Questions about interlace, DVD2AVI, & TMPGEnc

[nocarebear]

I want to back up Batman & Mr. Freeze: Sub-zero (animated movie) on to SVCD to be watched on my standalone DVD player.

The programs I'm using are SmartRipper>DVD2AVI>TMPG Plus>VCD Easy.

I ripped the movie just fine, but the next steps has gotten me to stall.

I previewed the vobs in DVD2AVI, and the video type it gave me was NTSC that was interlaced. I've done a few movies that were FILM and progressive, so all I did was "Force Film" and encoded it regularly with TMPG. Sub-Zero was in NTSC format so I didn't use the "Force Film" function in DVD2AVI. I encoded part of the movie and burned it to a CDRW, and when there were movements, there was a very visible combing effect. Later, I tried the "Force Film" function and there was still that combing effect during normal playback on my standalone DVD player.

This is what I did. I loaded the SVCD Template, clicked on the "Settings" button. On the "Video Tab", I didn't make any changes to the presets, so Frame Rate was 29.976 and for Encode Mode, I think it was Inverse 3:2 Pulldown.

On the "Advanced Tab"
Video source type : Interlace
Field Order: Top Field first (field A)
Source Aspect Ratio: 4:3 525 line (NTSC, 704 x 480)
And all the filter were left unchecked except for "Source Range"

With these settings, there was a combing effect, so I screwed up along the way, and I think the NTSC and interlace video has something to do with it. How would I remedy this?

On the "Video Tab," do I need to change the Frame Rate to 23.970?
On the "Advanced Tab," do I need to change the Encode mode to interlace because the source is interlace or change it to something else?

How does the source being interlace affect the video. When do I need to use de-interlace or IVTC?

I don't if this is useful or not, but from the d2v file, I made a dummy avi file and loaded it into virtualdub, and the framerate of was 29.970.

And questions for future reference, I found this on these forums:

anywayz, you need to find out if the source DVD video is FILM progressive (90+% FILM throughout majority of movie) or NTSC interlaced. best way is to load the vob files into dvd2avi and press f5. an info box will appear giving you the source video info. you need to watch that for a bit and see if the source video is FILM or NTSC.

1) if it's FILM, then you need to encode in tmpgenc as 23.976 fps + 3:2 pulldown and use the de-interlace (double adaptive) filter in the advanced setting.

All this time, I have just been using NTSC Film for "FILM" without the 3:2 pulldown nor the de-interlace filter. They VCDs looked fine, so is the 3:2 pulldown and deinterlace necssary when I make VCDs from a DVD source next time?

2) if it's NTSC, you need to encode as 29.97 fps + interlaced (NO 3:2 pulldown) and no filters. the "field order" setting under the advanced setting tab is extremely important in this case. you will get jumpy video if you have the wrong field order. so, do a test encode and burn CD-RW. also, keep in mind, if you encode like this, the SVCD will not look very good on your computer monitor (progressive), but will still
look goood on your TV (interlaced)

Does the above quote pretty much answer my initial question of how to encode a NTSC and interlaced video?

[adam]

Yes the last quote pretty much sums it up. This type of animation usually cannot successfully be inverse telecined to 23.976fps, so you are stuck with 29.97fps. Leaving it interlaced is probably best as well. You got the combing because your field order was wrong. Simply switch the field order in TMPGenc and re-encode. If you've still got encoded output you can simply switch the field order in pulldown.exe. That will only take a few minutes.

If you want to test field order in TMPGenc before encoding, enable the deinterlace filter and set it to even odd field (field). Scroll through the preview and if it looks ok then the field order is set correctly. If its jumpy or you see interlacing, then the field order is wrong so reverse it.

[nocarebear]

Yes the last quote pretty much sums it up. This type of animation usually cannot successfully be inverse telecined to 23.976fps, so you are stuck with 29.97fps. Leaving it interlaced is probably best as well. You got the combing because your field order was wrong. Simply switch the field order in TMPGenc and re-encode. If you've still got encoded output you can simply switch the field order in pulldown.exe. That will only take a few minutes.

If you want to test field order in TMPGenc before encoding, enable the deinterlace filter and set it to even odd field (field). Scroll through the preview and if it looks ok then the field order is set correctly. If its jumpy or you see interlacing, then the field order is wrong so reverse it.

You are correct. I did reverse the field order. When I looked at it frame by frame, sometimes the frame would go backwards.

And thank you for suggesting the pulldown.exe program. I did have the outputted file and was able to correct the field order. I'm glad I didn't have to recode again because that would have been another 6 1/2 hours.

I have a couple more questions concerning this quote:

anywayz, you need to find out if the source DVD video is FILM progressive (90+% FILM throughout majority of movie) or NTSC interlaced. best way is to load the vob files into dvd2avi and press f5. an info box will appear giving you the source video info. you need to watch that for a bit and see if the source video is FILM or NTSC.

1) if it's FILM, then you need to encode in tmpgenc as 23.976 fps + 3:2 pulldown and use the de-interlace (double adaptive) filter in the advanced setting.

If the movie is indeed FILM, I'll choose the NTSC Film template but why would I need the 3:2 pulldown to convert the 23.976 fps to 29.970 fps? Would using the regular NTSC template accomplish this because it encodes to 29.970 fps?

If the movie is progressive, do I still need to de-interlace it? Does de-interlacing the video make it absolutely sure that there are no traces of interlace in it?

[MaximumIce]

I am experiencing this combing effect issue as well,

I found this guide VERY helpful...http://www.clonead.co.uk/

-click on the video-cd link at the top - it will take you to a handy little guide.