Piracy question

[northcat_8]

Let me start this out newbie style...

If this is the wrong forum, I'm sorry and I'm sorry if this question has been asked before but I need help ASAP.

Here's the situation...my mother wanted to see "Man on Fire" but she doesn't have a DVD player, and walmart didn't have the VHS, so she bought the DVD and asked me if I could copy it onto a VHS tape for her.

I'm going to buy her a DVD player for X-mas.

I'm going to copy it for her but it made me think...because to copy it, I have to rip it, take out macrovision before I can copy it to VHS is it considered piracy?

Perplexed because she is going to keep the DVD and really I am just changing format so she can view it....so in a way, I am backing up the DVD to VHS for her.....so now I'm confused.

<might as well close it newbie style>

Thanks in advance for your help.

[DeleriumMDK]

I think it comes down to the same gray area as creating a DVD backup. Its not like you're borrowing a DVD off a friend to copy it to VHS for your mother, it is her disc so I'd say its ok to do, maybe not legal but morally there is definitely no issue I see here.

[makntraks]

Let me start this out newbie style...

If this is the wrong forum, I'm sorry and I'm sorry if this question has been asked before but I need help ASAP.

Here's the situation...my mother wanted to see "Man on Fire" but she doesn't have a DVD player, and walmart didn't have the VHS, so she bought the DVD and asked me if I could copy it onto a VHS tape for her.

I'm going to buy her a DVD player for X-mas.

I'm going to copy it for her but it made me think...because to copy it, I have to rip it, take out macrovision before I can copy it to VHS is it considered piracy?

Perplexed because she is going to keep the DVD and really I am just changing format so she can view it....so in a way, I am backing up the DVD to VHS for her.....so now I'm confused.

<might as well close it newbie style>

Thanks in advance for your help.

And in reply with from an experienced forumer...


SO....


Another public service announcement from me,
makntraks

[Cobra]

I think what you are doing is fair and so I don't think you are in any danger. Essentially, you are making a backup in a different format for your mother. The fact that she does not own a DVD player does not exempt her from owning the DVD and therefore the right to watch the film.

That is my personal opinion, and certainly not to be considered definitive or indeed accurate.

[Shocker Milwaukee]

PIRACY LITMUS TEST:
1) Do you wear an eye-patch?
2) Do you have a peg-leg?
3) Do you have a bushy beard?

If you answer yes to 2 out of 3 of these questions, you must walk the plank.

[CoasterCreator]

the seller says : yes it is, buy a dvd player ( more profit for me )

the consumer says : no you bought a movie ,,,you have the right to watch it no matter what format.

the pirate says : hell no , here is a copy and how to bypass macro on your dvd player.

[northcat_8]

And in reply with from an experienced forumer...


SO....


Another public service announcement from me,
makntraks

why can't you just be nice , I come here to get heeelp with a serious question and you make fun of me because I don't know

You hurt my feelings makntracks

[CoasterCreator]

who are you ...?? this is not the Northcat I used to

[northcat_8]

Seriously though....

I am going to make the copy anyway because I don't see why I shouldn't be allowed to do that, and if Jack decides to call me on it, then I'm keeping the DVD and I'll make 1000 copies and sell them on ebay. .....you think $5.00 each is a fair price?

If I'm going to do the time, I might as well do the crime

[CoasterCreator]

ok that better

[northcat_8]

who are you ...?? this is not the Northcat I used to

Um...yea....that would be called sarcasm....you have to have "feelings" before they can be hurt.

...try to keep up from now on :P

Rest assured, Northcat is the one constant in an ever changing world

[Shocker Milwaukee]

...feelings?

What the hell are those?

[northcat_8]

I don't know but my wife always accuses me of hurting hers.
I have no idea WTF she's talking about, I've never seen them anywhere around the house

[Capmaster]

Northcat,
Rip away. You're legally covered

Fair Use section of the forum rules:

Fair use / Backup
When you own the media, they are the rights you get automatically DESPITE what content providers or laywers might tell you. These rights are fully supported by the crew at VCDhelp and are the basis for most of the site. These fair use rights evaporate when you sell the media in question.

Backup
You have the right to make A backup of your media. You can back up as much or as little as you wish.

Format shifting
You have the right to convert your media to another format.

Time shifting
You have the right to time shift your legitimately received cable, tv or satellite signal for viewing at a later time

Fair use DOES NOT APPLY TO rentals or borrowed media.

[makntraks]

I don't know but my wife always accuses me of hurting hers.
I have no idea WTF she's talking about, I've never seen them anywhere around the house

north - if ya' wanna be a n00b... don't check your spelling
I can smell a ruse a mile a way

makntraks

[ViRaL1]

What's that number for the Piracy Hotline again?

[northcat_8]

I don't know but my wife always accuses me of hurting hers.
I have no idea WTF she's talking about, I've never seen them anywhere around the house

north - if ya' wanna be a n00b... don't check your spelling
I can smell a ruse a mile a way

makntraks

I spelled everything rite didn't I?

I teach Maff. Pretty difficult to mispell things like 5x + 4 = 24

Cap -

Thanks. I was going to rip and burn it anyway, I just wondered if it was considered piracy.

[gll99]

I don't think that it's any different than those who don't own a dvd writer and rip and encode their dvd to vcd,svcd or avi to CDR to view on their standalone DVD/(s)VCD or DIVX compatible player. If putting it on vhs tape is illegal then so would all other conversions.
Obviously the laws in your jurisdiction apply but generally I don't see the difference.

[d_unbeliever]

DO IT...it's for your mother. Ill copy everything in the world if its for my mother...we owned them that much

[Conquest10]

It'll be legal. You're not breaking (or whatever that word is) the encryption (and isn't that what is causing the big debate?).

[ViRaL1]

Technically he's got to break the encryption and remove macrovision to make a usable VHS tape. Not that I object, I don't.

[Conquest10]

Technically he's got to break the encryption ... to make a usable VHS tape.

How so?

[adam]

Its illegal, in the US at least. You don't have to break encryption, digital or otherwise, for it to be a violation of copyright. Do you have the permission of the author to copy it? If not then its illegal unless you fall within one of the few exceptions.

Fair Use only allows format shifting when you are dealing with time shifted material, and even that is pushing it. If you recorded a broadcast off your tv onto a VHS tape, you could legally copy it to a DVD. Once you've watched it though, on either format, you are legally required to sustain from ever watching that exact time shifted material again.

Format shifting has never been held to apply to a purchased VHS tape or DVD. It very well could happen if anyone were prosecuted for this, but until this happens the act is illegal.

As far as encryption, you'd have to bypass Macrovision in order to copy the DVD in analogue format to VHS, or you'd have to bypass CSS in order to back it up digitally to some other format. Either of these processes simply provides the copyright holder an additional legal remedy under the DMCA. Bypassing encryption is not a requirement for enforcement of copyright generally, only enforcement of this one particular aspect of the DMCA (it does alot of other nasty things too.)

I think we all agree that morally this act should be permissible, and for that reason a judge could very well add this act to the list of Fair Uses. But until that happens, it is technically, and definitively illegal in the United States. Your mileage will vary from country to country.

These types of acts are not really grey areas, because the law is crystal clear that they are illegal. But they are essentially in limbo because it seems a court could justifiably rule them as Fair Use rights, but since no one would ever be prosecuted for such a harmless act, the issue will probably never be raised in court. This happens all the time.

[northcat_8]

Holy Catwoman Batman....Adam is pretty smucking fart.

Seriously though...thanks Adam very informative, I've learned something today

[yoda313]

Hello,

Why not just rent a few times until you find out for sure that you don't really want to own it????

Kevin

[Capmaster]

<Note to self: Never seem sure of myself when Adam is in the same thread. You'll look like a retard>

Nice post Adam

[adam]

Not smart, just well educated. That is what a $100,000 legal degree buys you....a fancy post.

[shoozleboy]

5x + 4 = 24

x = 4

:P

[northcat_8]

5x + 4 = 24

x = 4

:P

congratulations, you are 14 weeks ahead of my 3rd and 4th period classes

[shoozleboy]

I'm probably 18 years ahead of your 3rd and 4th period classes.... :P

although I have forgotten more than I remember....