DVDWS output quality- Does someone know the magic settings?

[sjmaye]

Can someone tell me the best settings to get some great looking output out of either of these programs?

I have been making this short video. Pretty much a short entry clip and then a 9 minute video. I have tried both programs to make this video. The clearest looking was out of DVDWS 1, but I did not run a scientific test. They were both set to run the BEST output at 60 minutes.

I looked at the results one after another and the one from DVDWS 2 was grainier and sort of out of focus.

The only thing different (that I could tell) was that the DVDWS 2 job was done on DVD+RW and the DVDWS 1 was done on DVD-R.

Does someone know the magic settings?

[p_l]

You can fiddle around with the settings in Ulead DVD Workshop 2, or do what I do and I think most people do: encode in TMPGEnc.

[sjmaye]

do what I do and I think most people do: encode inTMPGEnc.

Thanks for the reply p_l! pls bear with me, I am a newbie. Don't i have to "encode" in DVDWS in order to have menus and such?

I used media Studio Pro to edit the 9 minute video and create a mpeg2 file that I inserted in the DVDWS.

Do you mean for me to take the mpeg2, put it in to TMPGEnc, then? DVDWS to create menus? If so, what am I doing? different??


THANKS AGAIN FOR THE HELP!

[p_l]

What's your source? If you've already made an .MPG2, import it directly into DWS2. If you have DV or other .AVI, use TMPGEnc to make a good .mpg 2 DVD file (see these guides), then import that into DWS at the Edit page by clicking on the button I've illustrated. You can then create menus and everything.

[sjmaye]

I have done some experimenting. Part of the video I am using is a sample .mpg that came with Ulead MS Pro editor. The file name is "space". I had this clip along with a couple others chained together to make a small intro clip.

I was trying to find out where I was losing video quality. I took that small "space" clip and loaded it directly in to DVDWS. Picture preview clarity was perfect. Then I used MS Pro editor to create several files at different compression settings, square and non square pixel rendering,..... I even took TMPGEnc to make a few files with different compression settings.

Outcome? All of these showed video clarity degradation. The file from TMPGEnc showed the least. In looking at the original "space" file properties it shows this to have MPEG-1 compression. Based on what i read here it is already not the greatest quality to be working with in the first place.

All that being said- Am I on the right track? Should I expect to lose quality?

Another question- In trying to determine whether a file was MPEG-1 vs. MPEG-2 and was expecting the file to have a different suffix- i.e. space.mpg1 or something like that. Do both MPEG1 and MPEG2 file show the same suffix and the only way to see the difference by looking at the properties in a program such as TMPGEnc?

[p_l]

You're not re-encoding your .MPGs, are you? That's a sure way to lose quality.

By the way, .MPG 1 is VCD quality, and .MPG 2 is SVCD and DVD quality. Though .MPG 1 VCD is legal for DVD, it'll never be up to DVD quality, and you also need to resample the audio to 48 KHz.

May I recommend further reading on the subect? This site is a wealth of information. Start with the What Is section at the top left of this page, and also have a look at the How To and F.A.Q.

It's also been my experience that Ulead DVD Workshop 2 does not re-encode compliant files unless they exceed your project properties (Disc Template) or you've checked the box for Convert to Disc Template on the Edit page. So I don't believe it is necessary to to jump through all the hoops suggested by Jerry Jones' tutorial to get your Disc Template to precisely match your file properties. In practical terms, this means just to select High Quality as your Disc Template, or High Quality (Dolby Digital AC-3 audio) if you want it to convert your audio to .AC3, and your DVD-compliant files wont be reconverted if they don't exceed 8,000 Kbps.

[sjmaye]

You're not re-encoding your .MPGs, are you? That's a sure way to lose quality.

The file is an MPEG1. I put it in Media Studio Pro Editor along with some titles and transitions to make a introduction video. I clicked "create video file" and the output is set to MPEG.

If this is reencoding, how can I go about editing video, adding transitions, and such without reencoding? Isn't editing where you split, add, subtract, filter and such in order to create a new video clip?

May I recommend further reading on the subect?

Oh my, there is no doubt I could do with some more reading. I have read through this site TONS over the last year, I just must still be missing something.

Let me clarify something about my testing in the previous post. What I did was made a number of files with different settings in noth Media Studio Pro editor and TMPGEnc. I placed them in DVDWS only to preview them next to the original. I never actually burned them on a DVD. I did not want to waste them.

I can understand that you should lose a tiny portion of the clarity each time you encode, but how can you avoid that if you are doing editing to create a video that will be later dumped in your authoring program.

p_l- I really appreciate your help. I will read on.

Steve

[p_l]

If you edit your .MPGs, adding transitions, titles and whatnot, then there is no choice but to render (re-encode), you're right.

When you say you preview your file, how and when are you doing that? Before Media Studio Pro, after it or in DWS2's preview? There is a way to preview your actual final result without actually burning a DVD. On the Finish page, click on the Burn Project to Disc button, then in the Burn Project to Disc dialog box, uncheck Burn to disc, but check Create DVD folders and/or Create disc image file. When it's done, drag and drop the resulting VIDEO_TS folder into your software DVD player, for example WinDVD or PowerDVD, or mount your .ISO file with a virtual drive, for example with Daemon Tools.

[sjmaye]

When you say you preview your file, how and when are you doing that? Before Media Studio Pro, after it or in DWS2's preview?

The clips made with the various settings were made with MS Pro. I took all of them and inserted them in to DVDWS as separate "titles" and used the preview screen immediatley above that to preview.

There is a way to preview your actual final result without actually burning a DVD. On the Finish page, click on the Burn Project to Disc button, then in the Burn Project to Disc dialog box, uncheck Burn to disc, but check Create DVD folders and/or Create disc image file. When it's done, drag and drop the resulting VIDEO_TS folder into your software DVD player

I never thought of that. That would be even better for seeing exactly what I would be getting when finally buring to DVD.

Thanks- I will give that a try.


Something else- I read more (as you suggested) and I saw something interesting about rendering .AVI files in MS Pro. It said I should render (to .AVI) with zero compression. It said if I did that it would not rerender that at all except at the point of titles and transitions.

Is something like this true for working with MPEG?

[sjmaye]

Also can you tell me an easy way I can tell a MPEG 2 clip vs. and MPEG 1 clip? I see I can load them individually in to TMPGEnc and see it in the lower left corner, but is there a simple way for me to know without loading the files in a program?

[bmiller]

I use Dvdws 1.3.I create and edit mpegs outside of dvdws.When i import the video files into dvdws,add menus,chapters,etc. i go to create dvd- custom 720x480,select ac3 as my audio choice,and the trick,select the bitrate at a higher value than your mpegs ie. 8000+ and it will only reencode the audio and not reencode your video.That way i have mpegs with ac3 audio.I usually make a dvd directory if i'm not sure the video will fit onto 1 dvd.If it is a little to large,you can run it through dvd shrink,clonedvd,dvd2one etc. to get a proper fit and burn.Works everytime for me.
You can tell if it is only reencoding audio.When you hit start,dvdws will say audio only.If it is doing video too,it will say encoding video and audio.
That is where you are loosing quality.I'm talking mpeg 2's only not mpeg1's.

[sjmaye]

Thanks, bmiller. I will try that.

I am glad you mentioned the AC-3 for sound. I did not remember seeing this setting so I went to see where it was at burn to disc. I found it along with the compression setting. Compression was set at the default of 70%. I remember some time ago I adjusted this to the highest quality possible and saw some really significant results.

I went ahead and adjusted my "high quality dvd" disc template to automatically select AC-3 audio and the lowest possible compression as defaults.

Thanks for the tip.

[bmiller]

Setting the quality is one thing.On the compression tab,select the bitrate setting to cbr 8000-9000 kbs/sec.If your mpeg is say 5000 kbs/sec,and you select the max. setting it won't re-encode your video,only the audio.Ac3 will play in all dvd players,where as mp2 audio is hit and miss.Pcm audio is to big a file to even consider.

[sjmaye]

got it!