"INDUCE" act will make VCR's and P2P Illegal...

[SatStorm]

The moral proxyx99, who visit east europe the each other day, for doing what he don't wish to hear as a word...

I never (and I mean never...) though I'll read that from him....

[Mr anderson]

to proxyx99 and anyone else, im sorry.

[crazeplaya]

It's things like this that make me even happier that I don't live in the US

[thegig]

As to guns etc. there is a saying that opportunity makes a thief (conversely: no opportunity less likelihood for a crime, just think about it for a sec.).

Hence my quote:

banning a tool is not going to stop an illegal activity, it's illegal - don't do it. Self restraint seems to have gone by the wayside, and excuses for it are rampant.

The gun made me do it. The VCR made me do it.

[Roundabout]

More today from Wired about this:

File-Trading Bill Stokes Fury

02:00 AM Jun. 24, 2004 PT

A new Senate bill aimed at punishing companies that encourage people to steal copyright materials met with a deluge of criticism from file-trading companies and tech industry groups that believe it could hamper development of new technologies.

Sponsored by Sen. Orrin Hatch (R-Utah), the Inducing of Copyright Infringement Act of 2004 would, in the senator's words, "simply confirm that existing law would allow artists to bring civil actions against parties who intend to induce others to infringe copyrights."

In a prepared statement, Hatch compared peer-to-peer networks, which allow people to exchange any digital content over their computers, to villains of literature and film, including a character in the movie Chitty Chitty Bang Bang who lured youngsters into danger with false promises of free lollipops. He said the networks should be held liable for creating technologies that enable often unwitting consumers to house pirated materials on their computers.

The Induce Act is the latest in a series of bills favorable to the music and motion picture industries introduced by Hatch, who co-authored the controversial 1998 Digital Millennium Copyright Act and introduced legislation in March that would allow the Justice Department to pursue civil cases against file sharers. In the past five years, Hatch has also received $158,000 in campaign contributions from the television, movie and music industries, according to the Center for Responsive Politics.

Hatch's bill enters the political fray as a panel of federal appeals judges in California continues to deliberate on a case filed by the recording industry challenging the legality of two of the most popular file-trading networks. The judges' decision, expected any day, will follow a lower court ruling that the two networks, Grokster and Morpheus, should not be held liable for copyright infringement committed by their users. That ruling, made last year, spurred the recording industry to file lawsuits against individual file traders rather the P2P networks they used.

Adam Eisgrau, executive director of P2P United, a group representing the file-trading industry, believes the Induce Act is an attempt by the recording industry to mute the unpleasant ramifications of a likely appeals court loss.

"It's a stealth maneuver intended to circumvent a line of cases emerging that peer-to-peer software is indeed legal to design, to make available and to use, on a case-by-case basis, depending on what you use it for," Eisgrau said. He characterized the Induce Act as an example of "big entertainment pulling big strings."

Fred von Lohmann, an attorney with the Electronic Frontier Foundation, said he's concerned that the bill could harm companies that seem to have nothing to do with illegal file trading. Looking at the legislation, he said, one could arguably make a case that any device that could be used to store or play illegally obtained files could be targeted in a lawsuit.

"If this bill were law, I could easily imagine suing Apple the very next day for inducing infringement for selling iPods," von Lohmann said.

Supporters of the Induce Act will likely have a hard time convincing a majority of the Senate to go along, said Gigi Sohn, president of the technology policy group Public Knowledge, who predicts a battle royal over its passage between the recording and computer technology industries.

For her part, Sohn believes the bill would essentially "take the guts out of" a legal standard that has been used over the last two decades to determine whether a technology developer can be held liable in infringement cases. That standard, upheld in a landmark Supreme Court ruling in a suit challenging the legality of the Sony Betamax, states that technologies that can be used for copyright infringement but also have substantial non-infringing uses do not violate the law.

"This (new) bill applies to all technologies, whether it's hardware or software. It doesn't make a difference whether your technology has substantial non-infringing uses," Sohn said. Theoretically, makers of devices with a broad variety of uses, including computers and copying machines, could be held liable for inducing infringement.

Another problem with the bill, said Will Rodger, director of public policy at the Computer and Communications Industry Association, which is pressing to block its passage, is that its authors do not provide a clear definition of what constitutes inducement.

"As we read it, reporters who wrote about peer-to-peer file-trading networks could well be charged with inducing infringement," he said. "Their definition of inducement seems to cover almost anything."

[Marvingj]

Next thing to do to Correct Society is to induce Sleep. So we can't Dream.

[Mr anderson]

just a quick Q? does this mean tht the P2P networks are gonna take the rap?

[proxyx99]

Probably move to Canada where they are completely legal.


Following Roudabout post:

I'm stunned by shortsightedness and outright idiocy of such proposal. I still cannot digest the fact that Hatch had the nerve to present such obvious product of a sick mind to the Senate. Calling this a law would put US Senate in the same league as German Reichstag. No clear definition, fully open to interpretation... that is a fascist dream come true. You can expect an avalanche of lawsuits following its introduction. Copyright and patent lawyers probably already have wetted their pants in anticipation of mountains of gold heading their way. They will make sure that any possible past, present and future infringement finds its day in court. It is way beyond my comprehension....

@Mr anderson: apology accepted (good example to follow... also for the benefit of all forum members).

[painkiller]

For what it is worth to all of us, before the DMCA and UCITA became new laws - they were also claimed to be "difficult to pass" at the time of their inception.

And yet ...


So the better question is, if so many of us know what is right - how come someone like us - isn't running for office?

[painkiller]

Sorry for stating the obvious - but, after reading Orrin's Press Release -

Sponsored by Sen. Orrin Hatch (R-Utah), the Inducing of Copyright Infringement Act of 2004 would, in the senator's words, "simply confirm that existing law would allow artists to bring civil actions against parties who intend to induce others to infringe copyrights."

One has to wonder exactly why this so-called learned Senator has to put forth a NEW bill for legislation when he states IN THE PRESS RELEASE that existing law would already allow for what HE has in mind.

Talk about "protecting one's phoney baloney job, gentlemen" (quoted from Mel Brook's Blazing Saddles - just to give the proper recognition here).

[thegig]

So the better question is, if so many of us know what is right - how come someone like us - isn't running for office?

MONEY
Abuse from your opponent towards you and your family
Intestinal fortitude to put up with a bunch of idiots all at once
Used to be a gentleman's club with honest disagreement, now it's a bunch of howling and screaming.


Of course you can never please all the people all the time. But you sure can piss off alot all at once :P

[indolikaa]

So Mr. Hatch was using unlicensed code on his website...

I do believe the dishonorable Senator from Utah needs to tell us all about his 'other' misdoings. Let's start with the money he receives from the RIAA and MPAA. I have some doubts that the number listed is an accurate reflection of the true love Mr. Hatch has for the industry.

He calls it a campaign contribution. I call it a bribe.

[choirislife923]

"...Thursday by Sen. Orrin Hatch, R-Utah..."

crazy republican...

IF it DOES get passed, watch michale moore be the new hero of america, not to mention all the democrats.

anybody think kerry would tap this into his campagin?

WOW...all the big corporations will run to the democrats and shove money up their butts. i can see it now...Sony, Panasonic, RCA, Phillips...i mean these guys make a living off of these devices. If this bill gets passed, THE WHOLE INDUSTRY IS SCREWED!

[Nilfennasion]

Anyone else thinking that the two-party system is failing Americans?

[indolikaa]

Anyone else thinking that the two-party system is failing Americans?

You are in violation of forum rules regarding politics and are being issued with a formal warning. While your question is completely legitimate, the only purpose of it is to stir hate and discontentment amongst Florida voters who couldn't punch a small pin through a perforated piece of paper to save their lives. Supreme2k will be visiting your residence shortly to lock this thread with his sharpie, at which time all of your worldly possession will be removed from your house, lest they be used to circumvent copyright protection in some form.
/Moderator Hatch

[Nilfennasion]

That wasn't what I had intended. Hell knows we are in the same boat in Australia, and I don't see it doing New Zealanders a lot of good, either. All I meant to say was that it doesn't seem worth going to the other side for help, because the other side is just a badly-dressed clone of this one. Ermmm...

[indolikaa]

That wasn't what I had intended. Hell knows we are in the same boat in Australia, and I don't see it doing New Zealanders a lot of good, either. All I meant to say was that it doesn't seem worth going to the other side for help, because the other side is just a badly-dressed clone of this one. Ermmm...

The two-party system DOES suck. All you have to do is offer enough campaign contributions and you can get any politician to support your cause. And that's why the average Joe is going to get screwed every single time. Look at how much the 'Industry' has already given to Hatch. That's a pretty decent amount for one's war chest, and this guy seems to be unbeatable in Utah to begin with.

Personally, I'd like to see the 'consumer' launch a campaign to have Hatch removed from office the old-fashioned way. Vote his ass out. But that would be a monumental task, given his pedigree.

[Mr anderson]

to proxyx99, no problem, i think that they need to re-think before they go doing something tht will cause problems? ( to all peeps in the uk DO NOT BUY THE O2 X1, nothing but problems)

[choirislife923]

I have a photographic memory,,,will they reposess my brain???
If they try l wont go down wiyhout a fight!!!

Men In Black style!

just look into the pen...

anyways, yeah, seems like american freedom and democracy just turned into a corporate dictatorship.

[beric3236]

I think that George Orwell had it right in the book 1984 - He only got it half right - it is Big Business and not Big government that we have to watch out for. As I keep saying "We have the best governement and justice system that money can buy."

[dxj40c]

This is gonna be a real problem for Sony....

They make movies...and all the means to copy them (VCRs, DVD/CD writers, etc). Wonder which one they're gonna give up?

[choirislife923]

WOW....video cassette PLAYERS!!! i haven't seem them in so long..maybe the big companies will start to produce them again...

...stupid bill...

[indolikaa]

This is gonna be a real problem for Sony....

They make movies...and all the means to copy them (VCRs, DVD/CD writers, etc). Wonder which one they're gonna give up?

I was just about to make the same observation.

They'll sit on the fence like they always do. Once they get a feel for who's likely to win the argument, they'll either bribe Hatch or pay him off to shut his mouth.

Their CE name is far too valuable to tarnish, I see them fighting it, but not in the public eye.

[Mr anderson]

o'well bang goes my vcr and so many good films tht u cant get on dvd

[dxj40c]

Congress members will always deny that contributions affect the way they vote, and contributors will always deny they are trying to affect legislation.

If that's so...lets funnel all contributions through a clearing house that passes the money on to the legislator but doesn't tell him who or where it came from. And make it illegal for either party to ask or tell. The "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" policy could work here.

Then, lets see how long it takes for the money to dry up.

[fritzi93]

The two-party system DOES suck.

Everything else ever tried sucks worse. I'll be safely dead long before the human race finally achieves Utopia.

Sheesh, politics again. You wanna get Satstorm started?

[Roundabout]

...and still more bad news. Looks like our esteemed senator ASS HATch has gotten some of his cronies to go along with him. What really gets me is where he talks about "moral authority" later in the article, while ignoring his own copyright violations (mentioned earlier in this thread). Read on...

Senate OKs antipiracy plan

The U.S. Senate on Friday overwhelmingly approved a controversial proposal that would let federal prosecutors file civil lawsuits against suspected copyright infringers, with fines reaching tens or even hundreds of thousands of dollars.

The so-called Pirate Act has raised alarms among copyright lawyers and lobbyists for peer-to-peer companies, who have been eyeing the recording industry's lawsuits against thousands of peer-to-peer users with trepidation. They worry that the Department of Justice could be even more ambitious.

Senate leaders scheduled Friday's vote under a procedure that required the unanimous consent of all members present. Now the Pirate Act, along with a related bill that criminalizes using camcorders in movie theaters, will be forwarded to the House of Representatives for approval.

"These acts will provide federal prosecutors with the flexibility and discretion to bring copyright infringement cases that best correspond to the nature of the crime and will assure that valuable works that are pirated before their public release date are protected," said Mitch Bainwol, chairman of the Recording Industry Association of America. Counting a new round of lawsuits filed this week, the RIAA has sued 3,429 people so far.

Friday's unanimous vote represents a key legislative victory for the entertainment industry, which has been lobbying fiercely for ways to halt the ever-growing popularity of file-swapping networks. Their reasoning: If civil lawsuits brought by the music industry haven't been enough of a deterrence, perhaps federal suits brought by the Justice Department will be.

One influential backer of the Pirate Act has been urging an avalanche of civil suits. "Tens of thousands of continuing civil enforcement actions might be needed to generate the necessary deterrence," Sen. Orrin Hatch, a Utah Republican, said when announcing his support for the bill. "I doubt that any nongovernmental organization has the resources or moral authority to pursue such a campaign." (Note: My emphasis)

"This turns the Department of Justice into a civil law firm for the industry's benefit," said Adam Eisgrau, the executive director of P2P United. Its members include BearShare, Blubster, Grokster, Morpehus and eDonkey.

[gitreel]

The induce act has been renamed

http://www.cdfreaks.com/news/9989

[Roundabout]

Soon to be renamed the "Stop Kiddy Porn and Vinyl Goatf**kers" Act.


Orrin reaches to accept another $1m contribution...

[gitreel]

Well that means Capmaster is in trouble then :P