine might have some useful tips in there for you - especially the ones early on, on shooting the footage.

Yes I did notice the English Rose and the fact you were a cockney and my razor sharp mind quickly deducted you were............................Australian

Nicely done...!!!

I was born in Poplar, within earshot of Bow bells - so a proper Cockney - unlike those wannabe "geezers" and "wide boys" of Romford, which is in Essex!!! Ealing's OK - that falls within London's boundaries...

I moved away when I was 10 down to near Gatwick Airport. I then went further south to the great City of Brighton before making the fantastic move to Melbourne in July 04.

Yes, I remember now, every time I revisit this post I get a faint whiff of whiskey and "sweaty socks"!!!

P.S. It's gonna reach 30C here today, with 37C forecast for tomorrow. How's Scotland? I heard about that flood in Carlisle on the news - nightmare!!!

[dmcg501]

The weather here is PANTS! The golf course has been shut for 3 weeks and I cant get playing

I tried to go back into the file I didnt compress in virtual dub and tried to compress it but nothing happend!

1. Is it poss to compress this file after I have already saved it as avi??

2. I now have this one dv tape split into two clips as I said earlier, one of 5.41GB and one of 4.1GB am I resigned to having to save on 2 or 3 dvds or is there some way of keeping the original tape together?

thanks again

[daamon]

No golf = More VideoHelp...

1. Yes. Set the "Compression" to a DV Codec - Panasonic DV Codec works well. Then, under "Video", set to "Full Processing Mode". Then "Save As AVI...".

Don't overwrite the original, save to a new filename. This will give you a DV AVI.

2. Once you've recompressed both files to DV AVIs (use the same codec), you can join them in VirtualDub:

Open the first file. The File -> Append Segment using the second file as the one to "Append".

Under "Video", set to "Direct Stream Copy" and save as before.

This will retain the DV AVI status ("Direct Stream Copy") as opposed to using any settings you've made ("Full Processing Mode"), like codecs or filters etc.

Note: You may get an error or warning message saying can't append coz framerates differ. The framerates have to be identical - I got the error once and the framerates were 24.9996 and 24.9993. Yes, it's that picky.

This is easily solved - for both clips, use VirtualDub to change the framerate. Set it to 25fps (as you're in PAL-land). They may not come out to exactly 25fps, but they'll be extremely close and, more importantly, the same.


From there, you can take you're single DV AVI, encode to DVD compliant MPEG2 and author to DVD.

Hope that helps.

[dmcg501]

Wow! I cant believe how much the file compresses. If only I knew how many MB were in aGB

Unfortunately the two files when joined will b 4.77GB and Ive still 2 do transitions yet. Does that mean I cant put the movie on one dvd?

1. is there a way round this

2. When I save the transitions does that mean I am going to save another 5GB file?

IM ok now for disk space I had a 120GB slave drive fitted today as it was getting near the bone.

thanks again

[daamon]

Hi dmcg501,

Surprising isn't it...?

Go ahead and do all your transitions etc. Save back to DV AVI. You'll be OK getting it to DVD, see below.

If you want to use something other than WMM, check these out.

Q1: Yes. DVDs, although they have VOBs etc., are in fact MPEG2 files, menus, etc. all rolled up into those VOBS.

To get your AVI to DVD compliant MPEG2 (see "What Is... DVD" for specs, if you're interested) you need to encode it.

Once encoded, you then need to author the MPEG2 - this means adding menus (if you want to) and creating the VOBs etc. Then burn and watch.

There are numerous tools that do this, but I use TMPGEnc Plus. I think it's time to introduce you to this post of mine as you're about to start down that road...

2. Yes. You'll have your source files (clips). You'll then create transitions (which, themselves, will be stored as small files) and then saved the finished article into a new DV AVI file.

Additional HDD - Good.

[funkguy4]

cce yoh, cce
just my two cents....i'm ex-TMPGEnc....too damn slow