Satellite PC Cards

[dynamix1]

I was wondering if anyone would know if there are any pc tv tuner cards that I can install in my system, that would pick up a satellite signal like a tv tuner card would do with an over the air signal. Also to be able to change channels with a remote provided with the card like a tv tuner card would do. Thanx all

[sammie]

I can only speak for the U.S., but there are for FTA satellites, but not for the commercial products such as DirectTV or Dish. Some of the folks from the rest of the world can helpyou with their situation. In the US do a search for either DST or DVB cards.

[chicola]

Buy a Dreambox. It'll make you forget sat tuner cards.

http://www.dream-multimedia-tv.de/Bereiche/Produkte/DM7000_featurelist.php

http://www.dreambox.net.au/

[SatStorm]

Dreambox sucks. Awfull tuner, can't receive satellites beyond Astra / Hotbird / Hispasat, problems with the SCPC transmisions and so on.
The only reason Dreambox has some followers, is because of those illegal stuff it does, also the easy "card share" it is capable to do with files created from other dreamboxes (for 2 - 3 hours that way).
Don't mention that all the DVB receivers, with a Dragon Cam (made by dream multimedia, the same company made Dreambox), can do all those things dreambox is well known off...

Triple dragon from Uli Herman is a far better hardware machine, also has a great programer to support the firmware it has. The official distribution already started
www.triple-dragon.de

But for now, the cheaper and best solution for today, is IMHO SkyStar 2. It is far better any standalone receiver. It is capable to emulate without any external hardware any known fuction (only with freeware software), it is capable to save direct the stream to your HD (ready mpeg 2 format, won't need any pvastrumento for that...), it is capable to receive mpeg 4:2:2 transmissions (the EBU feeds for example...), it is capable to receive HDTV (Euro 1080) and, finally, it is capable to receive all the satellites from 105 East to 47 West (both band KU and C).

Another great alternative, is a nokia 9600 (dvb2000 firmware) with a Conax cam, and a titanium card... But not for the average user, only for the advance one who really knows what to do and how...

[chicola]

Satstorm, I disagree completely and, I'm not alone.

I leave it to each member to evaluate the capabilities and map his/her needs.

[SatStorm]

Point me one thing Sky Star 2 can't do and dreambox can....

[chicola]

One thing, among others: stand near my TV without a PC in the room.

[SatStorm]

That way, which are the benefits of Dreambox? For anything "special", it needs a PC nearby.
Without a PC, Dreambox is a bad receiver...

[satviewer2000]

Is the DreamBox any different than the so called "Blackbird" boxes which are sold at many vendors?

By the way, I also use the SkyStar2 and would not trade it for anything else. It has a steep initial learning curve, but once you get the hang of it, it's easy to run and maintain.

[SatStorm]

Dreambox is a DVB receiver with excellent hardware manufactured in Germany. It has excellent internet support and a passionet community.
The problems with this receiver are:
The firmwares (official or not) don't use well the tuner. So you need big dishes to receive some channels. This is not a problem in Germany, which all the commercial satellites focus, neither West Europe. But anywhere else it is a huge problem
For the same reason, it doesn't do good SCPC reception.
C band reception with this receiver is a joke, only the official firmwares can somehow handle it. But again, most western europeans don't care about C Band, because they don't use it a lot.
Another problem this receiver has, is that because again of the firmware, the reception of non commercial satellites is problematic. In short terms, with Dreambox you can receive without issues Astra 19.2E (used by Germans), Astra 28.2E (used by Brits), Hotbirds (used from the rest), Hispasat (used by Spanish and Portugish), Thor (used by Nordic countries) and Sirius 3 (used by Nordic countries). On all other satellites, the reception is more of a matter of luck.
This is not because of hardware limitations. It is because of software (firmware) limitations. But after almost 2 years, there is no firmware that solve those issues (among others, less important). Instead of this, the users of dreambox focused on creating firmwares serve illegal activities of those specific satellites I mention.
So, for a D-xer Dreambox is not a good receiver. Neither for someone that likes do zapping on satellites. The special things this receiver is capable to do, are also offered to all the other receivers, through "Dragon Cam", a PCMCIA device compatible with all the DVB receivers having a Common Interface, manufactured by the same company that makes dreambox.
Dreambox also has a LAN connector, so to connect it with your PC and transfer files. This is not new: Nokia 9600/dbox 1 do this from 1998, using a SCSI 2 port (www.no-access.de). In the matter of fact, it does anything faster and better (including grabbing any kind of DVB Steam, even HDTV, and bring it realtime to your PC). But because this receiver is old and not manufactured any more by nokia (it stopped in 2001), many later DVB users tried other alternatives. Among them, Dreambox was very promising, but unfortunatelly those promises never reached the targets.
Meanwhile, Sky Star 2 appeared (and other PCI cards with the same technotread chip). Cost about 60 euros, those cards based on the CPU you already have on your PCI and the codecs you have installed. It just brings the DVB info from satellite to your PC untouched, so to do with it whatever you wish. The results are better any other solution today and since Dreambox is more expensive, has issues with the non commercial satellites and the SCPC channels and needs a PC soon or later to show the benefits it hardware has, IMHO Sky Star 2 wins hands down. Cheaper, better reception, full range of fuctions, all the possible "tricks" and compatible with mpeg 4.2.2 and HDTV (dreambox is not capable for those things).

Having a HCPC in your living room is not a bad thing. It combines a Sat receiver, a region free DVD player, a multimedia center, a game emulation consolue (play your PS1 games for example, don't mention MAME...), a DVR, a DVD/CD backup unit, a video line upscaler for your Video projector and anything else you can imagine...
But I bet some people don't realise that.

[chicola]

Dreambox is a DVB receiver with excellent hardware manufactured in Germany. It has excellent internet support and a passionet community.

I agree completely.

Excellent forum:
http://sat-industry.net/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=45

Just to end: it can have 120GB HD and, for all it matters, it's a Linux machine with public sources.

[PC Master]

Hmm, spend almost $500 (in the USA) on a DreamBox, or spend around the same (or perhaps a bit more) on a full-featured PC with a SkyStar2 and use it for sat TV, DVDs, games, reencoding video, and anything else you want to do with a PC?

[edit] Not to mention the ability to pick up other satellites, burn DVD-R and CD-R, and so on...

[Elimac]

Satstorm,

I could not be more in line with you !
Thanks for your insight about comparing PC Cards with Dream box.
In fact, I right now with that dilema. I am thinking on a new receiver (don't know why realy) and I only think in 2 options: Skystar and Dreambox.

I am myself a little Dx'er, as I live in Portugal and some Nordish and Eastern satellites are fading at this location. And just like you, I use and love the Nokia 9600 with DVB 2000 (I have 2 of them). I still think this is the best receiver for a Dx'er, despite its age.

I had doubts about the tuner of the Dreambox - its a well known fact. But I would like to upgrade and retire one of my Nokias. I already have a Skystar 2, and agree with you - just 2 downsides:

- bit slow zapping;
- No video/audio out on board.

Thats' why I'm thinking in the Skystar 1 and build a multimedia PC !! (compatible wth SCPC/ low power signals)

Or, get a Triple Dragon (??) There is not much information about this machine. What can it do ?

Bye !
Eli.

[Vanderlow]

I have the Vision 1020A with remote and coupled with Mytheatre it does what I want. I highly recommed this card. There is a steep learning and debugging curve at first.

[SatStorm]

With sky star 1 you can have a common interface BUT: You can't have mpeg 4:2:2 and mpeg 2 HDTV...


Triple Dragon is Uli Herman's own reciever. Since he is the programmer of the DVB2000 firmware for the older nokias, you know where this receiver can lead..... Also, all the dvb 2000 software is compatible with triple dragon, and that's a huge benefit (example: dvbrecorder....).

I don't like dreambox: Bad - and I mean bad - tuner, not because of the tuner itself, but because of the firmware this machine runs. If you are a d-xer, don't think about it! If you wish to receive SCPC channels, C band or non commercial satellites, forget it.
If you have a iDSL connection and you wish to watch Nova Greece or other irdeto 2 stuff, then it might be a solution - for now -

Nokia 96xx is still among the best receivers With a conax cam, a titanium card and beta 8 np5 firmware, you have it all....
Don't mention that there is a plug in that makes prog DVB work with it!

[Elimac]

Uau!!

I visited some offcial pages and did see what looked like a SCSI port on back of the TDragon. Is this what you are talking about ? That would be spectacular. I have Nokia connected trough SCSI port right now, and yes, this receiver built in the mid-90's still rocks ! If Dragon has teh same capability, I am almost convinced!!
I know ProgDvb has a plugin for Nokia, but never tried though...

About the Skystar 1, I suspected that it might not decode 4:2:2. The reason is that all functions are executed by hardware. But is it possible to disable normal operation and put the raw stream on the PCI bus in order to be processed by software (ProgDVB) ?
Is this the same case with CA info ? Does only forward it to the CI interface ? The progDVB plugins can decode anything by software with SS1, or should i need a hardware CAM ?

Another issue: I read something about Dragon having compatibility problemas with "hobby" CAMs, like Matrix reloaded. I have the same issue with DVB2000... do you have any info on this ?

Regards!
Eli

[SatStorm]

Yes I do, but: This is not the forum for those questions...
and Yes, triple dragon has a SCSI 2 connection...

I also have 3 Nokias, all connected to PCs.
I'm into DVB2000 since 1998 ...(when it was DVB98)

[Elimac]

I'm sorry, but i don't agree with you. That we went away from the original topic, yeah, that's right. "Those questions" are about the issue of some commom availabe piece of hardware working or not working with another piece of hardware. I thought this was DTV forum... Did'n ask anythinhg beyond that.

Thanks anyawy for all.
Eli

[SatStorm]

The problem is not the DTV forum, but what is legal to talk about and what is not!

Magic Cam for example, is prohibited at some E.U. countries. And the Matrix Cams, offically are "empty" PCMCIAs card readers...

[Elimac]

I think you are confused m8.
I don't think talking about hardware is ilegal !! Exchanging files, or explicity taught someone to hack, that can be considered ilegal. None of that happened here.

You see, it's this feeling of "ilegal" that you claim that i truly find uncalled for. Some day, we convince ourselves that just about everythinhg in DVB is prohibited... Did you ever think if recording live transmissions on our hard drive is legal ? What about copyright ? Isn't it the main focus of videohelp ? So, is this whole forum ilegal ?

But nevermind, we are drifting from the topic. Lets move on.
Bye.

[SatStorm]

I'm not Confused. I'm on a country that follows the E.U. laws about those matters.
Portugal don't follow E.U. laws regarding this YET.
Spain only recently adapt those laws.

You shall see soon what I mean.

And about Time sifting, public domain, etc, those are not European rights. Those are USA rights.
In Europe all those stuff are grey areas.

And the main focus of videohelp.com is to convert source a to b. Source A can be your home movie for example...

As I said before: There are forums you can discuss those matters far better than here. You can find me on those...
Bye.

[Elimac]

But i don't want to discuss anything. It was you that picked up the subject of hacking by talking about the possibilites of Dreambox and that stuff about Hellas on Irdeto 2. I dont care about that. I'm not into hacking. I am a DX'er as I said before.

You are making judgemts that i really find hard to accept, only because I asked if a particular receiver is compatible with a PCMCIA card. Nobody called your attention when you made an insight of what ilegal things Dreambox can do. And nobody asked you those things... and you anwsered to "those answers"...

About Portugal and Spain, you are mistaken again. There is much counter-measures here against comercial hackers, people are in jail. Much more than in Spain. But NEVER in any place people were judged by suposed intentions, much less being stoped of talking. That can happen in not-Free countries, but not in the E.U. countries. Exghanging information on HOW to hack is ilegal, talking about it NOT (and I don't want to talk about it). Muh less when there is nothing wrong with the subject (it was not that), only in the reader's mind. That was the problem.

[SatStorm]

Portugal don't has - yet - the same laws as Denmark, Ire, UK, Germany, Greece and now Spain regarding this....

Discussions like this here, where the ones that killed DVB2000 project some years ago. But I bet you know that.

If you wish to hide behind your finger (what you are doing actually), I don't care. I care only to protect this forum.

I feel that we are on the same team but you don't like to realise how easy target a popular forum like this here is.

[Elimac]

I agree with you. I will stop this nonsense.
But you should learn to stop making judgments. You do that often. You just did again saying i'm hiding or something. You should be more humble, you think you know it all, even what goes in people's minds.

For me, I just asked out of curiosity some specs of a digital receiver. There's nothing wrong with that. But you had to be better than the rest, you had to point your finger, and you know what, pointing a finger makes 3 more fingers point right back at you. I enjoyed many posts from you, you have quality, but you have a tendendy to be paternalistic, even when the person you are talking with may have a even more hard position than yours. That is, I can say to you that you are just a great menace to this forum as me or anybody else. I also have a tendency: to dislike people that THINK are better that the rest (even when they sometimes are). Because everyone makes mistakes.

If you want to know who I am and what I do just drop me a mail. You will be surprised to know how much we are on the same team. I won't respond further to this post.

[SatStorm]

But you should learn to stop making judgments. You do that often.

I'm a moderator. I have to do judgments ...

[dynamix1]

now since there is a heated debate on which system to get all I wanted to do what get a pc capture card that I can attach a antenna like a terk55 and get HDTV on my pc. I don't want no $500 system or any kind of boxes just a simple pc hdtv tuner card. Thanx

[nrmf]

try searching for a dvb card called the nexus -s will do over the air free sat reception and will recive dishnetwork and other satellite if you can find info on it, its a nice card and runs between 175.00-250.00 just my 2 cents

[Suntan]

@dynamix1

Checkout the HTPC forum on AVSforum.com they have many threads about all the various HD tuner cards.

Also, check out the Silver Sensor (vs the Terk55) less than half the price and most people swear by them.

-Suntan

[magicmycote]

With sky star 1 you can have a common interface BUT: You can't have mpeg 4:2:2 and mpeg 2 HDTV...

SS1 cards can receive HDTV, just not using the built in mpeg2 decoder. When viewing HDTV you have to use software/graphs just as a SS2 would.

[SatStorm]

I didn't know that.
Is there any new software that can choose to overlook the mpeg 2 built in decoder?
That would be nice