DV transfer (capture) poor quality problem

[daamon]

@ Flight13 - Did you reboot the PC?

[edDV]

edDV wrote:-

Transfer it back from the disk to the camcorder and see if you see a difference in a A B comparison on an attached monitor.

Can't do that as my DV JVC is out only.

I have never heard of a camcorder with a "out only" IEEE-1394 port. What model JVC is this?

[Flight13]

I was looking for something that said Panasonic but I think it's under Matsushita Electric Industrial as DVSD (pdvcodec.dll).
Now that I found it, how do I make the capture software use it?

[meridklt]

I have never heard of a camcorder with a "out only" IEEE-1394 port. What model JVC is this?

It's a miniDV JVC GR-D60 - handbook says only the a miniDV JVC GR-D70 is out and in.


Well daamon,

Have dl the Panasonic DV Codec - installed as example - rebooted - used DV10 and Premier 6.5 to capture - and get same poor result.

Ran AVIcodec and I now have an extra codec
dvsd;DV Video for Windows Driver;2, 64, 1119, 1600;Matsushita Electric Industrial Co., Ltd.;C:\WINDOWS\SYSTEM\pdvcodec.dll

Both files in AVIcodec say once again:-
V. codec name is 'Sony Digital Video' – A. 1 codec name is 'PCM'

[daamon]

@ edDV - That's standard in Europe. The taxation on video recording equipment (as in recording an input, not optical recording) is higher than video playback only. If a DV cam has the ability to record from an input (as you're expecting) then it's liable for higher taxation.

Manufacturers block the ability to record from an input to keep the price to the consumer lower.

@ Flight13 - "Matsushita Electric Industrial" is another name for Panasonic. As for getting your capture software to use it... Nope, sorry, my crystal ball can't tell what you're using to capture...

If it's the only DV codec installed, it'll be used by default. If it's not then maybe some software will allow you to configure it, maybe some won't.

[Flight13]

@ Flight13 - "Matsushita Electric Industrial" is another name for Panasonic. As for getting your capture software to use it... Nope, sorry, my crystal ball can't tell what you're using to capture... wink.gif

Probably would help. I posted all the software I'm trying in another thread.
So far I've tried these...WinDV, Vegas Movie Studio trial, UleadVideoStudio, PowerProducer, NeroVision and MS Movie Maker. I can't find a way to change the codec in any of these.

[daamon]

I have never heard of a camcorder with a "out only" IEEE-1394 port. What model JVC is this?

It's a miniDV JVC GR-D60 - handbook says only the a miniDV JVC GR-D70 is out and in.

See my reply (above) to edDV. That's normal for European cams.

Have dl the Panasonic DV Codec - installed as example - rebooted - used DV10 and Premier 6.5 to capture - and get same poor result.

That, to me, only leaves the card at fault. Either poorly seated (not physically in properly) or faulty. Have you tried the un-install / re-install? (Sorry, I can't remember...)

Ran AVIcodec and I now have an extra codec
dvsd;DV Video for Windows Driver;2, 64, 1119, 1600;Matsushita Electric Industrial Co., Ltd.;C:\WINDOWS\SYSTEM\pdvcodec.dll

"Matsushita Electric Industrial Co., Ltd." is another name for Panasonic. It installed OK.

Both files in AVIcodec say once again:-
V. codec name is 'Sony Digital Video' – A. 1 codec name is 'PCM'

They will say that - As per comment earlier in thread, the video is encoded by the camera and so no surprise a Sony camera will use a Sony DV codec.

[daamon]

@ Flight13 - Is it the only DV codec?

If not, and you're happy to do so, uninstall other DV codecs leaving only the Panasonic one.

Note: Do so at your own risk and understand the implications of removing codecs:

1. Software using them may be affected.
2. You may not be able to reinstall them.
3. You may need to re-install software to re-install the codec.

[Flight13]

I believe it's the only one but I don't really know what I'm looking for. Here's my list from AVIcodec under video(there's other stuff listed under DirectShow and DirectX Media):
cvid;Cinepak® Codec;1.10.0.11;Radius Inc.;C:\WINDOWS\system32\iccvid.dll
dvsd;DV Video for Windows Driver;2, 64, 1119, 1600;Matsushita Electric Industrial Co., Ltd.;C:\WINDOWS\system32\pdvcodec.dll
geox;Geovision(R) Codec;6, 0, 0, 0;Geovision;C:\WINDOWS\system32\GeoCodec.dll
i420;Microsoft H.263 ICM Driver;5.1.2600.2180;Microsoft Corporation;C:\WINDOWS\system32\msh263.drv
iv31;Ligos Indeo® Video 3.2;3.24.15.04;Ligos Corporation;C:\WINDOWS\system32\ir32_32.dll
iv32;Ligos Indeo® Video 3.2;3.24.15.04;Ligos Corporation;C:\WINDOWS\system32\ir32_32.dll
iv41;Ligos Indeo® Video 4.5;4.51.16.03;Ligos Corporation;C:\WINDOWS\system32\ir41_32.ax
iv50;Ligos Indeo® Video 5.11;5.11.15.2.56;Ligos Corporation;C:\WINDOWS\system32\ir50_32.dll
iyuv;Intel Indeo(R) Video YUV Codec;5.1.2600.2180 (xpsp_Microsoft Corporation;Microsoft Corporation;C:\WINDOWS\system32\iyuv_32.dll
m261;Microsoft H.261 ICM Driver;5.1.2600.2180;Microsoft Corporation;C:\WINDOWS\system32\msh261.drv
m263;Microsoft H.263 ICM Driver;5.1.2600.2180;Microsoft Corporation;C:\WINDOWS\system32\msh263.drv
mpg2;MPEG 2 (SVCD/DVD);5.11.15.2.56;No information available;C:\WINDOWS\system32\C:\WINDOWS\mpg4c32.d ll
mpg3;Unknown;5.11.15.2.56;No information available;C:\WINDOWS\system32\C:\WINDOWS\mpg4c32.d ll
mpg4;MS MPEG4 Standard;5.11.15.2.56;No information available;C:\WINDOWS\system32\C:\WINDOWS\mpg4c32.d ll
mrle;Microsoft RLE Compressor;5.1.2600.2180 (xpsp_Microsoft Corporation;Microsoft Corporation;C:\WINDOWS\system32\msrle32.dll
msvc;Microsoft Video 1 Compressor;5.1.2600.0 (xpclientMicrosoft Corporation;Microsoft Corporation;C:\WINDOWS\system32\msvidc32.dll
uyvy;Microsoft UYVY Video Decompressor;5.3.2600.2180 (xpsp_Microsoft Corporation;Microsoft Corporation;C:\WINDOWS\system32\msyuv.dll
yuy2;Microsoft UYVY Video Decompressor;5.3.2600.2180 (xpsp_Microsoft Corporation;Microsoft Corporation;C:\WINDOWS\system32\msyuv.dll
yvu9;Toshiba Video Codec;5.1.2600.0 (XPClientMicrosoft Corporation;Microsoft Corporation;C:\WINDOWS\system32\tsbyuv.dll
yvyu;Microsoft UYVY Video Decompressor;5.3.2600.2180 (xpsp_Microsoft Corporation;Microsoft Corporation;C:\WINDOWS\system32\msyuv.dll

[meridklt]

That, to me, only leaves the card at fault. Either poorly seated (not physically in properly) or faulty. Have you tried the un-install / re-install? (Sorry, I can't remember...)

You were going to let me know which to device to remove:-
which one (or both) do I remove from the ‘Device Manager’, is it ‘1394 Bus Contoller’ – ‘VIA OHC compliant IEEE 1394 Host Controller’

daamon, if your brassed of by now, please say so. As to be honest I will have to continue with the opening of the computer after I have had some shut-eye (it's 0110am now).

Once you let me know about which driver to uninstall, I will also try the card in another expansion slot.

Once again, I really appreciate all this help.

[daamon]

@ meridklt - Get some sleep. I'm 11 hours ahead of you and won't be home for a while. We'll pick it up again later...

PM me if you need to.

"Brassed off" - No way! I'd have to work otherwise, and this is much more interesting...

Glad to be of help.

[daamon]

@ Flight13 - It looks like the only one. Any software requiring a DV codec will use it by default.

If this blossoms into a full blown problem of your own, start another thread specifically for it and paste the link here.

It'll be confusing having similar problems in one link, and you're also likely to get more responses / help with your own thread.

[NightWing]

There is a setting for quality or should say resolution. Hey Blam the cold!

I Posted this a wile back. They fix it in XP so it full.

To check DV playback settings:
1) Bring up the clip in MS Media Player.
2) Click on Menu/Properties.
3) Select the tab Advance.
4) Double click on DV Video Decoder entry listed.
5) Make sure its set for Full. If not set Full and select Make Default. Click on ok.

[Flight13]

I actually did start my own thread prior to this one but there were very few responses. It seems he is having the same issue as I am so I felt my posts belonged here.

[daamon]

Yep - Found your thread. Might be worth putting a comment in there saying that you're continuing it in this thread...

[daamon]

You were going to let me know which to device to remove:-
which one (or both) do I remove from the ‘Device Manager’, is it ‘1394 Bus Contoller’ – ‘VIA OHC compliant IEEE 1394 Host Controller’

As I thought, it's the latter - the ‘VIA OHC compliant IEEE 1394 Host Controller’ to uninstall.

Be sure to wear an anti-static strap or be very careful when you're going inside the PC.

[meridklt]

Well daamon,

I deleted the Device, powered down, re-set the firewire capture board in a new empty expansion slot (did not have a strap, but kept touching unpainted metal as per Dell handbook instruction), re-booted, computer put new 1394 device in.

Transfered film using both Premier 6.5 and DV10, ...... damn and blast..... same poor quality in both files as before.

[mikesbytes]

Why don't you send the video back to the camcorder and view it on the TV.

This will eliminate 2 things;
- Its something on the computer and the video itself is ok.
- It isn't being stored on the computer in the origional DV format.

[meridklt]

Why don't you send the video back to the camcorder and view it on the TV.

See 16 posts above yours and then daamon reply after reading that.

[NightWing]

meridklt: Have you CHECKED these settings yet?


--------------------------------------
To check DV playback settings:
--------------------------------------
1) Bring up the clip in MS Media Player.
2) Click on Menu/Properties.
3) Select the tab Advance.
4) Double click on DV Video Decoder entry listed.
5) Make sure its set for Full. If not set Full and select Make Default. Click on ok.

Under 98, 98se, and ME. Microsoft left it at 1/4 D1 to keep the load down on the computer. IE they goofed. Untill you reset it to ful. It will look like junk with those diagional lines/fuzzy problems. Thats the key. if you remove every other horz/very lines will get a weak picture { only 1/4 data } and jagged lines. Basically the same difference between a VCD and a DVD.

[meridklt]

--------------------------------------
To check DV playback settings:
--------------------------------------
1) Bring up the clip in MS Media Player.
2) Click on Menu/Properties.
3) Select the tab Advance.
4) Double click on DV Video Decoder entry listed.
5) Make sure its set for Full. If not set Full and select Make Default. Click on ok.

Have done number 1 but don't see number 2 - I have WMP 9.00.00.31.28
At the top I have - File - View - Play - Tools - Help
which one do I take ?

Many thanks

[junkmalle]

2) Tools -> Options -> Performance -> Advanced
3) Set "Digital Video slider" to "Large"
4) Play with "Use Video Mixing Renderer" and "Use overlays" options too.

[meridklt]

Many thanks junkmalle,

As it was, all those settings were allready at the definitions you suggested.

Many thanks

[junkmalle]

Many thanks junkmalle,

As it was, all those settings were allready at the definitions you suggested.

Many thanks

On my computer, turning on "Use Overlays" automatically deinterlaces the video with a blend deinterlace, making it look blurry.

[meridklt]

On my computer, turning on "Use Overlays" automatically deinterlaces the video with a blend deinterlace, making it look blurry.

Once again makes no difference, but many thanks.

[junkmalle]

Try opening your AVI files with VirtualDub (a free, open source AVI editor). It will show you the image at full size, no deinterlacing, filtering, etc.

You can use the Video -> Copy Source Frame To Clipboard menu item to copy whatever frame you want to the clipboard, then use a paint program to copy from the clipboard into the program. Save as JPEG (at say, 90% setting) and post here.

[meridklt]

Hello junkmalle,

Here is the best single frame capture:-

http://www.btinternet.com/~meridklt/dvd/vdub.jpg

Thanks again.

[junkmalle]

Well, here's what I see:

1) There is probably no problem with your firewire "capture". Bad firewire captures will give far worse problems than anything you see in that picture -- things like big blocks of noise, a torn picture, etc.

2) The picture is interlaced (as expected unless you have progressive camcorder). When you see it on a computer you will either see the interlace lines or your DV codec might deinterlace. Depending on how it is deinterlaced you might see a fuzzy picture (blend deinterlace) or maybe stair steps on nearly horizontal edges (drop field deinterlace).

3) You have a grainy, fuzzy picture simply because of low light conditions. Many DV camcorders don't do well under low light. They don't focus well and the picture is usually grainy (ie, random noise at the pixel level).

4) The camera was in motion (panning or shaking horizontally) during that shot (you can tell from the interlace lines on the vertical structures). This may have made it difficult for the camera to focus and caused a lot of the fuzzyness and moire noise (as visible on the white grating above the cage). Especially since you say this is the "best" frame -- implying there was more motion on the others.

[meridklt]

Many thanks for your detailed description junkmalle, but I'm not quite sure if your saying all is OK.

Have you read my Posts above regarding these examples
Good one http://www.btinternet.com/~meridklt/dvd/good.jpg
Poor one http://www.btinternet.com/~meridklt/dvd/bad.jpg

Same loft, same pigeon, but different computer transfer (same OS). Yet if I transfer from that camera which has that good clear picture onto my computer, it ends up as a fuzzy AVI picture.

[junkmalle]

Many thanks for your detailed description junkmalle, but I'm not quite sure if your saying all is OK.

Have you read my Posts above regarding these examples
Good one http://www.btinternet.com/~meridklt/dvd/good.jpg
Poor one http://www.btinternet.com/~meridklt/dvd/bad.jpg

Same loft, same pigeon, but different computer transfer (same OS). Yet if I transfer from that camera which has that good clear picture onto my computer, it ends up as a fuzzy AVI picture.

Yes, I saw those pictures but since they were shrunken it harder to say what was going on. It looks like the lighting was much better on the good picture though.

To be absolutely sure what the problem is you need to reduce the number of variables. Capture exactly the same scene from the same tape on the two computers. Compare both files on each computer:

If you look at file1 and file2 on computer1 (or on computer2), and they both look the same, you know there's no problem with the captures. If the two files look different on a single computer then there is something wrong with one of the captures (not likely, is my guess). (Actually, in the second case there is one possible software/codec issue. If the fourcc code is different between the two files a different codec might be used to decode them.)

If you look at a single file on the two computers and they look different -- then there's a codec problem (the files have to be decompressed to display them), some other software problem, or a monitor calibration problem.