Yet another thread about an update is quickly degenerating into a flame-fest. What's going to happen is that the forum will eventually be overrun by people with nothing better to do than post "this or that sucks" messages, and those of us who come here to exchange useful information will find somewhere else to go. It would be a shame to see such a great site succumb to this sort of thing, but it's pretty clear that the site's owner will only intervene after things have gotten far to out of hand. All it takes is a friendly reminder.
What's particularly inexcusable is when a moderator engages in this behavior. There are people who like to ignite flame wars, and those who like to argue for its own sake. There are already many sites where they can do it to their hearts' content without bringing it here.....
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What some people tend for forget that simply making a statement like "Nero/Windows/whatever sucks" is not the least bit informative, and is of little to no interest to anyone who doesn't share their opinions, unless they simply like to argue for the sake of arguing. If they'd say, "I dont use this product because of ABC", then they'd be providing useful information.
This reminds me of a certain group of Mac users who used to show up at the store where I worked and actually confront people who chose to use Windows, as if it were any of their business to begin with. Plus, their opinions were not solicited. One went so far as to declare that all Microsoft bar codes contained the numbers "666". Whatever made this loony tunes think that this would convince people to buy a Macintosh was beyond a lot of us.
People need to accept a fundamental rule of computing: Individual results may vary; what works for you may not work for someone else, and vice versa. They have yet to present a valid reason for how they are in any way harmed when someone else chooses to use a product they wouldn't use themselves. There is no way they should feel in any way threatened, and there's no reason it should be tolerated....
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Originally Posted by JohnnyC
EDIT: I swear on Capmaster's Wynonna Rider doll I WILL LEARN HOW TO USE THE QUOTE SYSTEM AT VIDEOHELP.COM!
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That's an excellent example! I had nothing but trouble with WinME, as did many others, but that doesn't mean everyone will have problems with it. I know of at least 2 people for whom it worked fine, if not actually better than Win 98....
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I just posted my 3000th post. There was no point to it. It is supposed to be funny. Nothing more, nothing less.
If you look for the fun in each post, you'll be a happier person when you're here. I just don't understand why some people can't understand this.
Certain times, a good ass-kicking is called for. Otherwise, have some fun.
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I have no problem with having fun. Otherwise, I wouldn't have created Johnny C-Note's Joint. It's people who are only looking to pick fights that I'm referring to. A message like "Nero sucks" doesn't strike me as being written by someone who's looking for "fun".....
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There are a few people here who think their shit doesn't stink. Unless they are a vegan, it sure as hell does, let me tell you
There is a line between useful, humorous and flaming posts. I'd like to think that I only trawl between the first two categories, but invariably I'm sure I've probably flamed someone for having what I regard as fucked up ideas.
Unfortunately, the internet promotes anonymity. This means that a lot of people are happy to hide behind an alias and entertain themselves. The unfortunate reality is that most of those who only flame are probably pimple-headed 14 year olds showing off to their mates. You cannot afford to wear your heart on your sleeve, because as soon as you air your thoughts in a public forum, you are subject to opinions good and bad. Whilst serving no purpose for a greater good, people are entitled to flame if they so desire.If in doubt, Google it.
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Originally Posted by jimmalenko
And I have said for a long time that the anonymity factor is what causes many of the problems around here.
How many members would carry on in person like they do here?
I would. I'm just as big an ******* in person as I am in cyberspace. More so in person, because I spend a lot of my time cleaning up other people's screw-ups. So I myself don't see the difference between flaming someone here who truly deserves it, and doing the same thing on a daily basis at work. So it was written, so it shall be flamed.
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Originally Posted by indolikaa
They then crack the shits when they get told to go back to primary (elementary) school and learn how to READ again. Or to use the SEARCH button. All this, after having agreed to the AUP, which clearly states that you should attempt some research before posting on this site.
I personally draw the line at name calling. I do agree though. If you are ignorant, you deserve to get flamed.
[EDIT]People writing in ALL CAPS. Why ???If in doubt, Google it.
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Why bother trying to be helpful? Only for my own satisfaction. I don't depend on others for that. True, some people don't have a clue. Not my problem. If I don't like their post, I ignore it. If you want the best reason to be here (From the front page of the forum):
Our users have posted a total of 813580 articles
We have 79419 registered users
The newest registered user is divakarp
In total there are 99 users online :: 14 Registered, 2 Hidden and 83 Guests [ Administrator ] [ Moderator ]
Most users ever online was 287 on Jan 11, 2004 09:52
Registered Users: beavereater, Dunnyman, EvergreenTerrace, jimmalenko, markusb, mickle, Neminat0R, nexus123, presto, p_l, redwudz, StoneColdWhat, taz, Zechnubis
This data is based on users active over the past five minutes
I think that's pretty impressive.
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Before I even get to the bottom of this thread, I gotta interject that Indolikaa is as full of shit as a Christmas goose. He did NOT invent oxygen.
Cheers,
George
Some of you just might believe him, and that would be a tragedy. Hell some of you are still in school,and if a prof asked you who, and you said Indolikaa, he'd probably have to check to see if you were right. There goes a whole class, shot to hell.
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I have the copyright to oxygen.
This means indolikaa is poor whereas I am rich.
- John "FulciLives" Coleman"The eyes are the first thing that you have to destroy ... because they have seen too many bad things" - Lucio Fulci
EXPLORE THE FILMS OF LUCIO FULCI - THE MAESTRO OF GORE
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Why I'm helpfull?
This is my payback! I mean, people here helped me once, for free. I don't believe that such thing as "free" exist. Even if someone gives you something for free, you have to give him something for free too. This is the difference we have from the animals.
This has nothing to do with the values. It has to do with the action. For example, the help I had was A and the payback to this community from me is 3 times A. Let's say I'm an exception, a "let's give back more" type of guy. (BTW: I'm the worst enemy of those who get and don't give back NOTHING).
But imagine how better this ******* world could be, if for each thing we get for free, we payback for free to others a half or even a quarter of it !
About this specific board here and this "scene", "hobby", call it whatever you wish, there is a problem: All the issues are solved! What I mean: Years ago, you had to try a lot to do this stuff we are doing here. We was a small worldwide community of openminded people with thirst about video convertions. You could see here only adults, people who was here for a reason. The enthusiasm was great, anything was new back then.
Today, you can get a cheap "X" card, a "Do it all" software, hit a couple of buttons and you end up with pretty damn good results! Don't mention those standalone recorders. OK, you don't get the 100% of what you can with those solutions, but it is realtime! And that's what counts for most users.
Today, those who keep using PCs for this are devided to 2 parts: Most of them are programmers, developers. Those don't really care about converting whatever to whatever, but how they can make convert whatever to whatever. Most of them made programs and offer (mostly freeware) solutions, good ones, but themselfs never even use them. They are happy just for making so. You can find them on other forums (they don't stay in videohelp.com)
Others, much less, are the so called true enthusiasts of this hobby. Advance - overall - PC users, with limited or not at all programming skills, GUI users whose simply wish to convert with a certain care and personal determination their precious tapes / video sources to something digital. They can be anything: Music video or Cartoon collectors are the most passionet of all. Those few users are the minnority and also, after they learn how to do it, they don't have to keep searching on forums about it. They know how to do their stuff and now focus on their hobby. The real reason they started this. But before they leave, they help others as a payback. Being enthusiasts also make them need to express themselfs in a positive way. So, very often, you see guides from them, some really great, just a month or more before they stop posting.
Finally, we have those who like forums, expecially international ones focusing on specific subjects. This forum here for example, is focusing basicly for video, but also covers technology overall. They don't have to learn something more, but they don't feel that they have to leave. So, they start advising others - their way of course- or posting off topic subjects. This is the result of the friendly place we have here. Just try to do this elsewhere...
The last year, the "non topic" users rised a lot. Even me, I start posting off topic things. And since nothing new happened in the scene, I don't see how that can change. To be honest, the only new thing the last year I have to learn, was how to capture and set up mainconcept 1.4.2. It took me 2 weeks to learn it and a month to test it further. That's it. Now I'm sitting waiting something new to happen.
The flame wars is a subject to analyse so to understand it. I can determine when the flame wars appeared
1 - When someone do something obvious stupid. Newbies are the usuals on this
2 - When someone try to teach others and don't accept doubts / questions
3 - When you doubt "what the experts said". For some reason, followers appeared in this hobby and if you doubt their leader you are their worst enemy! I know, I doubt many things in this hobby and that's why I receive attacks overall...
4 - When the non North Americans doubt or try to show to the North Americans their differend non american side of things.
5 - When the non native english speaking users get attacked from ass kicking english speaking users. The stupiest flame wars of all. To all them I suggest to learn a couple of languages before attacking us
6 - When someone is here only to cause trouble. Yes, those users exist. Or they are simply doing fun that way, or they are baned, egoists, egocentric former users, returning to the forum only to hurt it.
7 - Spammers.
And other reasons I don't have time to count now.
Finally, another answer to the question: "Why bother trying to be helpful?" could easily be "To keep a FREE and usefull forum alive". If we don't do that, then commercial forums gonna appear and the knowledge gonna turn something for those who can offer for it.
And I can speak for that: I don't have a simply Euro to donate to this site. But what count more? 100 Euros I could donate or the 4 guides I offered in this site for free?
Anyway, as some of you probably now, after I finish a guide I'm writing those days about DVB, I gonna stop posting here. Maybe for a short period, maybe forever.
Why?
Because I'm 4 years in this forum, with 95% of my post being answers to others (only rarelly ask something myself) and with 4 guides.
What's the problem with that?
Because I'm not a moderator, I'm getting attacks all the time, in a personal or public level, from stupid people, which I'm sure that they wouldn't even try to do it, if I was named a "mod"
What I learned from the forums all those years, is that if you are somewhere for long, you have to became "moderator". Otherwise, in the eyes of the other users, you look a looser. A nothing. Forums manage to graduate users by turning them "Moderators". And since I'm not a mod, I'm a looser in their eyes.
In my case, and after all this negative feedback I had recently (thank you for this - you know who you are), the only solution I see to keep posting here, is Baldrick turn me to a moderator, just for the title. Newbies / Newcomers afraid to attack mods and that would help me a lot nowdays...
Don't mention that someone - with knowledge of those subjects - has to clean up this mess on the comment lists! (that could be my task in this forum, clean up the mess on the reports about the capture cards, the tools, etc).
Anyway, this turned long again, I stop here...
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As far as the subject of new members goes, people need to remember that everyone has to start somewhere. This site is huge and it can be a bit daunting to someone who doesn't know his way around. Rather than take advantage of a newcomer's ingnorance to get in a cheap shot, why not simply post something like "check this out" and provide a link? If they get too demanding or unreasonable, that's where a moderator should step on. Otherwise, the best way to deal with it is simply ignore the guy....
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It comes down to respect. This involves respecting others even if they're noobs, if they're flat-out wrong, if they're English isn't very good, if their opinion differs from yours, or if they're not as smart as you believe yourself to be. Flaming often starts when someone feels they haven't been extended the courtesy of basic respect.
The exception being when someone flames for the sake of flaming. These people only exist to elicit responses from others. They wouldn't do it as much if there weren't people that take the bait. All I know is that it takes a bigger person to walk away from a nasty arguement.
Why even bother trading blows? To defend one's sullied "honor"? What a complete waste of time. Threads like that only get locked anyways. It is possible to have a civilized discussion consisting of multiple viewpoints without things resorting to petty bickering. It comes down to respect.
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Originally Posted by redwudz
Originally Posted by teegee420
Private messages are wonderful things. If someone is arguing or is being offensive and I have somehow become involved, I PM them and try to sort it out. The difference in their behaviour is incredible - they won't lose face in public so they make an effort to sort something out civilly. So, why not sort more out with PMs as opposed to dragging it along in public?
Originally Posted by indolikaa
Anyway, 'nuff said on this matter.
Cobra
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Cobra
Private messages are wonderful things. If someone is arguing or is being offensive and I have somehow become involved, I PM them and try to sort it out.
but on this topic, without any personality or argueing this life would be pretty damn boring. if the without is your attitude im scurred cause your probably a government official. the truth is somewhere in the middle of debate.
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Originally Posted by glockjs
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Originally Posted by Baldrick
Commnts like that indicate ignorance in my book.
Should read "Nero sucked for me".If in doubt, Google it.
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That is much better !!! NERO SUCKED FOR YO U
Personally I have used Nero for about 4 years plus without issues...
So perhaps it should read "people who cant use NERO have computers that suck" or better
It SUCKS not to be able to use NERO as other do....
Or , my personal favorite
You cant use NERO because you SUCK !!!
All said as a joke so nobody get bent....
Now if you want to talk ROXIO products....MY GOD, they should come with kneepads because THEY SUCK NO MATTER WHO USES THEM...
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