Copying the Boot DVD

[nutt318]

Ok I got a boot dvd and slide card v2.0 in the mail from www.modchip.com, anyways has anyone been successfull on copying it. I mean ive never seen a DVD like that with skiping lines and stuff. I was gonna make a copy and give it to a freind but I just get read errors. Anyone know a way around this. Please let me know.

THanks

[jeex]

even if you were able to copy it, it wouldnt boot up in your friends ps2.

the only reason the boot dvd works is because they cut up a different ps2 game, kept the inner ring & glued it together with their code.. if you look at the inside of the disc (both back and front) you'll notice discoloration..

your friend has to buy his own boot disk.

[nutt318]

Ok let me see if I get this right. They take an actuall PS2 game and somehow keep the first little bit of the game. I did see what you were talking about the different color on the first ring on the dvd boot disk. So how does the PS2 read this. I mean I try to rip it as an iso but it errors out on some file that not there, im guessing that they put part of the file on the next ring out? Is there any software that can duplicate this? If its not possible to copy a boot disk, why donsnt the movie industry do this? Just let me know.

Thanks

[ps2daddy]

Simply put

The ps2 is designed to read a ps2/psone disk with copywritten "errors" that indicate region code and original game code on a certain part of the disk.

A cd\dvd writer is designed to correct these type of errors when duplicating. So right now there is no way to get a cd\dvd writer to copy the errors as they were originally written.

If you could copy a boot disk then you would not need to buy a boot disk or a modchip someone would just put this code on every backup and they would play with no problem like on the dreamcast but sony has had the psone out since 94 an no one has figured it out yet.

The Gameshark people got busted for having crazy taxi as the boot sector of their Splinter Cell cheat code disk and it can only be assumed that the other boot disks devices are made in a similar fashion as Jeex said.

The bleem people and virtual gaming station people reversed engineered the code and could have possibly made something I believe but bleem went bankrupt (even though sony kept loosing the lawsuits the just kept taking them to court until they ran out of money) and VGS people are now owned by microsoft

[jeex]

everything ps2 daddy said is correct, except the part about the "errors".

the actual part of the disc that contains the information that verifies whether or not the disc is authentic is located in the wobble groove. cd & dvd drives cannot read this part of the disc, and therefore cannot duplicate it. the laser cannot focus on it.

you can copy ps2/psx dvd/cd games with, but you cannot copy the information that tells the ps2/psx the game is authentic.

the rings on the swap magic dvd (and cd) are just bad/dead sectors that cannot be duplicated.. this is to prevent people (rival companies) from copying the information on the disc and using it on their products.

[lordsmurf]

Those things are like $25 or so last I saw. Tell your friend to buy his own damned disc and not be so cheap. Isn't it enough he'll "backup" all sorts of games?

[ps2daddy]

everything ps2 daddy said is correct, except the part about the "errors".

the actual part of the disc that contains the information that verifies whether or not the disc is authentic is located in the wobble groove. cd & dvd drives cannot read this part of the disc, and therefore cannot duplicate it. the laser cannot focus on it.

you can copy ps2/psx dvd/cd games with, but you cannot copy the information that tells the ps2/psx the game is authentic.

the rings on the swap magic dvd (and cd) are just bad/dead sectors that cannot be duplicated.. this is to prevent people (rival companies) from copying the information on the disc and using it on their products.

I dont claim to have all tha answers and I didnt develop magic gate encrytion and I am not a programmer for sony but to my knowledge............

Taken from
http://www.asap-cdsolutions.ca/website/cd-r.html

and

Wobble and error discussed here
http://www.opticaldisc-systems.com/JulyAugust2000/Articles/MasteringCD-Rs/Mastering50.htm

CD-R Manufacturing:
Stage 1 - A BLANK glass master that has a spiral grove from the middle to the outside in a wobble track is created and from this a nickel master is created. This is called a Stamper. This takes from 4 to 8 hours to create (the actual Glass Master is recycled once the nickel master is created). Different CD-R's have different quality and record speeds. 4 to 24-x write are typical

The middle to the end of a disk can be read with no problems if you have the right cd witer. the wobble grove is not in the subchannel area and can be fully read if you use clone CD you can read the raw section. Since the frequency in the wobble is different than the standard the CD writer corrects this

This wobble track cannot be duplicated since the errors are corrected its not on an area the laser cannot reach. The wobble starts is in the middle and goes to to the outside edge. Raw data on the inside edge cannot be read by normal cd writers clone cd does get into a deeper part of the subchannels

How cd are written from middle to end
http://arch.wisc.edu/start/handouts/software/CD%20Burning%20QT.pdf

What's in a subcode channel?

http://www.cdrfaq.org/faq02.html#S2-43-5

What's in a subcode channel?
(2002/12/11)
There are 8 subcode channels, labeled P,Q,R,S,T,U,V,W, or sometimes "P-W" for short. (The ECMA-130 standard refers to subcode bytes as "Control bytes".) Every frame contains one byte of subcode data, and each byte holds 1 bit of P, 1 of Q, and so on. The bytes from 98 consecutive frames are combined to form a subcode "section". The first two bits in each channel are used for synchronization, leaving 96 bits of useful data per channel (which is where RAW DAO-96 gets its name).

The P and Q channels are defined by the CD audio standard. (They are unrelated to the P and Q parity fields.) The P channel can be used to find the start of a track, but in practice most devices use the more sophisticated Q channel. Q contains four chunks of information: control (4 bits), address (4 bits), Q data (72 bits), and an EDC (16-bit CRC).

The control bits determine whether the track holds audio or data, the number of audio channels (stereo or quadraphonic), and specifies the Digital Copy Permitted and Pre-emphasis flags. The address bits determine the format of the Q data section. Address mode 1 holds information about tracks, mode 2 holds a catalog number (such as a UPC code, constant for an entire disc), and mode 3 contains the ISRC (International Standard Recording Code, constant for a given track but may change with each track).

A disc has three main regions: the lead-in area, the program area, and the lead-out area. Subcode Q mode 1 data in the lead-in is used to hold the table of contents (TOC) for the disc. The TOC is repeated continuously in the lead-in area in case of damage (remember, no CIRC encoding on subcode channels). In the program and lead-out area, mode 1 contains track numbers, index numbers, time within the current track, and absolute time. Index 0 marks the start of a pregap (pause) before the audio in a track begins, index 1 marks the start of the music, and indexes 2 through 99 are usually not set but can be added if desired.

The ability to specify track and index markers when writing a Red Book audio CD is often referred to as "PQ editing" because that information is contained in the P and Q subcodes.

Subcode channels R through W are not defined by the CD standard, except to say that they should be set entirely to zero if not used. They're currently used for CD+G (e.g. Karaoke) discs, CD-Text, and some forms of copy protection.

It is interesting to note that, while bytes from 98 consecutive frames are used to create a subcode "section", those frames don't have to be from a single sector. It's possible for a subcode section to start in one sector and end in the next.

This is why most cd writers also have problems copying karoke disks

Yamaha and plextor developed drives that read and write the complete subchannel area where other cd writers cant. However psone games copied with these drives couldnt play psone or ps2 games without a modchip or boot disk either. Why you might ask? Because of the error correction of the wobble when duplicating the disks

However if you use a program like clone cd (and the correct drive)with copy protected psone games you can avoid the ghostbuster image if you use clonecd but you still need a modchip

Discussion of drives that can read complete subchannel area
http://216.239.37.104/search?q=cache:c3AVRxL4HGUJ:www.ping.be/satcp/writer03p.htm+yama...hl=en&ie=UTF-8

other info
http://216.239.37.104/search?q=cache:QKzyDS9XbM8J:www.cdrinfo.com/Sections/News/Detail...hl=en&ie=UTF-8

For the sake of discussion lets say that the wobble is in the subchannel region.

If it were it doesnt really make a difference where the "error" is since the "error" is always corrected.

[jeex]

http://club.cdfreaks.com/showthread.php?s=9&threadid=73691

[ps2daddy]

http://club.cdfreaks.com/showthread.php?s=9&threadid=73691

Yep I have seen that also but hadnt looked at it in a while

5. 'Bootsector' out of lasers reach
------------------------------------
Wrong, the bootsignal is modulated through the Lead-In
Track, its just not recognisable by PC CD drives of
all kinds, because they dont have the option for puttin
out tracking error signal codes.

6. Bad sectors - also inside the data area
------------------------------------------
The PSX uses definitively not any bad sectors as
boot protection! The additional, just sometimes used
Libcrypt protection uses "bad subcodes" as protection,
but that problem was solved a long time ago just buy
RAW DAO 96 read and burn! And some games like
Tombraider use "Correct track start LBA check" protection.


7. PSX checks for Barcode or ATIP
---------------------------------
PSX laser look definitive not for any barcode or other
markings at the very inner ring side of the CD.
The PSX doesnt check intentionally if there exist some
ATIP info!


7x.! Discussable
-----------------

As sideeffect of the constant 22khz "ATIP" wobble
throughout the whole "empty" CD-R, it seems the SCEx
pulses, which consist of logical zero's and ones, tend
to be always as One's, but after pits are written!
We know the PSX laser isnt that "very good looking",
so for 90% it seems the PSX laser cant read the PSX
ATIP wobble directly, just by the "influenced track".
That track then has very slightly the "fingerprint" of
the ATIP, even if tracking-coil correted on burning.
Perhaps here sometimes we get the key to switch
on or off the "wobble".

If I would have put that link up I would have saved a lot of time typing and looking for other links
That post discusses exaclty what I said summed up very quickly thanks for posting it Jeex

[jeex]

yeah, i like posting links instead of spending 20 minutes typing up my side of the discussion..



i still cant believe they havent cracked this sony protection.. for christs sake, its been a decade..

..

i'm not too much of an xbox nerd.. but if "they" were to find out what the "key" was, could "they" make self-booting games?

[ps2daddy]

yeah, i like posting links instead of spending 20 minutes typing up my side of the discussion..



i still cant believe they havent cracked this sony protection.. for christs sake, its been a decade..

..

i'm not too much of an xbox nerd.. but if "they" were to find out what the "key" was, could "they" make self-booting games?

The wobble of a ps2 game has variations in it and that it different than normal cds. When you burn a ps2 disk the writter corrects it to make it a normal disk. Since the PS2 is expecting a specfic wobble with the appropriate info it gives you the Red screen of death since the wobble "error" is corrected.

Thre would have to be some firmware revision that would tell the writer not to correct the wobble in order for this to work most likely that would probably be different for every manufacturer of each drive.

Like I said I think the bleem and VGS people might really know how to do this but they are being held down by the man (and they dont want to get sued to oblivion).

Xbox games have a protection on them and the cotents can be read on a computer but if you use the xbox as a go between you can read the data but they have some kinda strange protection sceme that I dont have a clue about. Man I bet you sega wished they could have been that good.

Also as far as the xbox you can flash your onboard bios and not use a chip at all to play your backups but you cant play xbox live after you do this though.