HD size limitation?

[skorch]

Hi all.
I finally got around to putting together a new system for editing video/audio, but the problem is the 80gig HD only reports 32+gigs in the BIOS/XP Pro.
The drive is a WD800JB with 8 MB cache set on the primary cable alone.
The board is an Intel D865PERL, with the latest BIOS from Intel.
P4 2.8 processor.
Win XP Pro, SP2.
I would think with this setup HD issues would be with drives over 137gigs and not 32, neither WD or Intel's web support mention any issues with this.
I've been told to stay away from DDOs as they are troublesome, any help would be awesome.

[Capmaster]

Depends on the age of the motherboard/BIOS. The 32GB was a limitation with older hardware. I'm a bit surprised you're seeing it on a modern board.

Can you get a .BIN drive overlay from the HD vendor? That might help

[skorch]

Capmaster is that the same as a Dynamic Drive Overlay?
I'd like to avoid that route if possible, caused me quite a few headaches with my old system.
I just don't understand how this can be with a recent board and latest BIOS, part of the reason I built this was to overcome HD barriers.

[Capmaster]

Capmaster is that the same as a Dynamic Drive Overlay?
I'd like to avoid that route if possible, caused me quite a few headaches with my old system.
I just don't understand how this can be with a recent board and latest BIOS, part of the reason I built this was to overcome HD barriers.

Skorch,
Yes that's what I was thinking of. I don't blame you for being hesitant. I would save it as a last resort.

I'm sure you already checked your BIOS HD settings to make sure that the manual cylinders,heads size wasn't selected. With a newer drive that might do funky things, if it recognized the drive at all.

Did you try going from "Master" or "Slave" on the jumpers to "Cable Select" or vice versa? It's a long shot ......

[glockjs]

i had a prob like that with my samsung 160g, it had to do with the jumper settings

[Garibaldi]

Do you think its just the os that won't recognize it? If so (I'm not sure that this wil work but hey, its worth a shot) you could try using a live-cd to see if it will recognize your whole hard drive. All you have to do is download it, burn it, and put it in at startup. A couple good ones are:
www.slax.org
www.knoppix.net
there are many others as well.

[skorch]

Well I had already gone with master with slave jumper settings to no jumper at all, same result. I'll have to give the cable select a try later tonight and if that doesn't work I'll try the Linux cd thing Garibaldi suggested.

Thanks for the replies.

[Garibaldi]

Well I had already gone with master with slave jumper settings to no jumper at all, same result. I'll have to give the cable select a try later tonight and if that doesn't work I'll try the Linux cd thing Garibaldi suggested.

Thanks for the replies.

No problem, good luck!
Live long and prosper!

[ViRaL1]

Try creating a boot disk and seeing how large the drive shows up as in FDISK.

[gmatov]

Skorch,

Go to MS and download 263044usa8, an executable that will install karge Drive Support on your machine. It's basically a replacement or updated fdisk, dated 8 may 2000, whereas your fdisk is dated I think April 1999.

It will see drives larger than 64 gig. Yours sees over 64 and subtracts 64, so an 80 can only be formatted as a 16, and so on up the scale.

I just installed, fdisked and formatted a 160, but I will warn you that the numbers are screwed up. It will say you have xxxxx space, but ignore that, just partition as you wish, or format as one large drive, the end result will be the same, full capacity.

I's 175 k, you want, I'll mail it to you.

Cheers,

George

I have mentioned this a few times before, no-one remembers anything, here?

edited the date to be 8 May 2000

[skorch]

gmatov, thanks for offering the help but that fix is for Windows 98/ME and this problem seems to be related to the BIOS/mothersboard.

I tried to switch to cable select but got the same result.
Tommorow I'll make a call to Intel customer supprt.

[gmatov]

Skorch,

No, that repair is for fdisk. The original with 32 bit addressing can't count as many allocation units as you need when you go over 64 gigs, so it starts counting all over again.

Your motherboard can see the size of the disk correctly, but the BIOS does not do the formatting, fdisk does for 95/98, and can be used with W2k/XP/Linux, whatever. In XP you can also "Manage My Harddrive" or some such and format from within Windows. I don't know if you can partition from there.

Again, you open the file I named, an executable, it replaces the old files in Command Folder, and you either copy the new fdisk to your old boot disk, or make a new boot disk. Simple. I use this boot disk for fdisking my 2k machine drives as well as XP machines I repair

Your computer details show 98SE. Are you comfortable with fdisk from DOS?

Cheers,

George

BTW, unless a logo hides it, can you see the size of the drive on boot up, either first or second screen should show, but look fast.

[skorch]

Gmatov, yeah I need to update my PC specs, I'm putting together this new one and everythings been fine until this.
With this system I'm using XP Pro and I just put the XP CD-ROM in and let it do the work. Are you suggesting I create a boot disk that has an updated FDISK on it to format/partition and then reinstall XP using the XP disk?
This is my first build so please excuse my lack of knowledge.

[redwudz]

skorch: I assume you have XP up and running? Have you checked Control Panel>Administrative Tools> Computer Management> Storage> Disk Management. There you see the attributes of your drives.

[skorch]

redwudz, yes both the BIOS and OS both show this drive at 31.48 gigs with 27.71 free.
I emailed Intel tech support, they want $25.00 a pop for phone support (total BS IMHO)and am waiting for a reply.
The only thing I can think of is maybe this drive isn't really 80 gigs?

[ViRaL1]

Do you have another machine you can try it in? What model does it show up as in device manager?

[Chief Wiggum]

[quote="skorch"]
The drive is a WD800JB with 8 MB cache set on the primary cable alone.
quote]

You know when you boot the computer up and the black screen flashes up telling what devices are connected to which channel. Does it recognize the drive as WD800JB hd (with that specific label)?

If so, the quick and easy way is to install something like partition magic 8. Backup anything important just in case. Run partition magic and tell it you want to make one partition. At the moment its recognising a fraction of the drive. When you specify to make one new partition it will ask you the size you want it. Specify the full 80Gb.

This worked for my 250 hard drive which was recognised as 127gb. This is to do with the windows limit but i should imagine this should work for you as well. If not i've got an article on the longer way somewhere (involving registry changes etc.)

Let us know how you get on!

[gmatov]

Skorch,

Yes, I am suggesting that you create a boot disk, with the new fdisk on it, and do an fdisk/format from DOS.

I have had the problem, back when 80 gig were the top of the line. I'm now on my 4th 160 (because they are so cheap,per gig)

It is an fdisk problem. As I said, you may DL the file from MS, to your 98 machine, preferably, because when I looked for an XP boot disk, it wanted to build 6 or 8 disks. This is unnecessary to fdisk and format a disk drive. Hell, even if it would do it, and I do not know if it will.

If you want, I will e-mail you a boot disk, write to a floppy (do you have one? Drive, I mean, they are becoming redundant.), and go from there. Should you need guidance, give me a call, I'll try to walk you through it. Hell, I've done it from work with no machine to look at while I did so.

I have PM 8, and I have used it for NON-destructive partition management. Fdisk is DESTRUCTIVE management, used for new drives or for a total wipe and re-install. It is also 60 bucks to format a 50 buck drive, with Partition Magic. Seems like overkill to me.

Cheers,

George

[skorch]

First off, I want to thank everyone for the suggestions, you guys are the best.
I dropped the PC off at my cousin's to see if he could fix the problem as well as a couple of other minor problems (floppy not working, turned out to be a reversed cable). He's a busy person so he couldn't take too much time on it so he assumed I tried to install the DDO on the drive. He told me to just wipe and reload XP and it should fix it.
I bought this drive 3 months ago before the other parts and tried to integrate it into my Win98SE machine but can't remember if I installed the DDO on it back then. When I built the new machine and installed XP I don't remember it asking if I wanted to delete any old partitions, would XP even ask that if the partition was FAT32?
Gmatov, I'm willing to give FDISK a shot if it will completely wipe the drive and format to NFTS?
Chief Wiggum, yes both the BIOS and XP recognize the drive as WD800JB but not at full capacity.

[gmatov]

Skorch,

Yes, fdisk will fdisk,partition, if you so wish, and format the full capacity,IF you DL the 8 May 2000 file, and run it as an executeable, then copy it to your boot disk.

Again, I will try to talk you through it if you wish. Your nickle as to the phone charges.

Shame to buy a 60 buck prog to partition a 50 buck drive, or 30 buck if you hit CompUSA onBlack Friday. But your prior said you had it for a few months,

So, it is still a really cheap, dollarwise drive, to spend 60 bucks on, though PM8 is worth having for other operations.

Cheers,

George

Oh, wait, now, NO, fdisk will not make an NTFS partition. You partition with fdisk, then you boot into Win XP, THEN use Disk Manager to format to NTFS. First, though, you need to have the full capacity, and the partitions, whether 1 or 21.

If you have a Full Install Win XP disk, which will install from a CD, under DOS, then it will ask if you wish to format as NTFS, if you have an Upgrade Version, which has to be installed from a functioning Windows machine, it will ask if you wish to convert that particular folder to NTFS. The boot disk will not give you that option. Large Drive, even under the old fdisk, went to FAT32, instead of FAT 16.

[skorch]

Gmatov,
I followed your advice and downloaded the updated file for FDISK and created a new floppy on my old machine. After setting up the new machine to boot to floppy, inserted the disk, ran FDISK and deleted the existing partition and then created a new one. Next I set up to boot to DVD drive and inserted the XP CD and during setup when I went to format to NTFS the capacity is still only 32+gigs.
So I figured I'd finally bite the bullet and try the Data Lifeguard for DOS floppy I created. I ran the XP CD again, deleted the partition and tried to boot to the Data Lifeguard floppy but couldn't boot to it.
Now I'm in the process of loading XP again to try out Data Lifeguard for Windows.

I don't know....

[gmatov]

Skorch,

Make sure the fdisk on the boot .floppy is dated 05/08/2000.

Boot from floppy. After "Start with CDROM support", loads RAMDisk.

A:\ prompt

a:\fdisk

Choice 5; Select fixed disk. (I am assuming you still have the C:drive installed, and this is the second drive.) If not, "4 Show Partition Information"

That will show Drive 1 and any partitions, and if there is an extended partition, will prompt you to view that info, also.

If you have 2 drives now installed, the old and the new, then do choose 5 and select Drive 2, and "Show Partition Information". If the drive has no partition, or just the residual space you have mentioned, escape and delete all partitions. MAKE SURE THAT FIXED DISK 2 IS SHOWING.

Create Primary Partition. It will show you the amount of space available and ask if you wish to use it all. If not, in the space occupied by the number 76000 or somesuch, the actual size of the 80 gig in Megabytes, type in what you want for a Primary Dos partition. I like about 6 gigs, as it is more than enough for an OS and programs, and can usually be Ghosted to an RW.

Escape and choose Option 2, Create Extended DOS partittion, use the rest of the space for that, escape, after it has verified drive integrity, then you will see "No Logical Drives", and allow you to create any Logical Drives you wish, of which I usually do at least 1, as I always at least dual boot, so make the Primary as a Win 98, and the first Logical as my Win 2k Partition.

You may use the remainder as storage, as 1 large partition.

That would give you your original as C:\, the new drive as D:\, E:\, F:\, and your ROM or burner G and H respectively.

BTW, while you were in DOS mode, after you partitioned, you should have rebooted, again with the boot disk, and checked the drive information, such as D: enter, then a Dir enter, to see if it said invalid media. That would be the first partition of the new drive. Continue till you run out of drives.

You MUST format those drives now; a:\format d: a:\format e: etc.

They are invalid drives till you do. NOT DOS drives.

After a format, you can boot to Win XP and go to "Manage My Harddrives" and convert to NTFS. I don't think XP can see a non-DOS drive, either.

Cheers,

George

[Chief Wiggum]

I suppose PM8 is a bit pricey considering the cost of the hard drive but like you say it can do other stuff. It was worthwhile to me as my 250 gb drive cost a bit more.

Gmatov looks to have it down with fdisk. I had to use it today on my work's win98 pentium II computer. I just used it in the windows dos prompt and followed the various options (it was a different problem though; device manager recognised drive was there but hadn't attached a label and the drive couldn't be accessed. I messed around with the partitions and viola, trial and error )

I hope you've got it sorted now Skorch.

[glockjs]

was this a brand new drive when you got it? or did you previously use it?

[glockjs]

if it was new it can be only one of two things, your bios or your os.

here

here


but if you ever used it before this do a low level format which should be in data lifeguard tools 11, something to the effect or restore to factory defaults. all your doing right now is a high level format.

[skorch]

Well Data Lifeguard for Windows only works on a non-system drive.
For some reason I can't get DL for DOS to boot using the floppy, if I can get it to boot I'll try glockjs' suggestion.
gmatov, I checked FDISK on the floppy I created and it's Dated 5/18/2000, does it make a difference?
It must be wrong because I followed your steps and only get 32+gigs to work with.

[gmatov]

Skorch,

One additional remark.

If this is the only drive in the new machine, you will have to set the new C:\ drive as "Active". If it is any other drive, ignore, as only C:\ can be set as active. It may do that automatically, but I forget.

Chief,

You're right. PM8 is great. Just used it again this PM to merge a few redundant partitions.

I don't know what 250s cost where you are, but Sam's club has sold them for a few months at 130 bucks, and tax, out the door. Beats waiting for 50 bucks or more to come as a rebate in a couple month's time.

Glock,

Per WD, the new meaning of "Low Level Format" is to write zeros to the drive, as when installing new so you have a supposedly virgin drive. Actually, they say if it completes a write, it indicates the drive is OK.

There are no factory defaults to go back to. No data on the drive, whatsoever. And in the meantime it will find and mark as bad any bad sectors it finds.

Cheers,

George

[skorch]

I just deleted the partitions using FDISK, but again after reboot, same result. Could it be I'm using the wrong FDISK or is it when I tried to put it in my old system I put data on it thats taking up space?

[gmatov]

I just deleted the partitions using FDISK, but again after reboot, same result. Could it be I'm using the wrong FDISK or is it when I tried to put it in my old system I put data on it thats taking up space?


Skorch,

You are confusing me here, just a little bit. You deleted the partitions then rebooted, and same result?

If you didn't set any partitions and didn't reboot and format them, then, yes, you have a dtive that is invisible to Windows, and, indeed, even to DOS.

Go to my previous post, the one with detailed instructions, print it, and read it as you try again.

As to the version of fdisk, just open the floppy in My Computer, A:\ drive, and click once on fdisk. You may have to right click and do "Properties" if you don't have the pane on the left of the window. It should be dated 5/8/2000. If it's dated 3/29/1999 (I think it's 29, don't wanna go to C drive to check) it is not the right one.

You have to fdisk AND format the drive. Fdisk sets the limits of the partitions, format names every allocation unit on the drive, so that Windows, or Linux, Unix, Mac, whatever, know where to write stuff and, more importantly, how to find it again.

Give it another try. Fdisk AND format. You must reboot after fdisk.

You do not need to supply a "Label" for each partition after format. Convenient, sometimes, pain in the butt at others.

Cheers,

George

By the way, no, putting it back in the old machine writes nothing to the drive. YOU write to the drive. It's a machine, it does what you make it do. (Except for the Blue Screen of Death, of course, Gremlins make that happen.)

[glockjs]

there are some third party low level format tools..........but they cost

you could try to reset the MBR....


i really think the prob has to do with the mobo though, since this prob happens over and over. try the alternate jumper settings. but, you might wanna try another driver...if it happens again it will eliminate one probs so you can move onto the next.