Pioneer A06 burning dual layer

[offline]

let it be seen!

I'm afraid you will have to take my word - I'm not
releasing a privately communicated material onto a public board
unless I get permission from the sender.

Heh. It may or may not have been modified hard-ware.

I told you it was not.

Even if it was original hardware, the tech demo didn't burn an entire Disc, only a few 100MB

The entire disc was able to be filled (7+ gig) but the media
was experimental and may not have been compliant with the
later released DVD DL specs.

[RabidDog]

And what special relationship do you have with Pioneer that they will tell you something that is so commercially sensitive??

I told you it was not.

But many other reputable sources say it was!
The implication is that all Pioneer drives released since the a06 are also capable of burning to dual layer

[offline]

And what special relationship do you have with Pioneer that they will tell you something that is so commercially sensitive??

You seem upset. Why is that? Did I claim a special relationship? - nope
Was the information provided to me commercially sensitive? - nope

But many other reputable sources say it was!

These reputable sources you conveniently leave unmentioned
may well all trace back to a certain article in a German publication
which stated Pioneer PR sources as claiming that the drive was in fact
hard-modded for the cebit demo. A claim both my source and Pioneer Australia have denied.

The implication is that all Pioneer drives released since the a06 are also capable of burning to dual layer

Maybe. The media was in prototype - DL specs have changed since then. Time will tell.

[RabidDog]

Upset? Not at all .. You are claiming special knowledge that other reputable sources dispute , yet your claims are backed up with ... nothing.... If this info was so readily provided to yourself it seems strange there aren't others who can back your story up? Or that this info should be common knowledge?
2 opposing views.. yours..or German mag C't
You provide no evidence whatsoever to back up your claims.
Whereas c't is open to scrutiny and criticism by its thousands of readers.
If I email pioneer will they state these readily available facts?
By using the phrase "I told you it was not" it simply begs me to respond "i told you it was"

Was the information provided to me commercially sensitive? - nope

If you don't believe that this information is/would be commercially sensitive then I say you don't grasp the competitive nature of the optical storage market. Being right means nothing unless others know you are right.

[RabidDog]

And Pioneer havent announced it publicly because....

BenQ announces DVD+R Double-Layer upgradeable Re-Writer

They didnt wish to steal the thunder from their Partners?

[offline]

Upset? Not at all .. You are claiming special knowledge that other reputable sources dispute , yet your claims are backed up with ... nothing.... If this info was so readily provided to yourself it seems strange there aren't others who can back your story up? Or that this info should be common knowledge?

You seem so (upset I mean.) I regret I cannot provide proof. Neither
can your "reputable" sources it seems btw.

If I email pioneer will they state these readily available facts?

No idea really. Go ahead. I'm not stopping you. Try to get direct
to a technician or related area manager - PR are a waste of time.

I say you don't grasp the competitive nature of the optical storage market.

I never said I did. I can make an educated guess though. Anytime you
want to discuss Marketing Theory 101 to 301 I'm here & qualified

Being right means nothing unless others know you are right.

Being right means everything. What others know or do not know is
of no consequence even if they are right and you are wrong.

[RabidDog]

these other posts may interest you..
https://www.videohelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=213099&highlight=106d
so phillips dont believe its possible either..
Why do you feel that I am upset?

[offline]

these other posts may interest you..

Rabid - did you read the entire thread ? No you did not. How do I know?

Here are a few quotes from that same thread:

Is it possible to upgrade the firmware on a DVD writer so that it can write to dual layer

Nope - the writer has to actually refocus the laser to write to a dual layer disc

Just like they do when burning CDR/CDRW.. hmm

Exactly what Philips said to CDfreaks at CeBit-

The BenQ DW822a with upgrade to dual layer through firmware

Now here is one more - from the SAME THREAD:

Okay, due to the wild speculation on this subject I called Pioneer and finally got through to one of their direct sales people (OEM sales). I was told that the plan right now is to indeed release a DVD-9 flash for the 106d

Rabid, even one of the quotes above was mine, so if you had bothered
to read the whole thread you would not have suggested I read it and;
this is funny, 2/3rds of the posts in that thread counter your position anyway.

Why do you feel that I am upset?

You do not know the subject. You present links to threads that
counter your position. You argue that I present no facts but
you present none yourself. I'd say you were upset by my
"I told you" post. Unless you are a troll, nothing else makes sense.

[kabanero]

Wasn't it Pioneer who said it was just a firmware modification?

It was and I have a private email from Pioneer reiterating that.

It was but I have a private email from Pioneer Germany saying that hardware was modified too.

[RabidDog]

Your post only makes sense in that it is self-justification .. or shelf-clearing. Come clean, you have bought a job lot of 106 and are desperately hoping to make a killing. I am willing to bet hard cash that pioneer will never release a firmware flash to make the 106 dual layer capable. They have already talked about the upcoming a109 scheduled for release in q4 2004 which will be DL. This is the fastest they can get to market.
I claim no inside knowledge or secret emails just simple logic. If it was available they would put it out now.. while the 106 is still selling albeit being phased out for the 107. Facts on the ground not vapourware. Benq have stated publicly about their firmware flash why not pioneer??
Your job with the pioneer advertising agency is safe, you have given it your best shot, but your feeble arguments convince no-one.

[MrShavez]

Stop fooling yourselves

You WILL most likely have to buy a new drive for DL-burning :P

Why is it so hard to understand, and whats the problem? It will only cost a couple of hundred. GET A JOB, GUYS

[troyvcd1]

I agree that Pioneer will never put out firmware for DL A06. Then they would have to support it as a DL burner. I think that the best we can hope for is someone to make a firmware hack. Surely with all the firmware hacks out there there will be someone who will do this.

[offline]

I am willing to bet hard cash that pioneer will never release a firmware flash to make the 106 dual layer capable

I happen to agree with you. At most I am hoping that a hacked
firmware might be released.

Your job with the pioneer advertising agency is safe, you have given it your best shot, but your feeble arguments convince no-one.

My arguments were fine, my evidence was absent and you were feeble.
BTW Thanks for the new job. Do I start Monday?

[-jsl-]

It's not possible to "hack" firmwares to include support for dual layer from scratch for obvious reasons. The only drives that there is any chance that there will be patched DL firmwares are drives that show up with identical hardware in DL versions (possible examples might be NEC ND-2500A -> ND-2510A and Lite-On SOHW-812S -> SOHW-832S), i.e. the chance that it will happen for Pioneer 106 is zero...

[dead_indian_walking]

OK PEOPLE. All firms/companies/bussines are run by somebody who knows economics, this means in order to meet demand, they must have supply. This means that by having the current Ao6/Ao7 on the market, THEY WILL put a price on a firmware BUTTTTTTTTt.....They will sell new A06/A07 with the new firmware which means they can put the price higher. This means that we who already own it will probably pay £30 for firmware uprade. THIS IS ONLY A THEORY

[MrShavez]

Jeez, have IQ´s just suddenly dropped..?

There will NOT be a FW for DL-burning for the A06 drive, period.

The A06-drive that was capable of DL burning was HARDWARE-modded, it was NOT just the firmware. PIONEER admitted to this.

Why is this so bloody hard to understand?

Sorry if I sound rude, but some people just don´t get it...

[Vanderlow]

Plus RabidDog has a point (as he usually does) that everyday that goes by with a competitor (BenQ for $100 no less) that has said they have a burner that is DL upgradeable and its free, every day that goes by, it loses the thunder and good business sense of Pioneer holding back on announcing its firmware (if it does exist).

We already know the Lite-on 832 that Nic has has a different motor part and that may be enough from the 811s/812s from getting upgraded to DL.