Capturing Project ... VHS to DVD, What Next?

[MACKY]

I've been posting the past several days asking questions and gathering information about a project that I'm getting into ... I have a bunch of VHS Home Videos, dating back as far as 22 years, to when my son was born. I started looking at some of them and they are REAL DARK and jittery. My goal is to get them converted over to DVD, improving their quality AS MUCH AS POSSIBLE during the conversion.

Well last night I bought a Datavideo TBC-1000 as a first step towards getting set up. It should be here in the next couple of days. I'm now looking at what I should do next.

Right now I'm using one of those "$79.00 special" Panasonic VCRs as my playback machine. Should I be looking at a replacement for that VCR? What will I gain to get a different one? What kind of features should the replacement VCR have? Please recommend a few .... new or used.

Also ... I have an ATI AIW 9000 Pro Video Capture Card. Will MMC do for me what I will need to do or will I need something else? If I need something else, can I use any software applications (like virtualdub)effectively with the AIW?

As usual Thanks for the Help ... MACKY

[Bob W]

I went the capture card path at first when I wanted to backup a bunch of VHS tapes however after spending a ton of money and time I discovered a DVD recorder does a much better job than I ever achieved and in one fifth the time. Now I simply record from a JVC VCRvia s-video through a TBC to my Panasonic E50 recorder.

[MACKY]

Bob,

What capability does your setup have for Enhancing the Quality of the VHS Tapes? My older ones are real dark and once I get the darkness resolved I have a feeling that I'm going to have to do something to clean up the color as well.

MACKY

[rcb]

Macky

When you viewed those dark tapes, was that thru your computer or thru your set top tv ?

computer preview screens will usually display a darker pix than tv's..

one more tip - fast forward/rewind those old tapes once from reel end to reel end to "excersise" them before playing/capturing/etc. That sometimes helps to get a smoother output.

[MACKY]

Great Advice .... it was through the PC and the AIW Capture Card. I'll make sure to look at them on the TV ... maybe not as bad as I think. I might look around for a used JVC S-VHS Recorder .... even if the tapes aren't as dark as first thought.

[Towncrier]

You may want to invest in a Sima Video Color Corrector (or similar device) which will allow you to adjust color/brightness/sharpness of your video signal before capturing. You can also post-process the video once it is captured to "brighten up" the image.

[SaSi]

I went the capture card path at first when I wanted to backup a bunch of VHS tapes however after spending a ton of money and time I discovered a DVD recorder does a much better job than I ever achieved and in one fifth the time. Now I simply record from a JVC VCRvia s-video through a TBC to my Panasonic E50 recorder.

I will agree with this. After spending not as much money as nights ( ), I thought I had it all figured out. I then had to re-install OS and s/w on my PC and there I am again in square one - well almost.

Deck DVDR machines are getting much cheaper. It's much more convenient to keep the VHS and DVDR together by the TV and copy from one to the other, keeping the PC free.

Also, you don't bother about lost frames, defragmenting disks or fine tuning the codecs

For bulk conversion, especially from VHS, get yourself a good DVD Recorder. You will need it once you decide to through away your VCR.

[rhegedus]

You've already got a very good capture card, so I would advise that you try the capture route first before shelling out $ on a DVD recorder.

If you really want a DVD recorder then I still suggest you try the capture route as editing is far easier on a PC and you can touch up the original vide and add effects which a DVD recorder will never do.

If I ever but a DVD recorder (sometime soon...), I still would not use it to record my videos.

It boils down to this: time, patience and money.

[dphirschler]

You may be able to brighten them up within your capture software. VDub has a brightness setting. I always have to tweak that when I capture from VHS. It's always different. After that, you can load the "levels" filter into Virtual Dub and fiddle with the settings. You'd be surprised to see just how much you can improve the image on the PC.

And I agree with the guy that suggested FF and RW the tape first.

If you do get a DVD recorder... I've read that they have built in TBC so if it's possible to use as a pass-through, it might have saved you some money.


Darryl

[Bob W]

I would invest in a TBC unit which you will need or use for capturing or direct recording to a stand alone recorder. Here is the one I use and it will allow you to adjust the color and brightness prior to capture or recording.
http://www.avtoolbox.com/avt-8710.htm

[MACKY]

Let me start by thanking EVERYONE for their replies.

Here's where I am as of right now ... I already have a PC dedicated to Video Processing and Editing. I'm not ready to go for a DVD recorder right now .... here's why. VERY SOON they will be announcing 2 Layer recording technology for DVD's ... that will double todays capacity. Also HDTV is around the corner.

Also I believe (might not be so) that I will have more editing capability if I go with a capture to my PC, make my edits/changes, and then burn the DVD on my PC.

I have already bought a Datavideo TBC-1000 and it's on the way. It's looking like I will be going for a used JVC S-VHS Recorder. The plan is to playback in the JVC and capture to my PC .... fix/edit/enhance on my PC, and then burn DVDs.

If there are any drawbacks (other than the time I my have to spend) let me know.

[TheFamilyMan]

I've been on the path you're starting out on for a while. Here are my lessons learned:

1. Get a VCR with a TBC, more specifically a JVC with its TBC/NR feature. A good new model is the SR-V10U. You can buy this right away for about $270 US. This model has completely eliminated horizontal wobble, jitter (or what ever it is called) from my family VHS footage. It may even solve vertical skipping problems, though I cannot say for sure. Its overall playback quality is top rate.

2. VHS captures look a somewhat darker and colors slightly off on your computer than when played on the TV (considering that you've got them onto a DVD and played in a set top DVD player).

3. When you encode your captures to MPEG2, use very high bit rates with 1/2 DVD resolution (352x480). Don't worry about the 1/2 DVD, you will be hard pressed to tell the difference from full DVD resolution with the final product on your TV if your source was home produced VHS tapes. Hand held cameras introduce lots of motion that is not present in Hollywood type productions; this is the reason for encoding with the high bit rate (ignor this if you usually used a tripod to record). If possible use a variable bit rate for your encoding. This greatly reduces the MPEG2 file size. I use TMPGEnc, CQ 80 with 9000 max, 3000 min with excellent (i.e. perfect) results. If you don't know what all this means, start learning; this site has it all if you are willing to put in the effort.

4. You have to find your own way with your setup. Be patient, take your time and experiement a LOT. Save your most precious footage for LAST. when you've got everything under control.

I have a hard time believing that a set top DVD recorder does as good of job as taking the time with capturing and encoding, especially with home produced footage. The results with my setup are good as, or sometimes sightly better than (due to hardware/software noise reduction), the originals.

Have fun and good luck!

[MACKY]

Howdy Family man .... THANKS FOR THE INFO

First ... yes I do know what most of that said .... my eyes are still burning from all the reading and playing the past couple of weeks.

Second ... I just bought a used JVC HRS-9800 .... hope that equally fills the bill.

So I've got the 9800 for playback, into a Datavideo TBC-1000, into an ATI AIW 9000 Pro ....


MACKY

[rhegedus]

Now follow some of Lordsmurf's guides to get your system tuned just right 8)

[MACKY]

I actually just upgraded that system the an Athlon XP 3200+, ASUS A7N8X-E Deluxe Board, 512MB of Corsair TwinX XMS LL Twin Pack DDR-3200, with an 80GB Primary Drive and two 80GB SATA Hitachi Drives running Raid0 (160GB total) .... on Windows XP Professional .... nothing loaded that I don't need .... running a Pioneer A106 DVD Burner ... ready to rock and roll. It's my dedicated system used only for Digital Video work.

MACKY

[Leoslocks]

That is one nice system you have MACKY

TheFamilyMan post is spot on. To add anything to it is to take a small segment of tape and work through the entire process, burn to DVD RW and check on the TV. When all the settings are tweaked, then work through an entire tape.

You may not need the Datavideo TBC as the JVC has it built in.

I am still trying to figure out how to get TMPGenc to accept the 9000 bitrate. (I havent found the right file to edit)

Don't forget to go back through LordSmurff's guides.

[Bob W]

"I have a hard time believing that a set top DVD recorder does as good of job as taking the time with capturing and encoding, especially with home produced footage."

So did I until I recorded my first VHS tape to my E50 and discovered during playback it actually looked better than the source tape. Now I would never go back to capturing.

[FulciLives]

A note on the final MPEG-2 resolution you will be using ...

If you are happy with only about 60 minutes per DVD disc then do Full D1 resolution (720x480/576 NTSC/PAL) and do a CBR at 8000kbps with PCM audio or for a bit more video try 2.0 256kbps AC-3 audio.

If you want more time on a DVD then try Half D1 resolution (352x480/576 NTSC/PAL) and do a CBR at 5000kbps with PCM audio or even 2.0 256kbps AC-3 audio.

One final note about the audio ... unless you have access to a good quality AC-3 encoder don't bother and just do PCM since most of the freeware AC-3 encoding options produce incompatable AC-3 ... at least on some DVD players.

As for the bitrate suggestions 8000bkps is the highest you can use if using PCM audio and Half D1 hits the MAX at around 5000kbps although you can go higher (sometimes I even go to 6000kbps if the program is short enough to fit at that bitrate). Anymore than that though and you are just wasting space as the bitrate just can't be used up by the resolution of Half D1.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[BSR]

I see alot of talk about using half D1 for VHS to DVD conversion.
I do plan on buying a HDTV some day.
So my question is, for VHS to DVD conversion,
Will Half D1 look as good as Full D1 on HDTVs?

[lordsmurf]

I like my DVD recorder, but they have limits. For real work, I'll need a computer card. I suggest an ATI AIW.

I want to add a Matrox RT2500 later this year if I can afford it (wishful thinking). Trying to move yet again beyond what I do now. Even the ATI AIW has its limits for real professional work, which is something I'd like to break into myself.

The one thing that you need to do with video is invest time reading. This site and mine are great starting points.

[MACKY]

I'm loving the info in the thread .... thanks to everyone. I'm building a Video Capture "Techie Tips" journal from it.

While I'm waiting for my new toys to be delivered, at which time I can start reading that documentation I have a question. The JVC HRS-9800 has a TBC in it ... I also have a Datavideo TBC-1000 coming ....
Do I only use the TBC-1000, turning off the TBC in the JVC? By turning off the TBC in the JVC do I loose noise reduction? Any recommendations on settings to use in the JVC?

MACKY

[rhegedus]

Will Half D1 look as good as Full D1 on HDTVs?

Not if the source is VHS or TV.