(spoiler) Reloaded: I don't get it :o( ........ LOL!

[Will Hay]

I'm not ashamed to admit it.
I watched it again last night, and it's still not making complete sense.
Okay, so....
....I understand Zion (sp?) is about to get pummelled, I understand Neo is still the one and that there are (self-created?) clitches in the Matrix, aka the french guy with the sexy missus and the oracle.
I figure the main glitch is the fact the Neo has a choice right?
He has a choice to take the door on the right, and reload the matrix and save a small band of humans to continue the fight or take the door on the left, save his chick but wipe out the entire human race, right?
I figure up until that point everything he's done or has done is a result of the Matrix, yes?
I also know he's not the first, he's the sixth 'one', right?
What I don't get is this....
Did all the prior 'ones' take the door on the right, and reload the Matrix because they didn't have the guts to risk being responsible for wiping out mankind?
What's the deal with the bomb, is that just the mainframe being destroyed (as a result of Neo taking the door on the left?)
Oh, and what's the deal with Neo right at the end, when he tells Morph that the phophecy (sp?) was all a lie?
I really want to get it
Oh, and who on earth suggested Trinity was up the duff, and that when Neo removed the bullet the sound switched to an ultrascan of the baby's heartbeat?
Was that you Adam?
If it was pal, its been removed from the British DVD
Will

[freak_in_cage_10k]

ok dude, i too watched it last night and understood it, but since then i seem to have forgotten parts of it lol but i will do my best:

the glitch in the matrix programming was that sum ppl dont accept it, hence they are often selected to be freed. but the machines control this by building up Zion, then beating the hell outta the place with the sentanels, and this had been performed 5 time previously!

im pretty sure the big explosion was the power staion being destroyed, neo took the door that saved all the humans, and then flew at amazing speed to save trinity, the reason it worked this time and never before was that none of the other neos had the strongest of all emotions...love

the phrofesy was a lie- it was invented by the machines so that the freed humans would take a predictable path, making it easier for the machines to kill them when the time aroise. this had been performed 5 times already!

sorry i couldn;t spend longer man but i have a lecture in 5 min s m8!!!

[Devanshu]

I watched it when it came out and forgot a lot...but I had one question too(not that I want to take this thread away from you Will :P) what was the deal w/ the smith replica(the one that got into the matrix)...what did he have to do with zion being destroyed?

[adam]

Since you are just now watching the movie, luckily you don't have long to wait til part III. You are not suppposed to understand everything, its supposed to be an abiguous cliffhanger so that the last one can answer all the questions for you.

The machines keep running the cycle. They gather up all the reject humans in Zion using the prophecy to trick them into believing they can some day free themselves. Neo is sort of the catalyst. They all get behind him, and more than likely he is a program who is basically mirrors the Matrix. I think this is why he has more powers than everyone else. They are trying to pefect the Matrix program and they are using Neo as the test. He keeps getting to that room, and is repeatedly offered the same choice. The day he picks the other door is the day that the Matrix has been perfected. Until then, they will keep reloading the system, wiping out all the rejects and starting over.

Regarding the ultrasound...I never said anything about hearing a baby's heartbeat. Maybe that is true but I didn't notice it. All I said was that when Neo removed the bullet it switched to an ultrasound looking view with Neo reaching into her groin. I thought this was obviously symbolic of birth, whether Trinity is actually pregnant or not.

[adam]

The Smith replica doesn't really have anything to do with Zion being destroyed. Smith couldn't kill Neo in the Matrix, so he tried to use an assassin in the real world where Neo has no powers. He somehow was able to take over a person in the Matrix and retain control over him once he was unplugged. We'll have to wait until part III to find out how.

Now the replica was involved in the first wave of attacks against Zion. He was the only survivor from the ships defending Zion when those robots attacked (I forget what they are called.) Zion isn't destroyed yet, the attack on it takes place in part III.

[Will Hay]

Since you are just now watching the movie, luckily you don't have long to wait til part III. You are not suppposed to understand everything, its supposed to be an abiguous cliffhanger so that the last one can answer all the questions for you.

I saw it when it first came out, I watched it last night for the second time

The machines keep running the cycle. They gather up all the reject humans in Zion using the prophecy to trick them into believing they can some day free themselves. Neo is sort of the catalyst. They all get behind him, and more than likely he is a program who is basically mirrors the Matrix. I think this is why he has more powers than everyone else. They are trying to pefect the Matrix program and they are using Neo as the test. He keeps getting to that room, and is repeatedly offered the same choice. The day he picks the other door is the day that the Matrix has been perfected. Until then, they will keep reloading the system, wiping out all the rejects and starting over.

Makes sense, certainly more so than what I had although is this just your perception?
I'm still unsure that Zion is created by the Matrix, but we shall see!

Regarding the ultrasound...I never said anything about hearing a baby's heartbeat. Maybe that is true but I didn't notice it. All I said was that when Neo removed the bullet it switched to an ultrasound looking view with Neo reaching into her groin. I thought this was obviously symbolic of birth, whether Trinity is actually pregnant or not.

Can't have been your post I saw, because the post I saw the member was banging on about Trinity being pregnant.
Will

[adam]

Yes that was me. I think she is pregnant and that's why the extended love/rave scene and the ultrasound scene. All I was saying is that it looked like an ultrasound, I never said anything about it sounding like one.

Zion isn't necessarily created by the Matrix, its created by the humans in the Matrix, but they are pretty much led into doing it. Like the architect said, after the fall of Zion there will be a specific number of survivors who will rebuild it. Its still the humans doing the work but the machines are the masterminds tricking them into doing exactly what they want them to do. The machines have control over the humans on many levels. This isn't just my perception of the movie, the architect explains it pretty directly. The simple fact that he knows what will happen and that it has already happened 6 times before makes it clear that Zion is part of the machine's plan.

[g_shocker182]

An interesting shot from Matrix Revolutions:



Here's a hilarious shot of Neo being kicked into a subway wall...or is he cheerleading?

[g_shocker182]

Anybody think the first picture may be of 01?

[tgpo]

[quote="g_shocker182"]Here's a hilarious shot of Neo being kicked into a subway wall...or is he cheerleading?


Which looks nothing like Mr. Reeves

[mysticgohan17]

Anybody think the first picture may be of 01?

remember in the first movie, when neo came out of his goo filled container in "the real world", he looked up and saw some big, cyllinder towers? yea, thats 01. i got more pictures of the trailer.

edit:
look for persephone

[g_shocker182]

More Screenshots:



Mechwarriors: Matrix Style

[g_shocker182]

Neo fighting Mr. Smith in the real world:

[tgpo]

Keanu looking at the cue cards for his next line.

[g_shocker182]

Those things on the gun appear to be CO2 canisters commonly used for paintballing

[Faustus]

The machines keep running the cycle. They gather up all the reject humans in Zion using the prophecy to trick them into believing they can some day free themselves. Neo is sort of the catalyst. They all get behind him, and more than likely he is a program who is basically mirrors the Matrix. I think this is why he has more powers than everyone else. They are trying to pefect the Matrix program and they are using Neo as the test. He keeps getting to that room, and is repeatedly offered the same choice. The day he picks the other door is the day that the Matrix has been perfected. Until then, they will keep reloading the system, wiping out all the rejects and starting over.

The first part is true about Zions use. Though interesting, the part about Neo being a program is just theory. Just wanted to point that out to avoid confusion. Matter of fact I think its untrue, as everything seems to suggest that the One is a side effect of the enviroment of the matrix and not planned thing. But its all just rampant speculation until the next movie I guess.

I just don't understand why so many people have problems with this movie... its not that hard to understand even after seeing it once.

[adam]

Oh absolutely, I never meant for that to be anything other than speculation. Whether or not the machines literally created him or not, the point is that he is the catalyst. He is the main anamoly in the system. When they clear up the whole NEO + followers phenomenon, then they have perfected the system. Until that happens they just use them as lab rabbits to fine tune their program.

[mysticgohan17]

"The child"

[Will Hay]

I just don't understand why so many people have problems with this movie... its not that hard to understand even after seeing it once.

Whoopee for you.
You managed to grasp a peice of science fiction quicker than the rest of us.
W.

[Will Hay]

He keeps getting to that room, and is repeatedly offered the same choice. The day he picks the other door is the day that the Matrix has been perfected. Until then, they will keep reloading the system, wiping out all the rejects and starting over.

Okay, so at the risk of appearing stupid and being lambasted by some for still not 'getting it'.
He, and all his predecessors, had a choice as to which door they choose.
The door on the right meant he would temp. be reloaded back into the source (the matrix programme), the anomoly would be determined and the matrix effectively remade/reloaded as 'perfect'.
Yes?
The door on the left would lead back to Zion (although this doesn't exist, it's within the Matrix) and Neo would be responsible for wiping out the human race.
The thing that I can't get my head around is...

The Architect said that if he choose the door to the left, all mankind would be wiped out and the matrix would crash spectactulaly, resulting in the detah of everyone connected to the Matrix.
This is the door both Neo and all his predecessors have taken, right?
If so, why are there still humans kicking around?
Surely if the one before Neo had taken the door on the left then, if the Architect wasn't bluffing (as I suspected when I first saw the movie), the entire human race would be excinct.
If he had taken the door to the right then he would have been allowed to choose a number of men and women to rebuild Zion, but why?
If the Matrix would have been perfect as a result of Neo going through the door on the right there would be no need for Zion.
This Architect doesn't seem to be telling the whole truth if you ask me.
Okay, off you go, mock away.
Will

[Will Hay]

Any chance some of these (repeated) images can be reduced, they're making the page difficult to read as I'm having to scroll left and right.
Will

[Craig Tucker]

Increase your screen resolution to 1280 x 1024, it then all fits in. You may need binoculars to read the text though.

[lordsmurf]

Increase your screen resolution to 1280 x 1024

FYI: This is why home-made websites often die. I refuse to change my resolution because somebody on the other side did something that was too large for normal consumption.

Anyway, if the system is all lies, how do we know the architect didn't already know Neo would basically say "screw you" and tell him the wrong door to take (effectively becoming the door the Matrix wanted him to take all along). This is my biggest problem: honesty and the door scene. It doesn't fit.

[Faustus]

I just don't understand why so many people have problems with this movie... its not that hard to understand even after seeing it once.

Whoopee for you.
You managed to grasp a peice of science fiction quicker than the rest of us.
W.

Woah. Wasn't trying to insult anyone, I really just can't understand why its so hard for some people to wrap their heads around the film.

The Architect said that if he choose the door to the left, all mankind would be wiped out and the matrix would crash spectactulaly, resulting in the detah of everyone connected to the Matrix.
This is the door both Neo and all his predecessors have taken, right?
If so, why are there still humans kicking around?

No if he had taken the door all the other Ones had taken Zion would be wiped out and restarted, and the Machines would come one step closer to perfecting the Matrix. But Neo alone took the other door to save Trinity and so the Machine predicts the destruction of mankind. Why are they not gone?


*begin rampant speculaton*
We'll its only technically been a few mins since he took the door. Basicly there is no one to restart zion, and the matrix is hopelessly corrupted by Smith, it needs to be reloaded but if the Rebels are still around and Neo is unwilling to play his part they are kinda in a rock and a hard place. I think what the arcitect meant when he said Humanity would be destoryed is that if he took that door they would still destory Zion, but being unable to properly reload and further profect the Matrix it would be destoryed and therefore all humanity would be gone. I think the question is can Neo stop Zion from being destoryed AND stop Smith.

Of course all speculation will likely fall apart 10 min into the movie...

I hope that made since, cause reading back over it, it doesn't feel right...

And yes I find table breaking pictures in a non picture specific thread annoying also. Are there no smaller versions out there?

[adam]

If he takes the door that all the other Neo's did, then humanity will be destroyed. This is what the Reloading is. The computers are just rebooting the system, but to the humans it is the end of the world as they know it. That's why in the final movie there are glitches all over the place. The Matrix program is reloading itself and is essentially falling apart at the seams. It/they purge themselves of all the rejects and start clean. It's a process, it doesn't happen instantaneously. The Architect is cryptic, but he's telling the truth. Humanity as they know it is going to end, and Zion is going to be destroyed if he takes that door, which he does. The architect is essentially just saying, if you take that door I'm hitting the reset button.

This is the exact same thing that has happened 5, or is it 6 times before? Each time the ONE completes his prophecy, they have learned a little more about the anomoly and how it reacts to the modified system. They are hoping that someday Neo will choose the other door, and in the mean time write this current Neo off as another failed attempt. But more than likely, the final installment will show that somehow somewhere, the humans get the upper hand and end the process once and for all.

If he had taken the other door, he would essentially be giving in to the idea that a life in slavery is better than no life at all. He would be giving in to the Matrix.

Or am I getting the two doors confused? Its a been a while since I saw it in theatres and my DVD is still in the mail.

[Will Hay]

Okay, thanks guys, becoming clearer
But....
If the other 'ONES' took the other door each time (and Neo didn't), the door on the right and the matrix was reloaded, Zion was wiped out (as it's part of the Matrix), why was the 'ONE' allowed to pick a band of humans to rebuild Zion?
Is it simply a case that the baddies need Zion until they perfect the system (which they will do as each of the 'ONE' goes through the door on the right)?
If I'm right, as I suspected first time I saw the movie, I think the Architect was bluffing and there's more than just hitting reload and everyone connected with the Matrix dying.
Also, I still can't figure the bomb, all the flames that effectively pursued Neo after he entered the door on the left.

As for the posted pictures, they've already been posted in that 'reloaded poll' of tgpo's and for me are sure making this thread hard to read
I'm not changing my res, me and lordsmurf are united on thsi one, why should I?
Will

[Will Hay]

If he takes the door that all the other Neo's did, then humanity will be destroyed.

But allowed to keep a small number to rebuild Zion, right?
It's the door he does take that the Arhcitect predicts will be the total meltdown of the matrix and the deat of everyone in it.
From what I understand from flaystud he is the first ONE to take the other door, all the previous ONE'S took the safe option and reloaded Matrix, the baddies came a little closer to perfection and sure enough, 100 years later, the choice was made again until, the 6th time later, Neo fu*ked the system and choose the other door.
Have I got it?
Man, I hope so
Will

[adam]

No, now I know that's not correct. All the Neo's have picked the same door, including the current one.

Door on the left: goes back to the Matrix. The system will be rebooted and life as they know it will end. Zion will be destroyed and everyone Neo loves will die.

Door on the right: Leads to the source of the Matrix. Zion will be saved, none of his friends will die (except Trinity who is supposed to be unsaveable). Life of slavery will continue forever....robots win, the end.

Neo has always picked the door on the left. Its the human response. He won't sacrifice Trinity, he wants to at least try to save her. He can't realize the efficiency of the Matrix or just accept his existence as a slave. He rejects the Matrix because he is essentially an anomoly in the system. So, back to square 1. The system gets rebooted, Zion is destroyed, the survivors rebuild. The legend of the ONE is passed down to their ancestors and that is where the prophecy begins all over for the next round. The robots hope that one day the ONE will pick the door on the right and the system will be perfect and require no further rebooting/revision.

I think in revelations something is going to happen, or maybe it already has, which will let the humans break the cycle. They will find a way to win.

Do a google search for architect Matrix script. Read the transcript, its obvious what each door does and its much easier to understand what happened.

[Will Hay]

Hey Adam,
My wife is sat here with me (right now) reading both your post and mine, and she agrees with you...
....I am an idiot
Will

[adam]

That's not so bad. My wife refuses to have this discussion with me.