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  1. If it can be played, it can be copied.

    It's about time they faced facts and realised that their extremely-pissed-off customer base who have been overcharged and ripped off for years have a way to fight back.

    I don't want to deprive artists of their money - if I enjoy the music I buy it. That's only fair. Take one look at MTV's "Cribs" and you'll realise the argument that "piracy will bankrupt us, we can't afford to pay the small artists..." - do the big stars really need that solid gold toilet seat, or a different sports car for each day? I think not.....

    I paid £14 for a CD yesterday. I wonder, how much did it cost to make, ship and display in the store?

    I have one word. VORBIS.

    Cobra
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    I work for sunncomm technologies and you loosers are DONE. We have developed the technology and we are so much smarter than you. You will not be able to copy these new CD and guess what>> soon it is gonna appear on your DVD's. You people are so stupid that you dont even know that you can not break this code. Your CD copying is DONE very soon and you can forget about copying DVDs. Soon this site will be useless and you will all be forking over $20 for CDs and $30 for DVDs like you should. You F**king loosers are DONE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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  3. Originally Posted by troyvcd1
    I work for sunncomm technologies and you loosers are DONE. We have developed the technology and we are so much smarter than you. You will not be able to copy these new CD and guess what>> soon it is gonna appear on your DVD's. You people are so stupid that you dont even know that you can not break this code. Your CD copying is DONE very soon and you can forget about copying DVDs. Soon this site will be useless and you will all be forking over $20 for CDs and $30 for DVDs like you should. You F**king loosers are DONE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    LOL I work for myself and I build little black boxes that will strip off anything you can put on a CD or DVD.
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    OOps I dont work for sunntech. Sorry I must of been drinking too much last nite.
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  5. This subject has always brothered me - because of what I call the "human nature factor" I have been using computers since the Apple 1 - and this copy thing has always been with us - I have heard all the reasons both sides give but it comes down to human nature - we cant decide what is right or wrong - and if one of us feels cheated - we try to make the playing field even

    My personal opinion is that I have never downloaded music because I personnelly want the BEST sound I can get - When BETA and VHS came out I purchased BETA (the better format at the time) but money talks and everyone eles got VHS - it won of course

    The biggest thing I dont agree with is the "backup reasons" people give'
    If I were to think like most people I would have to make a backup of 1000 cds and 500 movies - that means that I would have to have a very large HD , then I would have 2000 cds and 1000 DVDs - think about it doesnt make much sense to me

    As old and as silly as it may seem to a lot of you -but our upbring plays a major role on how we act as adults - and yes I know we change and will sometimes disregard what we were taught by parents

    But by most part professionals agree that the majorie of people do the right thing according to what their parents taught them. and what them know that sociality accepts.

    Just remeber that what people believe today will not always be a fact and may be proven wrong in the future - when computers were made readly avaivable to the public - one of the biggest " benifits" would be that now we would have a paperless world - we now know that never happen in fact the opposite is true we genrate 3-4 time more paper due to computers and the need for documented proof in legal matters

    my two cents
    starship warrior
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  6. Член BJ_M's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Bob W
    LOL I work for myself and I build little black boxes that will strip off anything you can put on a CD or DVD.


    SACD?
    "Each problem that I solved became a rule which served afterwards to solve other problems." - Rene Descartes (1596-1650)
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  7. Member LisaB's Avatar
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    Anyone familiar with using vocal remover software to create karaoke tracks might see a way to possibly "plug the analog hole". Vocal removing software works by removing the center-panned portion of music, leaving the remaining parts untouched. I've used vocal removing software, and it works perfectly in those cases where the vocal is purely center-panned.

    So, imagine if you took a music source....you offset the L and R channels by just a few milliseconds. This would be unnoticeable to the ear, but it would make the music source completely un-center-panned. Then you could add some annoying centered-panned noise. If you used a player which eliminated the center-panned portion (equivalent to running it through a karaoke vocal remover software), then you would just hear the original source. If, however, you tried to make an analogue copy, the noise would no longer be perfectly center-panned. Now, no matter how you played it back, you would always hear some element of the noise.

    In fact, vocal removing software never works on MP3's, because when you compress music, you always mess up the perfect balance of the center-panned portion. By the way, anyone who wants to play around with vocal removing software can go to www.dartpro.com, where they have a free trial of their karaoke studio.
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  8. They're just trying to scam money from the RIAA. We should all do the same thing. Convince the RIAA that you came up with an unbeatable scheme to defeat people from copying cd's, get a large contract, then make some money from sales until the scheme is defeated.

    Regardless if the scheme is defeatable or not, they will convince the RIAA that it is undefeatable to get their contract.
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  9. Send an email to Darknoise company saying this is ridiculous!

    p.ayres@darknoisetechnologies.com
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  10. The RIAA Gestapo are a large group of mindless morons who have pledged blind loyalty to a small group of megalomaniacs at the top of the food chain. They perpetuate the propaganda spewed forth from the corporate machine without question.
    The bloated figures they claim as losses because of piracy, are actually projected sales they wish to generate. The big music companies are making more money now than they ever have, and it is not enough for them. Consumers, to them, are nothing but cattle that need to be prodded and herded into buying whatever at any price. It's all one big fraud perpetrated on the unsuspecting consumer and enforced by an RIAA Gestapo who refuses to see beyond their own struggle for a piece of the pie.
    It is time for consumers to stand together as a whole and use the One weapon we have at our disposal. Our money. Spend it on what you want, not on what they want you to have.
    "It is not enough to obey Big Brother. You must love him".
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  11. Banned
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    Amen
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  12. somewhere on here, someone likend this new copy protection to video's macrovision.. yeah right, like that works.*




    * ok it does if you dont know the way around it..

    would someone please explain the shift key thing to me?
    i never read the story on that.
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  13. Originally Posted by St.Thanos
    somewhere on here, someone likend this new copy protection to video's macrovision.. yeah right, like that works.*




    * ok it does if you dont know the way around it..

    would someone please explain the shift key thing to me?
    i never read the story on that.
    I think the 'shift key" thing refers to some music CD's that are copy protected so that you can't back them up from your computer. Someone discovered that holding the shift key down on the computer when a copy protected was first inserted in the drive bypassed the BS copy protection scheme.
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  14. Yes, I Know Roundabout's Avatar
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    St.Thanos,

    Here's a little more about this story on the Shift Key "Hack".

    Oct. 7 - A Princeton University student has published instructions for disabling the new anti-copying measures being tested on CDs by BMG — and they’re as simple as holding down a computer’s Shift key.

    In a paper published on his Web site Monday, Princeton Ph.D. student John Halderman explained how he disabled a new kind of copy-protection technology, distributed as part of a new album by BMG soul artist Anthony Hamilton.

    Under normal circumstances, the antipiracy software is automatically loaded onto a Windows machine whenever the Hamilton album is run in a computer’s CD drive, making traditional copying or MP3 ripping impossible. However, simply holding down the Shift key prevents Windows’ AutoRun feature from loading the copy-protection software, leaving the music free to copy, Halderman said.

    Complete story here
    Ethernet (n): something used to catch the etherbunny
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  15. Wow - intelligent debate on the internet - who'd have thought!

    I don't know technically if this is possible, but i can certainly see the music industry paying out huge R&D grants to find it. They don't want to give up the current model - why would they?

    One of the biggest (the biggest?) music stores over here is HMV. New chart cds they charge maybe £10/$18 for on release - because the supermarkets do. Then after a month or so, it'll change to £16/$25 because the supermarkets are no longer selling it.

    They'll cling on to their model for all they're worth when it's worth the obscene amounts that it currently generates. No-one wants to be the first to jump ship and say yeah, cds are doomed, let's go digital/download/whatever.
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  16. Member SaSi's Avatar
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    The guys at SunnComm Technologies might be spreading marketing hype to boost the price of their company and then sell it.

    If they wanted to prevent duplication and recording, why the hell are Cassette recorders, CD recorders, DVD recorders in the market?

    How about adding some code to the DVD Rom drivers so that they collect information on the CDs / DVDs ripped and send them to RIAA along with your IP address and username everytime you connect to the Internet?

    How about banning computers as they are used to copy CDs and DVDs?

    I remember an article I was reading in BYTE magazine some 15 years ago. The article was in an Issue called "Russian Computing". It read that Photocopying machines were next to illegal and really hard to find in Russia. So, people started a project where they actually typed books and shared them in floppies.

    If it was possible to stop copying, it would also be possible to stop drugs, street killings, car accidents, child abuse, porn, and - of course - wars.

    The funniest thing is that the Record / Movie companies lose their big money out of organized crime. People with enough skills and tools to make pressed copies of CDs and DVDs. And they sell them on the streets for $2 each CD.

    So, ironically, they are after home users, in the same way like police is chasing the drug users instead of stopping drugs production.

    Well, I am getting carried too far here, so I guess I will call it a day...
    The more I learn, the more I come to realize how little it is I know.
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  17. The Old One SatStorm's Avatar
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    intelligent debates are a tradition in this forum...
    I can't follow them easy, because of language barriers (I don't speak english that well....), but I really enjoy them.... And also learn lot's of things from them
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  18. Yes, I Know Roundabout's Avatar
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    SaSi,

    A little more background on what you were speaking about, Russian Self-Publishing was called "samizdat". Here's some more about it, if you're interested:

    The term Samizdat translated from the Russian sam or "self" and izadatelstvo or "publishing," is a play on the official soviet Gosizdat, or "State Publishing House." Literature which would be considered samizdat are manuscripts which were privately and illegally produced and circulated in the Soviet Union after the death of Joseph Stalin in 1953. Before glasnost in the 1980s, this was the only way in which to publish anything not endorsed and censored by the government.

    Censorship in Russia dates back to the eighteenth century novel Journey from St. Petersburg by A. Radishchev. This continued through the Russian Revolution with varying levels of seriousness and control. With communism, however, literature became a state controlled and authorized instrument for the promotion of the Soviet Regime. With the death of Stalin and the end of his terrifying dictatorship, came the beginning of samizdat in the Russian literary tradition. At first dissident authors wrote mainly about the restrictions on their freedom of speech. However, the movement soon evolved into a disparagement of Soviet rule, such as, "ideologies, culture, law, economic policy, historiography, and treatment of religious and ethnic minorities." (Encyclopedia Britannica)

    Duplicating machines could not be owned privately in Soviet Russia, therefore copies of samizdat manuscripts would be photographed or done on typewriters with numerous carbon copies and then passed from reader to reader. The number of copies of the manuscript would increase when a person in possession of a copy would transcribe it themselves.

    Samizdat began as a Moscow and Leningrad intellectual movement, but quickly became a way for Russian authors to have their works read which had previously been denied publication by the government or which had been kept hidden rather than face the risk of persecution. A distinct and strong underground literary culture grew out of samizdat, including the writings of Shalamov and Bulgakov. Samizdat also provided a way to circulate books which had been published before and were now unavailable because they clashed with the present Soviet ideal, such as the poetry of Anna Akhmatova.

    Also, another way for writers to get their works in circulation was tamizdat, literally "there published." If a manuscript was able to be smuggled out of the country, published and circulated there, it could be smuggled back into the Soviet Union in limited numbers and distributed illegally. Venedikt Erofeev’s Moscow to the End of the Line is a product of both forms of publication. It was circulated in manuscript form, as well as sent to Israel and later Paris for printing. Samizdat literature proliferated during glasnost in the mid-1980s. However, with the fall of Communism came its disappearance; publishing became independent from the government and it therefore became possible to distribute literature without the demand for propaganda or the threat of censorship.
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  19. SaSi is on the right track, SunnComm boosts their share value, and MPAA/RIAA gets to spread disinformation to serve their purposes. You'd be foolish indeed to think this thing is unbeatable. Why assume THEY think it's unbeatable?

    The purpose here is to dissuade, just as prosecutions are meant to dissuade."Pour encourager les autres". Consider the utter ignorance of some of the noobs that came on here after Christmas, and they were the ones with some initiative. The general population knows squat about copy protection and many can be convinced it's not worth trying to work around it.

    An added bonus from their point of view would be if this thing actually works to the degree of being a nuisance, so much the better. Add an extra step to the process or require program upgrades. No doubt they'd like that.

    And why is this necessarily expensive? SunnComm has a half-ass project going nowhere, it's worthless. The powers-that- be offer them a modest sum to recoup some expense. They get a stock boost and MPAA/RIAA get useful propaganda.
    Pull! Bang! Darn!
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  20. Just one other issue that springs to mind, what happens if you happen to use a hearing-aid? isnt that a form of amplifier? I could just imagine a granny sticking some music on, cranking the volume up (like they do 'cos they're a bit deaf) and getting the shit blown out of what was left of their hearing by an alarm bell sent directly into their ear-drum.
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  21. Yes, I Know Roundabout's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by sNoWy1998
    I could just imagine a granny sticking some music on, cranking the volume up (like they do 'cos they're a bit deaf) and getting the shit blown out of what was left of their hearing by an alarm bell sent directly into their ear-drum.
    LOL. Can you spell Class Action Suit? They'll get the message if the AARP was breathing down their neck with a Thousand-Grandma March on the RIAA and Darknoise HQ!
    Maybe our erstwhile Mr. debarrister can answer the question of their culpability, if he hasn't left us for greener pastures - i.e. DVDhelp.US
    Ethernet (n): something used to catch the etherbunny
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    I'm sure everone is having fun here , but I would like to remind
    you that you are discussing a non-issue. The reason I say this is because
    people continue to say that this "can be circumvented" That implies
    you believe it is real . It is utter BULLSHIT.

    Let's move on to what color Martian invaders are.
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  23. Originally Posted by FOO
    .....
    Let's move on to what color Martian invaders are.
    The one I saw was green and I killed it by playing Slim Whitman music.
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  24. Originally Posted by FOO
    I'm sure everone is having fun here , but I would like to remind
    you that you are discussing a non-issue. The reason I say this is because
    people continue to say that this "can be circumvented" That implies
    you believe it is real . It is utter BULLSHIT.

    Let's move on to what color Martian invaders are.

    We can always count on you to say the most obvious 8)
    tgpo famous MAC commercial, You be the judge?
    Originally Posted by jagabo
    I use the FixEverythingThat'sWrongWithThisVideo() filter. Works perfectly every time.
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  25. Yes, I Know Roundabout's Avatar
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    FOO,

    Of course it's BS, pure and simple. There's no way it can work, but we gotta have some fun anyway.
    There's nothing they're doing to the audio a notch filter can't fix... harmonics, my ass. Notice they aren't supplying any samples for people to see what a crock this so-called "encryption" is. They know how fast they'd become a laughingstock and wouldn't be able to sell their company to the suckers at SunnComm. They never learn. After this comes and goes, they'll think of something else to try and peddle to the RIAA. And the RIAA is even bigger suckers for even thinking this would work. Don't they have engineers on staff to evaluate this kind of crap?
    Couldn't happen to a nicer group of people...
    Ethernet (n): something used to catch the etherbunny
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  26. They are forcing people to use filesharing.

    I for one will never buy a copy protected piece of music. That includes the legal downloads that have DRM.

    I have about 1000 CD's but I stopped buying them once I saw what the music industry was up to.

    If they ever develop a system where I can purchase a subscription (say $10/month) and file share with people all over the world, with no DRM then thats when I will start buying music again. Until then I am going to try and starve them out.
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    What a fantastic idea, come up with a system that sounds perfect and sell it for loads of cash to greedy people who don't understand the technology but want the protection. Once you have your pile of cash, and the system has been accepted worldwide, simply tell everyone how to get round the problem. Everybody's happy, except the greedy ones, and you have a pile of cash. Now... is anybody able to write a bit of code that .....
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  28. This may be a non-issue as a practical, technical proposition... I'm not sure it's a non-issue in other terms. The manipulation of people operates on perception equaling reality (e.g. advertising and propaganda). That's what it smells like to me, regardless of who's a party to this or what they hope to gain.(?) I resent on principle being fed disinformation.
    Pull! Bang! Darn!
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  29. It's magic!

    If you try to listen to the music BUT YOU HAVEN'T PAID FOR IT YET, your brain will fry and you will go into seizures...

    Regards.
    Michael Tam
    w: Morsels of Evidence
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  30. My 2cents... Well, the riaa and their cronies are full of bullsquash. Hackers live for this type of crap. I'll bet someone holds downa hift key or better yet, the hamster iving in their 3.5 floppy drive will fix it. But on a more serious note, the only way for the RIAA and artists to make money is that they must be like a TV station. The artists music would be free to all as commercials for the record label. Example, HBO has sex and the city, I know many people that have ordered HBO just to watch it or have bought complete season DVDs. The artist would be the "sex and the city" and the record label would be like HBO. The only prob I see this having is, they (the labels) would have to sell other stuff. And the artists music will still get ripped in spite. However, this would be the only business model that I could think of right now that would allow the riaa and company to make some dough. Hey, maybe they should sell the artist wordrobe or whatever else they could think of.
    Do you doubt my courage comrade Khoi?
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