Which Computer for Video Production? ITS OVER!!! FINALLY!

[thinger62]

Add another 256 memory for $20 and you have a solid machine for video. Not awesome, but certainly good.

[lordsmurf]

Just know that all there is really to building most new computers is a few screws and plugging in some cables basically, a couple of clips like mounting the CPU heatsink. As far as software, not a big deal and you have to do it anyway if you ever upgrade the drive or have to reformat because of a virus!

I disagree.

You have to be careful of hardware conflicts and driver issues. VIA motherboards have got to be the biggest pieces of shit on the planet in this department.

It should be simple, but isn't always. Especially with cheaper parts.

[dosun]

VIA motherboards have got to be the biggest pieces of shit on the planet in this department.

Yet another uninformed comment. VIA chipsets have gone a long way and their newer chipsets have no more stability issues than other chipsets. Many big name manufactures use their chipsets. Alienware uses VIA chipset motherboard for their best system. Do you ever actually read about things before you give information?

[lordsmurf]

The VIA drivers are not very stable. I've got one. It's trash. It's new. I should have bit the bullet and gone INTEL chipset with an INTEL P4. This AMD was a cheap bastard mistake. If anything, I blame people like you for whooping and hollering "hey, whoopie, look at this, gee it's great" when it's really not.

The only thing uninformed is your assumption that I'm just reading stuff. While that may be your source of advice, I vigorously field test and use quite a bit of this stuff on a daily basis. I know what I'm talking about, been there, done it.

[sacajaweeda]

I do just fine with AMD & nForce2 mobos.

(WOOOOOOP! WOOOOOP!)

[dosun]

When was this and what was the name of the P4 VIA chipset?

The only thing uninformed is your assumption that I'm just reading stuff. While that may be your source of advice, I vigorously field test and use quite a bit of this stuff on a daily basis. I know what I'm talking about, been there, done it.

1) I never assumed you were reading this stuff. Actually READ my comment, I assumed you were NOT reading enough.

2) And you know my background? I derive info from my expericence and reading. Also for some weird coincidence :ermm: professional reviewers and technical documents all over the net just happen to agree with me.

3) But the problem is you DON'T know what you are talking about. Lets just take a recent example. You outright claimed that my comment about Dell pcs using proprietary components was baloney. Yet for some reason Dell's own technical specifications report shows that they use proprietary components. Yet, you continously refuse to admit you are wrong.

BTW, you haven't answered any of my previous questions.

[Bearbegr]

When I posted this add, I was under the impression that 1000 dollers was going to get me a great Computer. I was wrong aperently... I was picturing a flat panal monitor, DVD RW, DVD Rom, Card REader, and all of these accesories that I probably would not even use as much as I thought I would.

$1,000? Gee you don't have alot to spend do you
Leave out the expensive flat panel monitor and go with a nice normal monitor and I could build you 2 or 3 great systems for $1,000!
By flat pannel, you are reffering to like LCD I geuss.

Anyway if you check out gotapex.com you'll probably find lots of great coupon codes and deals for Dell. gotapex.com is nothing wierd, no popups or nothing crappy. Just a great site to find great deals like coupons and specail deals for Dells, Gatways, $30 off $150 order at staples, officemax, office depot etc.... Just whatever the currant bargains are at tons of places. They don't sell anything and nothing anoying about the site, I check them out often myself for deals at office max etc...

As for a Dell, if that's what you want, look at the daily specails
This one is supposed to end tonight,

DellSB - Dimension 4600 with 2.8Ghz P4, 256MB DDR SDRAM, 80GB HD, CD-RW, 2 Year Warranty for $449 after Rebate with FREE Shipping!
It`s set to expire tonight (though the last one was pulled hours ahead of time), so use it or lose it. Their outrageous desktop Dimension 4600 is back, and down to only $449 level thanks to an instant $280 discount & $150 rebate, plus you get the following FREE upgrades: 80GB HD ($20 value), CD-RW drive ($40 value), 128MB NVIDIA GeForce FX5200 AGP card with DVI & TV output ($60 value), Sound Blaster Live 24-Bit Advanced HD Audio PCI card ($20 value), 3.5" floppy drive ($20 value), and a 2 year warranty (a $113 value). You`re getting this Dimension 4600 with a fast 2.8Ghz Pentium 4 processor, i865p chipset motherboard (8x AGP slot, 2 S-ATA ports, etc), 256MB of dual channel DDR SDRAM, and Windows XP Home. Shipping is free.

I'm not saying that is or is not a good deal, it's just the first one posted!
I think there's 6 Dell deals posted on the front page alone right now.

Being as I build systems, I highly recommend shopping around, look at newegg.com and get some prices of what it would actually cost you to build your own. NEVER go to a local store to buy a system untill you do!!!
Even if you buy a prebuilt system, you should know what the parts would cost if you built it yourself, or one similar.

Beware at least 75% of computer problems are probably user error and that is not covered by most waurantees!!
Delete the wrong files and need fresh install, do it yourself or pay the price, not covered! Hit with virus, not covered! Install software that causes system crashes, fixin it is not covered! Sure sometimes a hard drive goes bad, that's covered, but then again buy a maxtor with 3 year waurantee and it's covered anyway by Maxtor just call them and ship it back. Costs you maybe $6 for UPS, big deal.

If you have a problem like I had today it may or may not be covered, not covered if you installed any drives yourself for sure!
Booted up wifes system, run awhile then crashed, would not boot a few times. Finally booted but wrong drive! Oh OH, I lost the main boot drive, now what. It had been making noises sometimes, spinning up wierd, crashed once before. Then I found I could not get to the slave drive either!What would you do??

Well I looked in device manager, neither hard drive was showing on IDE 1, I had booted to the secondary IDE slave drive. I shut down the system, pushed the Ide drive connecters onto the motherboard, both had loosened and were not all the way in. No more problems!
Why they came loose I don't know, just one of those things, but the 1 cable was not working and why 2 of my drives failed to be seen.

That's the advantage of building your own stuff, you can fix it too!
If it were a Dell or other I would be waiting a day or two or maybe even till Monday before the system would be working again, when they send some guy out to press the cables on!! Even worse if I had to take a system into a shop, or send it back to the company UPS!!!
Would I have to pay? Most likely yes, if any extra drives had been installed since I got it, they would probably claim that's why the cable was loose! Don't know if the Dell guy would care or not.

As for building it yourself, the hardest part is figuring out what parts you want to buy. My 13 year old has assembled computers already. True she had me showing her how when she was about 11, and watching me build them since she was about 8. But still a 13 yr old! Nothing hard about it.
All your parts will carry a manufactor warauntee at least. Buy from a great place like newegg.com for trouble free service. RMA is returning a defective part for a new one, and most the stuff you buy you can RMA back to newegg and they take care of it and send you a replacemnet soon as they get the old one back. In thoughsands of dollars worth of parts I only ever had to RMA back to them twice, both times was easy. No headaches or problems.

Alot of people would rather by prebuilt, and that's fine. Just know that all there is really to building most new computers is a few screws and plugging in some cables basically, a couple of clips like mounting the CPU heatsink. As far as software, not a big deal and you have to do it anyway if you ever upgrade the drive or have to reformat because of a virus!

Hey,

I Pmed you... LMK... Thanks for the Info aswell!

[budz]

Lordsmurf wrote:

VIA motherboards have got to be the biggest pieces of shit on the planet in this department. The VIA drivers are not very stable. I've got one. It's trash. It's new. I should have bit the bullet and gone INTEL chipset with an INTEL P4. This AMD was a cheap bastard mistake. If anything, I blame people like you for whooping and hollering "hey, whoopie, look at this, gee it's great" when it's really not

Everyone is entitled to their own experiences and opinions. I just want to state that I've built 4 computers with VIA CHIPSETS and never had a problem with them. I have to disagree with your comment Lordsmurf that VIA CHIPSETS are pieces of shit. As everyone knows not every computer component will be compatible. In my experience I have yet to have a problem using a motherboard with VIA CHIPSET.

The INTEL CHIPSET's have their own compatiblity problems. The INTEL APPLICATION ACCELERATOR has more compatiblity issues with some dvd burners & dvd/cd software & with some USB ports on a motherboard. Antec now encloses a memo in their cases that if the front or rear USB PORTS don't work to contact them for a replacement part. This is because using the IAA doesn't work on some motherboards and cases. 3 months ago this little memo was not included when you purchased one of their computer cases. I just built a computer and didn't install the IAA. If you look at forum sites at cdfreaks.com, you'll see IAA has known issues with certain dvd burners like Pioneer & Plextor. Too many variables are involved for one to certainly say VIA CHIPSETS aren't any good. It works for me!

[lordsmurf]

I've never had to use IAA.

Some of the Celeron-socket VIA motherboards are okay, I think my rant towards VIA is directed at AMD boards.

The PC I built will sometimes start up and the IDE drivers won't start up. You have to use mini-port drivers because the other ones won't work. That can sometimes translate into bad restarts and bad optical use (DVD, CD).

I've read up on the problem many times. Apparently, it's a flaw of the board design and Microsoft Windows. I've tried in vain to fix it over and over again. Just have to reboot and cross fingers. Chuck the underrun coasters and move on when they happen.

I should have just plunked down the bigger wad of cash up front instead of trying to build the "better bang for your buck" system. I paid for it in time, in the long run.

Definitely a lot of variables. That was really my point to begin with. Even for the best of us, building a PC yourself isn't always the best option.

As far as Maxtor drives, I have a dead one here, still covered by warranty. I don't even plan to take them up on that offer. I don't trust anything they make. Got myself a Seagate to replace it.

[jimmalenko]

OMG ! This thread is still going ?

@Bearbegr:
Have you bought your Dell yet ?

[dosun]

I think my rant towards VIA is directed at AMD boards.

When was this and what was the name of this chipset? It'd be really nice if you actually answered ANY of the questions that I've directed toward you throughout this thread. Here goes lordsmurf directing another uninformed rant toward VIA and AMD. This either has to have been years ago or you must be a pretty bad system builder. Current VIA boards do not have the issues that you claim to have. I've used both the KT333 and the KT400 chipset. No issues with either. Popular manufactures such as HP/Compaq, Alienware and Falcon Northwest all use VIA boards. I suspect your "vigorous" testing consists of nothing more than your failure to figure out how to correctly build a system. Thats why you like to buy your systems premade.

[pchan]

The VIA drivers are not very stable. I've got one. It's trash. It's new. I should have bit the bullet and gone INTEL chipset with an INTEL P4. This AMD was a cheap bastard mistake. If anything, I blame people like you for whooping and hollering "hey, whoopie, look at this, gee it's great" when it's really not.

I got a Abit Va10 (VIA chipset) mobo recently. That freaking thing didn't work with my anti-virus software and usb ADSL modem.

NO MORE VIA chipset mobo form me.

BTW.... I thrashed that freaking mobo.

[Bearbegr]

OMG ! This thread is still going ?

@Bearbegr:
Have you bought your Dell yet ?

LOL... I know... Is this like a record or somthing? I guess im glad though...

No I have not found a deal on a dell yet... Still lookin... LMK if anything comes up... Possibly in a new post... hehe

[Bearbegr]

I finally purchased a computer... It has 2 year warrenty, 512 MBram, 160 GB HD, 17" LCD MOnitor, DVD rom, CD RW, Floppy, Speakers, Graphics Card (non integrated)... So now I have one, thanks for all the help... All I have to do is order a DVD Burner from Newegg and I am set!

I am sure everyone is happy that its over, and now this post can finally die!

[Bearbegr]

Oh, and it was in my price range too!

[lordsmurf]

When was this and what was the name of this chipset? It'd be really nice if you actually answered ANY of the questions that I've directed toward you throughout this thread. Here goes lordsmurf directing another uninformed rant toward VIA and AMD. This either has to have been years ago or you must be a pretty bad system builder. Current VIA boards do not have the issues that you claim to have. I've used both the KT333 and the KT400 chipset. No issues with either. Popular manufactures such as HP/Compaq, Alienware and Falcon Northwest all use VIA boards. I suspect your "vigorous" testing consists of nothing more than your failure to figure out how to correctly build a system. Thats why you like to buy your systems premade.

It's the KT400. Piece of shit. ECS issued, came with high regards and lots of recommendations. The AMD is the 2700+ ... supposed to be a "top performer". The "better bang for your buck" combo. I got "banged" alright, and not in a good way.

The IDE drivers simply won't take. I've read more complaints on this than I care to online. I'm forced to use the miniport drivers and just deal with underruns from optics that hate the fake SCSI interface. Again, like I said, I just reboot and cross my fingers. Hell of a way to waste money. It normally reboots fine after 2-3 times. I've been building PCs for 10 years now, rarely have I seen a piece of junk like this ... and to think people actually like it. It's as bad as a proprietary older-school Gateway.

The AMD processor is only mildly better performing than the Celeron system it replaced. Again ... should have bit the bullet and bought a all-INTEL setup. At least it's not a primary system, so I don't complain about it too much. Mainly for audio work and some replication. Maybe some MPEG-1 encoding when needed.

A friend is having equal troubles with a KT333 system. He swore up and down his machine was great ... until a few months ago when he REALLY started to use it for more than games, checking e-mail and AIM. his is graphics related and some RAM and other errors. Again, some of it has been pretty well documented by angry users online.

I think the AMD lovers are game players. It may be great for video games, but it sucks all around as a machine for video and business.

I also was forced to uninstall NORTON anti-virus because the VIA KT400 would otherwise lockdown the system. That machine is not online much anyway, so I'm not too bothered by it. I can deal with a secondary system that is sort of trashy. I went the cheap route and that's what I ended up with. But for a primary system, all of those things would be ENTIRELY unacceptable.

[sacajaweeda]

ECS.....ugh. Whenever I see or hear somebody talking about an ECS board they just bought I hear that big goofy bully from the Simpsons (Nelson?) in my head.

HA-HA!

[dosun]

@lordsmurf

The board you use was a one or two(I can't pinpoint exactly since you didn't give me a model number) year old board and the chipset itself is over two years old.
earlier in the thread you said:

"It is AUGUST 2004. I suggest all posters stop dwelling on the past of PCs, and worry about how things are RIGHT NOW. That's what I've been doing. Nobody cares about systems made in 2003 and 2002 or whatever. Right now. August. 2004."

I know me and you aren't in agreement but shouldn't you be in agreement with yourself?


Your post clearly shows that you do not do enough research. Its easy to pick and choose the cheap componets for a system and then blame the CPU for all its issues. ECS had and still has a TERRIBLE reputation for a motherboard maker. They are the bottom of the barrel value board right next to PCCHIPS. They gained this during the Athlon Tbird days so don't say they didn't when you bought it. Professionals can make it work and like to use them because they are cheap. Also by the time KT400 came out, Nvidia had came out with their nforce2 option that offered way better performance. I don't know who recommended this to you but I think you'd better check your sources.

The AMD processor is only mildly better performing than the Celeron system it replaced.

How did you know this when you said you couldn't even get it to work? So you benchmarked your poorly built AMD system against a working celeron system? Great way to test vigoursly. AMD processors have no more stability issues than their Intel counterpart. Whatever extra is usually contributed by the peice of "hardware" outside the box. If you really are going to test vigorously build a working system or better yet pay for someone to build you a better system(since you can't seem to be able to for some reason). Falcon Northwest sells great systems(both AMD and Intel) and they have a superb reputation.

I think the AMD lovers are game players. It may be great for video games, but it sucks all around as a machine for video and business.

Wow, another opinion dervived from your vigorous testing and great sources? Plenty of top teir manufacturers sell them along with a VIA chipset motherboard. They don't seem to have issues making thousands of them work. I think you should try posting some of your advice in a real computer forum and see how many people share your experiences. You might actually even learn something. BTW, I'm neither for nor against AMD or Intel as I think fanboyism is stupid. Recommendations should go according with what the person wants to do, not because of your attachment toward some brand.

You still haven't answered any of my questions regarding Dell's use of proprietary hardware. So which is it? Are you staying Dell's own documents are lying or were you wrong?

[dosun]

NEW QUESTION: Dells can not be upgraded right? What about like DVD drives and cards readers etc.?

Good for you, you finally bought it. Dell's CAN be upgraded. Maybe you misunderstood with all the false informaton that's been floating around in here.

Dell systems accept all standard drives and pc cards provided the slot is available. An AGP video card will fit inside a Dell computer with an AGP slot.
The three parts I'd suggest you don't try to upgrade is the powersupply, motherboard and case. Some Dell machines use nonstandard parts.

[Bearbegr]

NEW QUESTION: Dells can not be upgraded right? What about like DVD drives and cards readers etc.?

Good for you, you finally bought it. Dell's CAN be upgraded. Maybe you misunderstood with all the false informaton that's been floating around in here.

Dell systems accept all standard drives and pc cards provided the slot is available. An AGP video card will fit inside a Dell computer with an AGP slot.
The three parts I'd watch out for when you attempt an upgrade is the motherboard, powersupply and the case since some Dell machines use nonstandard parts.

Cool... Those three things I will probably never upgrade anyways...

I am very happy I got it... But I guess it was not that great of a deal, cause after playing on dell.com for a little while I came up with the exact same thing for the exact same price... On mine I had to pay for shipping, and on the dell site you do not. So the prices just canceled eachother out... IE: both shipped are same price... So now im just you know excited about the PC, less excited about not getting a deal... But I got all the specs people say you need soo... Thanks for the info...

[lordsmurf]

The ECS was a new board, July 1st 2004. The board needed integrated audio/video, something not found on the nvideo boards available. After adding a card, it was too expensive. No bang for buck, just bucks going the nforce route.

I'm done with you, dosun. Go push your propaganda and attitude elsewhere.

I think the AMD/VIA boards are trash, and cannot in good faith recommend them to anybody. And I know for fact that the DELL systems I've seen in the past 2 years can accept upgrades A-OK using off-the-shelf parts (and if you're unsure, ask the salesman to verify, not that hard to do), and this has included at least TWO power supplies in that time.

The best system is generally one you buy piece by piece, and with ample budget to get good quality. Only you can do that for yourself.

[budz]

I am very happy I got it... But I guess it was not that great of a deal, cause after playing on dell.com for a little while I came up with the exact same thing for the exact same price... On mine I had to pay for shipping, and on the dell site you do not. So the prices just canceled eachother out... IE: both shipped are same price... So now im just you know excited about the PC, less excited about not getting a deal... But I got all the specs people say you need soo... Thanks for the info...

so you got your DELL PC off Ebay I suppose! "shrugs"

[Bearbegr]

I already talked to the guy, and he has already shipped them fedex... So Im sure its all good... its just sooo annoying that I did not get deal! I just did not want to wait anymore, and this system had everything already...

[dosun]

The ECS was a new board, July 1st 2004. The board needed integrated audio/video, something not found on the nvideo boards available. After adding a card, it was too expensive. No bang for buck, just bucks going the nforce route.

1) You may have bought the board new, but the chipset came out TWO years ago. So its still OLD technology regardless of when you bought it. Just like if I bought a PIII new right now, its still old tech. ECS is still a POS motherboard manufacture of when you bought it. Also reading your previous posts I'd find it hard to believe you would build a AMD system during JULY 2004.

2) Now you are just outright lying about the nvidia boards. If you actually bought the board during July of 2004 there were PLENTY of nforce2 boards that had intergraded video and sound for your choosing. Here is a whole list of them for your choosing and they did NOT just come out this month. In fact the higher price nforce boards have been hailed for their integrated sound system. Either you didn't research enough or you were just being cheap.

And I know for fact that the DELL systems I've seen in the past 2 years can accept upgrades A-OK using off-the-shelf parts (and if you're unsure, ask the salesman to verify, not that hard to do), and this has included at least TWO power supplies in that time.

Again you are providing an answer to a question that was never asked. I never said that ALL dell systems use nonstandard parts nor did I ever say they can't be upgraded. I said SOME of them use SOME nonstandard parts and you came right out saying it was false. You claimed ALL manufactures now use standard parts when Dell's OWN documentation disagrees with you. So which is it? Dell lying or you're lying?
BTW, I thought we weren't going to dwell on systems built two years ago and only focus on the ones built in 2004. Having a little MPD are we?

I'm done with you, dosun. Go push your propaganda and attitude elsewhere.

No no no, lordsmurf. Please look up propaganda in the dictionary if you don't know what it means. I have posted up tons of facts to back up my arguements. You choosing to ignore them doesn't make my statements propaganda. You on the other hand have posted up nothing from a third party and backed up your arguements with nothing but your words.
Yea, I agree you should stop responding before I catch you being wrong or contradicting yourself again.

[Bearbegr]

People! Can we please stop? Arnt we above this arguing? I can see you are trying to make your points, but now it is just dragging on and on... Many of the points already brought up are back again and again...

[budz]

in my opinion you should have just bought the DELL PC directly from them. hope the pc you bought off ebay doesn't go

[lordsmurf]

I hope you were very careful with that. I was talking to a friend not more than a week ago (a DELL employee), and he was telling me about the eBay scams. Only 1 or 2 are authorized DELL resellers. Some of the systems on eBay even have fake DELL stickers on them.

[Cobra]

dosun, cool it. Lordsmurf is entitled to his opinion, just the same as you. Your aggressive attitude towards him is unacceptable, and you will recieve a formal warning if you keep it up.

With regards to the VIA/nForce issue - I also build PCs. I have had no problems with either nForce or VIA chipsets. This is analogous to the Windows/MacOS or DVD- and DVD+R fights - it is individual opinion and tastes.

[smearbrick1]

I am very happy I got it... But I guess it was not that great of a deal, cause after playing on dell.com for a little while I came up with the exact same thing for the exact same price... On mine I had to pay for shipping, and on the dell site you do not. So the prices just canceled eachother out... IE: both shipped are same price... So now im just you know excited about the PC, less excited about not getting a deal... But I got all the specs people say you need soo... Thanks for the info...

Man... should have checked the Dell website first. Also, before you buy anything from Dell, check the web (not the dell website) for coupon codes. You can get great discounts on Dells not published on their site. I just bought a Dimension 8400 and saved over $450.00!!! ($150.00 mail in rebate + 15% Discount + $99.00 Shipping)

[lordsmurf]

This isn't what I'd buy, but an example of good deals:
http://www.bensbargains.net/ktalk/1093531755,93325,.shtml

Bens has a lot of these.