DVD9 to MPEG-4 ?

[Defcon]

Curious, after checking through the guides to the left on conversion I have a couple questions.....

1. Is this a common conversion ?

2. Any major quality loss ?

3. Which conversion tools would you recommend ?

4. Could multiple MPEG-4 movies then be burned to a single DVD or VCD/SVCD only ?

I am checkin out doom9 site now, but Any advice on this topic would be greatly appreciated. Thanks

[teegee420]

Considering the proliferation of Divx/Xvid movies on peer to peer networks such as Kazaa, I would say it is a very common conversion. If encoded at a reasonable bitrate(>1100kbps IMHO) there will be some quality loss, but nothing dramatic. In fact many people can't tell a difference at all. You can easily put 3-4 full length mpeg-4 movies on one DVD-R depending on bitrate used and the running time of each film. The only problem is that your playback options are limited to PC's and mpeg-4 enabled DVD set top players. For CD media, I wouldn't try to put more than 90 minutes on a single CD-R. That's only a personal preference though. You didn't mention this specifcaly but in case you are wondering, keeping menu functionality and extras intact isn't something that is really possible.

[dcsos]

A DVD will store over 4 gigabytes of DATA..
However if you convert the original to MPEG-4 of any kind...
the result will not play on your DVD PLAYER

So the bit rate considerations are open to you and with MPG-4 compression, you might be able to get 4 to 6 hrs squeezed on there..
But once again..this disc willl only read on the computer after conversion..
Also, you'd have to know how to handle interactive media ..if you wanted a menu or such.

Right now a very few companies are making new players which will play one MPEG-4 format right offa a DVD or CD surface.. These are brand new and the codec is WMV-9 only

[Defcon]

I see..... I though MPEG-4 could be burned to DVD... Isn't DVD9 MPEG-2 ?

The player I have indicates it will play MPEG-4 (Standard Format) and is not really a big deal, would like to try to burn a few movies that way and see how good they turn out. Whether CD or DVD...

[teegee420]

DVD video is mpeg-2, yes. Good luck with your project.

[Defcon]

Thanks TeeGee !!!!

BTW, what movie is that for your signature..... Vampire Effect ?

[teegee420]

Nope, Kill Bill Volume I. Her name's Chiaki Kuriyama, though in the film her name was Gogo.

[dcsos]

The player I have indicates it will play MPEG-4 (Standard Format)

Doubt it!
Check again

[Defcon]

It does..... JVC XV-N312S

[FulciLives]

It does..... JVC XV-N312S

This is a USA model right?

I found it on the USA JVC website but when I tried to look up the manual I couldn't find it.

Normally I have done this before without any problems so I'm thinking that perhaps this model is so new that JVC just hasn't gotten around to putting the manual up on the website yet.

Here is what the website says about it:

The JVC XV-N312S slim and stylish design is a great value "all-in-one" player. Not only does it play DVD & CD; it also plays CD-R/RW recordable CD formats, DVD-R, DVD-RW (video format), SVCD, VCD, MP3, JPEG and MPEG-4 (Simple Profile) formats. The XV-N312S is packed with many exciting features such as Express Play Start, Disc Memory Resume Function for up to 30 discs, 1.5x's Quick Playback with sound, Variable and Slow Search, 3-Step Zoom Play, One Touch Instant Replay and Resume (Bookmark) function. Coaxial digital audio output with Dolby Digital & DTS pass-through is provided for easy connection to any system.

My guess is like some PANASONIC units this is the same type of MPEG-4 that digital cameras (and maybe some cams) are capable of ... which is a very poor format as the resolution is tiny and bitrate is really low.

But I thought I would double check the manual to make sure ... but of course no joy there.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

P.S.
You can PURCHASE a manual for this item but you can't download it!

[Defcon]

I grabbed the manual and it does not say to much about the files types (For Most Formats) But it says this about MPEG-4.

For MPEG-4 files:
-This player supports the type of simple profile and asf as MPEG-4 files.
-To play back MPEG-4 files created on a digital still/video camera on this player, record them on CD-R/RW disc and play it back.
-The size of the playback screen will be the same as it is recorded.
-Some MPEG-4 files created on a personal computer may not be played back.

And in the troubleshooting section indicates that basically the file extension must be .ASF or .asf. For VCD etc. will only recognize ISO 9660 and will not recognize UDF packet writing.

[FulciLives]

I grabbed the manual and it does not say to much about the files types (For Most Formats) But it says this about MPEG-4.

For MPEG-4 files:
-This player supports the type of simple profile and asf as MPEG-4 files.
-To play back MPEG-4 files created on a digital still/video camera on this player, record them on CD-R/RW disc and play it back.
-The size of the playback screen will be the same as it is recorded.
-Some MPEG-4 files created on a personal computer may not be played back.

And in the troubleshooting section indicates that basically the file extension must be .ASF or .asf. For VCD etc. will only recognize ISO 9660 and will not recognize UDF packet writing.

As I thought ... this type of MPEG-4 brings no joy.

You need something that does Simple Advanced Profile.

So far very few of those around although according to DivX.com JVC has 2 forthcomming models that will be DivX Certified for the Home Theatre Profile which is basically Advanced Simple Profile.

Your model is not one of the two listed.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[dcsos]

What Fulci says indicates to me that even if you do get MPEG-4 playing in the JVC, you'd never play these "special discs" you create in your home sysytem only anywhwere else..

Sorry I doubted the capabilities of the Machine, I guess more and more of them do play odd formats.

But DVD istself is the AGREED on format.. So why not go for relyability..why suppose the JVC broke down aftre you went to the trouble of creating such special discs?

[Defcon]

Your right.... I'll just stick w/ DVD9 to DVD backups. Thought it would be neat to get several movies on one DVD w/o much loss of quality... Oh well

Thanks for the help guys !!!!

[FulciLives]

Your right.... I'll just stick w/ DVD9 to DVD backups. Thought it would be neat to get several movies on one DVD w/o much loss of quality... Oh well

Thanks for the help guys !!!!

MPEG-4 codecs such as DivX and Xvid can be used to create very high quality back-ups but right now there are very few stand alone DVD players that can handle that type of "high quality" MPEG-4 file.

It's a shame really ... DivX Networks is really dropping the ball here ... they should have been much faster to market with this stuff.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[teegee420]

Very true. To be honest though, I've been extremely impressed by the small handfull of players that have surfaced over the last year. I've read some pretty good things about them but what impresses me the most is how it was only a year and a half ago that I was reading that mpeg-4 enabled stand alones would never be released because only a PC could produce enough CPU horsepower to handle such a highly compressed format. 6 months later I saw a demo of a mpeg-4 capable player at the local PC Club. Hell, not long ago we were told that dual-layer DVD burning couldn't be done at the consumer level. How cool is it to be living in a time where technology improves at a rate comparable to that of the passing seasons?

[dcsos]

So what they're saying is you may have a great idea but you may be a little early with it

If you use the WMV file type or the .ASF format, you may have something that'll still be playable easily tomorrow.
But you might need to wactch which formats break out in the coming months..
If they adopt the MICROSOFT WM-9...for hi-def titles (the forum is deciding now) then it would be true that all the players coming out would play this format..they'll know in a month or so

[teegee420]

So what they're saying is you may have a great idea but you may be a little early with it

Not necessarily. There are more than a few players now that can handle high quality mpeg-4 video quite admirably(check the DVD Players section). It just so happens that Defcon's player isn't one of them.

Personally, I don't think I'll be encoding to WMV9 until it can be worked with as easily as the avi container. With avi you can easily multiplex and demux, have multiple audio streams, apply a number of filters and encode at non-standard resolutions. If and when such flexibility is allowed by Microsoft with WMV9 I'll be sticking with Divx/Xvid.

[dcsos]

I agree

If and when such flexibility is allowed by Microsoft

and that's just what we should get if the FORUM accepts the FORMAT..
so instedda control..MICROSOFT will religuish control to the format..
for $$$$$$, that could work out to be 10cents per player in their pocket))

[RabidDog]

If and when such flexibility is allowed by Microsoft with WMV9 I'll be sticking with Divx/Xvid.

What you have stated is the exact opposite of what you mean AFAIK
Until such flexibility is allowed by Microsoft with WMV9 I'll be sticking with Divx/Xvid.
perhaps??

4. Could multiple MPEG-4 movies then be burned to a single DVD or VCD/SVCD only

yes, I think you could get three or four excellent quality backups per dvd
No menus or extras tho.

[teegee420]

If and when such flexibility is allowed by Microsoft with WMV9 I'll be sticking with Divx/Xvid.

What you have stated is the exact opposite of what you mean AFAIK
Until such flexibility is allowed by Microsoft with WMV9 I'll be sticking with Divx/Xvid.
perhaps??

You're right. I definitely should have proof-read that one more carefully.
:P

[dcsos]

So if the forum doesn't "buy the format"
the FAT LADY shall not sing

[Defcon]

I have seen alot of chatter regarding the Lite-On networked DVD player and the firmware issues. I am not certain however, GoVideo has a networked DVD player also that does not store the file, but can play virtually any format from your pc via the player. I THINK the connection with the GoVideo player is also WiFi 8)

I bet the future of this won't be any specific format issues at all, but simply a connection from your pc to tv.... If anything the firmware will have to do with various resolutions.

In a way with these networked players, it opens up a whole new avenue to bypassing any new technologies the recording industry may come up with on copyright protection