Are Illegal Movie Downloads Hurting The Industry?

[tgpo]

No. The Industry Shot Itself In The Foot

[tgm4883]

Yes, but not as much as they want us to believe. Here on campus I know a people who will download movies that are still in theaters. They wouldn't go to the theater to see the movie cause they are broke. However, there are always those people who watch it with us just so they don't have to pay for it. Usually if they like it enough they buy it when it comes out on DVD. For the most part I think the problem is the actual theater.

[housepig]

their shortsightedness and reliance on blockbusters is hurting them. not every movie needs a $50 million budget, and not every movie has to make $100 million to be a success.

I have no problem going to the theater and shelling out ticket money... when something worth seeing is playing.

in fact, they make even more off of me, because the last few movies that have brought me to the theater got me in there multiple times (Dawn of the Dead, Hellboy), and I'll buy the discs when they come out.

I saw Spiderman 2 last night, and I'll go back and see it at least once more, if not twice, with different friends. And I'll buy the dvd.

But they won't get my ass in the seat with stuff like White Chicks, The Stepford Wives, or Garfield.

[Cole]

Bootlegging only became a problem when VHS became widley available.
Don't remember bootlegging being a problem before the 80s. I don't think that the bootleg market in Super 8 was a viable one.

[MOVIEGEEK]

It's all your fault tgpo!
Your kung-fu videos have put Jet Li and Jackie Chan careers in a tailspin...how can they compete?

:P

Seriously,I think they do hurt the industry but I don't care.

[Treebeard]

Their figures of losses are totally incorrect. Most movies downloaded are because there is no way people would ever pay to see it in the first place so no money lost there. 2nd if they happen to like it they will probably pay to go the the theatre for the full experience of it and possibly buy it on dvd when it comes out. Another reason of downloading is that you already paid to see it in the theatre and the huge bucks you dropped only got you 1 sitting of it, so download to see it again until you can buy it on dvd.


Pirating has and will be here for as long as movies are made, they need to live w/ it.

[Cole]

My Father used to work in Shepperton Studios in the 60s as a scenery builder (he tiled the bath that Mick Jagger used in Performance) and he told me that back then the Unions had a stranglehold on the films budget where lots of people would stand behind the camera paid, but for no reason and that he eventually had to leave because he wouldn't *ahem* 'pay' the Shop Steward to get taken on for location work.

Seems the movie industy - like any industry - has problems from all directions.

Personally, I have never downloaded a film, as... well... I don't know where to find them

[Timmychuck]

I herd today that the first Spider-man made over 800 mil world wide.
You call that lossen money?
They only base movies that are still in the theaters. Movies make more
on dvd sales or merchandise.

[dphirschler]

I'll take it a step further. I'd say small time bootlegging is actually helping the movie and music industries. It doesn't directly generate revenue, but I think it does indirectly. I can't prove that claim though. That being said, I don't think they should be allowed to run amuck.

Downloading movies is good because it:

1) generates interest in movie watching

2) makes known a film (actor, director, etc.) that might have otherwise been overlooked

3) may lead to eventual DVD purchase or theater ticket buying

4) generates word of mouth promotion for certain films

5) generates sales for blank media and other computer equipment


... And doesn't harm the industry much (if any) because:

1) if it's a good film it will likely be viewed in the theater and/or on DVD

2) if it's a bad film they likely would not have paid for viewing at the theater or on DVD.

3) if it's downloaded by a hardcore fan, will will likely be viewed multiple times in the theater and on DVD

4) still may generate revenue from blank media purchaces (of which the industry should get a cut).


Darryl

[Darth Paris]

I think downloading may be hurting the industry a little, but not alot. The movies my friends and I download are movies that are ou of the theater, but not yet on DVD especially movies that take forever to come out on DVD. I don't see that as wrong because there is no way I could see the movie and I will buy it when it comes out on DVD.

[phuocle]

Downloading movies/pirating/stealing/whatever you want to call it is not hurting the movie industry; it's producing movies like Kung Pao Enter the Fist and Pootie Tang that's hurting the movie industry.

[Capmaster]

When they put out movies like "Driving In The Car With Boys", and want people to pay $8/ea. to go see it, they need to reassess their whole industry. They ought to pay us $8/ea. to go see it

As long as they see fit to pay the top stars $4,250 per minute, they'll have to charge more at the box office, and they do. Good movies make several times the costs in box office sales - some within only a few weeks. I don't understand just what it is that they're referring to when they say they've been "hurt" Hurt because they used to get a full return on investment in two weeks and now it takes three weeks?

[gitreel]

That pic is a classic cap. I think the industry shot itself in the foot.

[Spence]

Lets face it, piracy is the fault of the movie industry.
If we could buy the dvd's 4 weeks after the movie release in the theaters and they only cost £10, who would bother with piracy?
Piracy only exists because we have to wait too long for dvd release and then its too expensive.
The movie industry has CREATED the piracy industry through GREED.

[Capmaster]

Gitreel and Spence - Damn straight!!!! Whiney-baby whores wanting us to feel sorry for their predicament ...how bootlegging has hurt them. Give me a break. Any industry that can pay a single actor 30 million dollars for 6 month's work is not hurting.

They're not going to get my sympathy, or the sympathy of the blue-collar coal miner in PA who is making forty grand and hoping he can stay alive and fight off black-lung long enough to secure a pension for his family. Or the middle-school teacher scraping by on 25 grand who is entrusted with our kids' futures, in a society that worships the actor-celebrities and sports-celebrities to the point that the rules of civilized behavior no longer apply to them <*RANT MODE OFF*>

[tekkieman]

While it may hurt the industry (not near as much as they want us to believe), the biggest loss to the industry is the billions they spend on anti-piracy campaigns that do nothing to stop the mass production pirates, the (b?)(m?)illions greasing politicians, and the millions spent trying to outdo the budget of their last film.

I don't go to movies anymore. I prefer to wait until it's out on DVD. Far more comfortable watching from my own home, and the refreshments are much cheaper!

Personally, I'd rather see a small increase in rental prices and a tax on blank media, and let us rip to our heart's content. Or commercial DVD prices decrease. It might even help put the mass pirates out of business.... The rental places may not get repeat rentals, but they would get more volume.

There are legal pay-per-view sites, I get ads for them all the time. One will let you stream or download for $9.95/month. I can D/L over broadband during the day, and watch it when I get home at night. C'mon, the technology exists, let us use it the way that suits our needs. If we could get what we want, how we want, when we want, mass pirates would disappear before long.

This of course does not account for staggered releases, but make it simple. World-wide release on the same day. Simple enough.

[FKrueger]

it's probably like south park showed for the music industry, the downloading may delay someone from buying their son an island for his 10th birthday. The movie industry is way overpaid.

[RottenFoxBreath]

No. The Bigger Budgets of Crappy Movies Are Hurting Them.

there have been some stinkers lately,not about to name them,as one mans water is another mans poison,and all that.

i downloaded the lord of the rings..all 3 of them,but i bought them too,and went to see them at the pictures,same with kill bill,and others.
so i cant see what the problem is.

[Conquest10]

Gitreel and Spence - Damn straight!!!! Whiney-baby whores wanting us to feel sorry for their predicament ...how bootlegging has hurt them. Give me a break. Any industry that can pay a single actor 30 million dollars for 6 month's work is not hurting.

They're not going to get my sympathy, or the sympathy of the blue-collar coal miner in PA who is making forty grand and hoping he can stay alive and fight off black-lung long enough to secure a pension for his family. Or the middle-school teacher scraping by on 25 grand who is entrusted with our kids' futures, in a society that worships the actor-celebrities and sports-celebrities to the point that the rules of civilized behavior no longer apply to them <*RANT MODE OFF*>

That was beautiful. I'm sick of all those overpayed actors and how they're always like, "You don't know how tough it is to do this for a living." STFU.

Also, aren't like the top five grossing movies of all time all been released in the last decade?

[Gillies]

if there is any loss from bootlegging, it's just a drop in the ocean compared to the money they make.... the markup on dvd's is ridiculous. and the percentage of ppl who do use bootlegs would be tiny, so they should stop whinging

[888888]

Bootlegging doesn't hurt the movie industry. I think most people still see the same amount of movies in theaters they used to, it is just now they watch extra at home. Since movies are indeed art, I think it is only fair that the public have as much access to art as possible. Because of high prices, they can't afford to or just don't have the time to see so many movies in the theaters, but they can still watch crappy DivX bootlegs at home and pause, rewind etc. Besides, a movie theater is the experience itself, the big screen, speakers. That is why a lot of people go to the movies, not for the crappy plots. If they would bring back smoking in theaters, the industry would have a huge resurgence, especially here in New York.

Besides, isn't most money in theaters made from snack stands? People don't have to see the movie to buy M&Ms!

[Headbanger's Ball]

Hell no, crappy movies hurt them worse than anything. If piracy really hurt an industry, I'd think the porn people would be crying foul. There are TONS of pirated clips floating around on the internet & p2p. I haven't heard Ron Jeremy come out & say he's losing money because of the internet.









Of course....if he did come out & say he was losing money to piracy, what exactly could he resort to, to make money??? Porn?

[proxyx99]

There's no reliable source with the loss/gain statistics to answer this question. Studio's loss claims are extraorbitant based on anticipated (read: hoped for) sales also assuming that all their wishes (as to the surrounding circumstances) were granted.

Small scale piracy may be a solution for those who, for various reasons, would have never bought a DVD in the first place (mainly financial). On a large or industrial scale it affects mostly countries in less fortunate economical position. These countries are a write-off in terms of DVD sales anyways. Claiming losses then where no prospective sale could have ever taken place is not only hypocritical but also shameful and groundless.
Piracy, like with computers, drives (in those places) hardware markets, thus contributes a lot to the development of high tech markets and services (DVD-players, TV sets, personal computers, numerous hardware updates etc etc.). That is why, although Microsoft was officially complaining, they did nothing to seriously hinder piracy (look, for how many years!!!). Since there is also a psychological effect to it (stolen apple usually tastes better) the development and proliferation of technology is much more rapid.

This type of marketing (called "viral") is most effective. Customers in those countries (slowly) later become a part of a regular market. This is a well known scheme and while Studios have little or no prospects of making money hardware markets are now booming (to later bring Studios). By fighting piracy Studios add sizzle to already overheated markets.

What hurts AV product makers is the technology development but that is very difficult (if not impossible) to control. The rest is just a natural consequence of it. Markets would have died (or slowed down) anyway at some point for multitude of reasons. It is easy and convenient for Studios to blame piracy for their own failures or otherwise uncontrollable issues. History knows many examples in that respect.
To conclude: piracy helps in many respects. It's a fact. (can't argue with facts). Are Studios hurt by it? Doubtful, but if yes I would estimate their loss as marginal.

Now, if what I said is not true, ask Studios to try selling their high priced DVD's on the markets with no DVD-players.... or Microsoft to sell newest Office Suite in central Mali (no offence). Low cost products (medicines as well) can only fuel the economy. At currect prices a DVD would cost ...how much? a year of work...?

[SatStorm]

No. Bootlegging Has Been Around Forever.

Make the prices lower, rise the salaries of people worldwide, don't seperate the world at zones (as DVD tried to do), listen to your costumers, support the artists, update the music / movie biz model to today's standards, and make unhappy the only ones who are really happy with this situation today (managers, big ones, lawers, etc).
That way, bootlegging, warez, etc gonna disappear.

But who we are kidding? Revolusions happens once in 1000 years, and this is definatelly not the time....

[vioxx]

Yes! Illegal Movie DVDs 'back up' are also Hurting The Industry.

[MOVIEGEEK]

... don't seperate the world at zones (as DVD tried to do)...

I agree,I can play my audio CD's anywhere in the world...why should DVD's be any different?

[proxyx99]

Bootlegging has so insignignificant impact that I would hesitate to mention it anyway. I've been working for a huge company with sevaral hundred employees working their PC's. Young and old. Never heard anyone watched bootlegs or mentioned them even though this is a quite progressive forum, curious and following technology. I don't know or heard of anyone who has bootlegs and neither my kids. So where are those pirates? If computer savvy ignore them then it is not mainstream. Probably only 12-14 year old kids... and not too many as well. The issue is hugely overblown by studios to that degree that many don't know what's right or wrong. Somebody give some statistics here...

As to the rest (above)... wishful thinking. Now the "support the artist" issue: ... studios give them anywhere from 50 cents to 1 $ (Madonna, S.Twain and other megastars) royalty per disc (CD's). That is about 5-7% of the retail price of the disc. Close to 95% goes to studios and distribution. So no wonder that studios are crying foul. Shouldn't they care better for those who pay their salaries... and lavish lifestyles.

[haloblack]

I've said it once and I'll say it again, justifying piracy by saying that the actors are overpaid is 100% garbage. They don't throw $20M at random actors and hope for a hit. Once an actor has proven to be a draw then the money starts rolling in, and that's as quick to go as it is to come. You think Van Damme's still making $5M a picture? Hell, you think Vin Diesel's getting $20M a picture? He had one big hit and three years later his career just might be over. And don't start with the "I steal movies because teachers are more important and they only make $25k a year!" If they were that valuable to society then you'd say "Hmm... I have $20 in my pocket and it's Friday night. Should I go see a movie, or give the $20 to my kids' teacher since she's so important and valuable to society." Come on, be honest. How much money have you thrown at entertainment in the past year? How many times have you lobbied for higher teachers' salaries? How much effort do you make to see that those "valuable" teachers are better compensated?

Tom Cruise gets huge bucks because there's only one Tom Cruise. Teachers get the shaft because a) there's never a shortage of teachers (in general, it's possible in isolated areas), and b) anyone can be one. The day I can get a degree and fill out an application to be a $20M movie star and Sally the kindergarten teacher gets fired because her Q-scores are down and can't get hired anywhere else in the industry because she's "last year's news," then that argument will have some weight. Until then, teachers get paid less because they aren't worth it.

Oh, and then there's the fact that while 4 or 5 actors in the world get $20M a picture, the other 99.9% get by on an average of $5,000 a year.

Hollywood's guilty of some serious lying, deceit, and other shenanigans, but it doesn't automatically give us a free pass to do whatever we want. And I'm not acting all holier-than-thou, either. I've got several things on my computer that I didn't pay for, but I'm not trying to pretend it's for any reason other than I didn't want to spend the money to see it. Warez movies don't make you l33t, they don't make you a rebel, and they don't make you a freedom fighter. They just make you cheap and/or impatient, and I'm guilty as charged.

/me gets off soapbox.

[tekkieman]

Anyone else notice the incredible number of responses (votes) in this poll?

[Sabro]

So let me get this straight.... Instead of saying we have busted 3 teens taping SpiderMan2 in the theather, so that means we've lost approx $60.00 ($20.00 per DVD), they get to estimate their losses in the millions or billions.

Hmmm... nice tax write off when your generating 10x that and need a lil tax break.

<CEO> We've made billions of these suckers this year!

<CFO> Yeah, but we're gonna be hurting on taxes this year

<CEO> We'll blame it on piracy, teen kids and the mafia, that way we can
estimate billions of dollars lost in revenue.

<CFO> Good idea, and we can replace the cool cartoons in the theathers
with boring anti-piracy ads! And by the way, since we're saving
billions on tax write-offs, can I get a 1.3 million wage increase?

<CEO> Sure the stockholders will never know the difference, make it look
good on paper!


Not that I support or condone piracy in any shape, but do the pirates get to claim losses when the movie industry comes up with a new protection scheme, etc?

<Pirate-1> CHIT! Kiddy 549 got busted taping SpiderMan 2 last night!
<Pirate-2> Welp, we need to claim a 3.2 billion lost this year on taxes!
<Pirate-1> Yeah he was our main source of income! &*#^& night vision!



<ahem>

Sabro