VHS to DVD, compressing files

[bottle-necked]

http://www.ulead.com/vs/trial.htm

http://www.ati.com/products/multimedia.html

http://www.pricewatch.com

[MOVIEGEEK]

@reenie143,
If you want menus use Ulead DVD MovieFactory,if you want effects then get Ulead VideoStudio.
More info:https://www.videohelp.com/capture

[reenie143]

I went to the ULead DVD MovieFactory site and under user comments, they weren't very good.....how can I even be sure that a product is good and reliable? I thought my Dazzle product was and now I hear bad things about other so called good products too.....i don't understand

[jdizzy40]

Yes you too, got ripped off by a crappy product which was on the shelf of a reputable Store. Welcome to the world of learning how to learn what not to buy. Start over, but this time do it right. There are no quick fixes in life.

[reenie143]

i understand......i intend to start over.....but what do i start over with?

[FulciLives]

Well the problem is there is no real surefire or ultra cheap method to do what you want to do.

It takes a lot of time to get it right.

At the bare minimum you need some sort of capture device to record the video to the computer. Then you need a program to edit it. Then you need a program to convert it to MPEG-2 video and either MP2 or AC-3 audio. Then you need a program to author your MPEG-2 video/audio files and finally burn to a DVD recordable.

1.) Capture Card
I suggest you try the AverTV Stereo. You can buy this at CompUSA for $49.99 but of course you can also order it on-line from many places.

2.) If your computer has a built-in sound card then you will need a sound card otherwise you may get out-of-synch audio when you capture. All you need is the SoundBlaster 16-bit card. I just bought one for $29.99 at BEST BUY and it works. I was using my built-in soundcard but realized that with longer captures it was going out-of-synch. Not so now that I'm using a real sound card.

3.) To capture with this setup I use VirtualVCR. This program is free.

4.) To edit I use VirtualDubMod (which is a modified version of VirtualDub). This is free. Please note that you can only do simple "cut" editing with this. It's good for trimming the start and end points of your capture. It's good for cutting out middle portions of the video such as TV commercials. It's not good at cuting out a scene and moving it to another spot or doing anything advanced. This will probably suit you but if not then you will need something like the aforementioned Ulead VideoStudio. Not sure how much that is but you are probably looking at at least $100 or more for a decent editing program. Assuming VirtualDub is ill suited for your editing tasks.

5.) You then need to convert your audio and video to MPEG-2 format. For this you can use TMPGEnc. It is fairly simple to use ONCE you learn how to use it. It isn't the EASIEST program to use right off the bat but of all the MPEG-2 encoding program it is the easiest and will give great results.

6.) You then need to author your DVD. Most people around here use DVDLab or TMPG DVD Author (which is an authoring program only whereas TMPGEnc is the encoding program). These have free 30 day trail periods after which they cost something like $70

7.) Burn your DVD using your authoring program or ImgTool/DVD Decrypter.

The problem here is it takes a LONG time to learn all this stuff and get it tweaked as they say. Also TMPGEnc works wonders but is slow. It is not uncommon when converting your capture to MPEG-2 for it to take several times the length of the clip. On my computer (admittingly slow) it takes about 30 plus hours to encode 2 hours. If I had a MUCH faster computer (like a 2.4Ghz or better) then I would expect that to drop down to around half that (give or take). The MPEG-2 encoding time is dependant mostly on the CPU speed of the computer.

Unfortuantely there is not simple easy solution UNLESS ...

Consider buying a stand alone DVD recorder. Very little fuss. Records in real time. No editing unless you buy an expensive model but for around $400 or less you can get a basic model (consider PANASONIC) that will make it very easy to transfer VHS to DVD without needing to know a whole lot. However please note that most do not like to put more than 2 hours on a DVD disc because the quality is degraded. With the stand alone there isn't a whole lot you can do. There is a 4 hour mode but most find it not very good in quality. On the computer you can tweak things so that you can get more than 3 hours at decent quality. However please don't ever expect to get more than 4 hours (I never would go over 3 hours myself) on a DVD if you actually want anything that looks halfway decent.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

P.S.
If you are going to use the computer method it is best to capture to a second physical hard drive. Also you will need at least 40GB free to work with. Less than that and you might end up running out of room for your capture.

[DaveS]

just a second to the recommendation of standalone given the requirements above - very easy to use, little learning curve, not looking for a lot of tweeks to quality, etc.

there is a learning curve for all this s/w, even the less expensive ones people mention (in fact, probably more so- some of these tools are not expensive, are very powerful, but do not have a simple user interface).

search for comments on the panasonic standalone dvd recorders on this site - the people who do mention them seem to have positive things to say.

these devices will do what you want - convert VHS to DVD. imho, they can't replace the $$$ more that people spend on all this h/w and s/w and then add to it all the knowledge that these people bring here (people have careers doing this stuff and can probably talk volumes about a subject that your or I will spend 5 mins. on).

suggestion would be to do some research here, buy one from a reputable place that will give you 30 days to bring it back (they may only want a certain# of hours use on the machine) and try a few and see if you are satisfied w/ the results. all you have to lose is the cost of the media and a few hours time.

best of luck w/ this.

[reenie143]

i don't know about getting a standalone just because we already have a dvd burner on our computer

[vhelp]

.
.
Here is a partial of what it's all about here...

* money (lots of it)
* gadgets (lots of them too) analog capture cards, dv devices, hardware etc.
* time (LOTS of it) learn; attention span; and coffee

And, try them all (guies, tips, techniques etc) through trial and error.

The above is the ultimate bottom baseline for the majority of us you see here
posting responses to your questions (if you got answers you learned from)
that have ben here many years.

I started at the bottom. And, it did not take me over night to learn all this
fun stuff. And, I'm still learning things. But, I can say that I have a pretty
good grasp of most everything here (except the newer thing, ie dvd autho
etc) That's my next learning steps And, I know it will take me some time
to learn. But, I'm willing to learn, and take the time, because I want as best
a product I can humanly possibly do

FulciLives gave some very good advices and steps. A good building block
if want. I'd follow that and build (w/ experience and trial and error) now.
By christmas, you should be quite bored (I mean) satisfied :P w/ some of the
hard work you've put into the whole process

Hay, but the one thing you never mentioned here, is what exactly is your
source you are trying to convert to DVD to, and the quality OF those source
You could be pounding your head for nothing, if your source is terible to
begin w/ (not to mention our heads too, for try to help you)

Another recommend I can give is to print out all the guides that you would
like to try, so that you don't have to be bothered w/ all the connect and
things. Whole punch them and make nice binders (w/ tabs) and you're set
to go (and have fun)

But, good luck thus far in your new endeavor,
-vhelp

[reenie143]

so the newest question of the day.....should we keep our Dazzle product?....it is the device we use for capturing so should we keep it and just use other software to edit, burn and whatnot?......i'm unsure of whether i should return the dazzle connector or if i should keep it to capture the video

[reenie143]

one more question.....why do we need to convert our files after we capture and edit?.....from what we have done now, they are MPEG2 files......would we still have to convert them?

[Don2050]

If you were satisfied with the quality of the files from the Dazzle then yes keep it since you already know how to use it.

What everyone was basically trying to say is if you want to fit more movies on one DVD the only way to do this is by decreasing the quality of all of them. If this is an acceptable trade off for you (Lower quality = More movies per DVD) then just encode your VHS tapes at a lower bitrate and you can fit more on there. If quality is of concern then essentially you are stuck at the hour and a half per DVD. (Unless you experiment with other procedures and programs)

No, you dont need to re-encode them, if you capture to MPEG2 files you are encoding them in realtime already and dont need further encoding as long as they are DVD compliant. The reason most people capture to avi first then encode to MPEG2 seperatly is to edit. Editing is much easier when in some form of uncompressed/lossless compressed format... (ie..avi) But you can still do basic editing in MPEG format (cut/merge) or if you dont need to edit at all then capturing direct to MPEG is a viable option.

Goodluck

[reenie143]

ok, so then at what step do we encode and what program do we use to encode?

[reenie143]

or am i misunderstanding....and encoding is actually capturing the videos at a lower bitrate?

[Don2050]

ok...you shouldnt need to encode as they are already MPEG2 files which is what DVD's use.

I am going assume you mean 'Author' (The process of creating menus and turning your MPEG2 files into IFO/BUP/VOB files) and I would recommend using Ulead DVD movie Factory 2. I know you saw it had some bad reviews but give it shot cause it is about the easiest authoring program I know of. You essentially drag and drop your mpeg2 files in the program then select a template for a menu and hit create.

For burning you will have a VIDEO_TS folder that Ulead DVD Movie factory 2 will have output, you can drag it to either Nero (DVD UDF) or RecordNow Max or use imgtools to create an iso file of the IFO/VOB/BUP files and then use any program to burn that image file.

[reenie143]

so by using that program and authoring our files, they will be compressed and ready to burn....and will fit more on a dvd?

[Don2050]

Assuming you have done everything right thus far ... yes. but not more...the more part is dependent on step 3.

1. Capture
2. Edit
3. Encode
4. Author
5. Burn


In your case I am guessing that the encoding part was done automatically during capture.

The encoding part is the part the 'Squishes' the movies to a smaller size....the authoring part does not affect the file size in anyway...it simply adds all the pieces together (audio/video) and sets up how you will interact with those pieces once you play it in your DVD player..(ie menu's)

It is only once you have done all of this ( encode to MPEG2, author the MPEG2 files to VOB/IFO/BUP and create a menu) can you burn the VIDEO_TS and AUDIO_TS folders to a DVD disc and then watch it in your standalone DVD player.

[reenie143]

thank you so much.....this is really helping

[FulciLives]

so by using that program and authoring our files, they will be compressed and ready to burn....and will fit more on a dvd?

Dude you are NOT getting it. Not at all. You appear to be reading here what people are saying and nothing else. There are guides on this website ... a lot of guides ... which you NEED to read.

You don't even understand the basic terminology.

It's like you are a caveman and we've gone back in time and we are trying to explain the concept of germs or the fact that "possessed" people have a mental illness and are not demon infested.

But like that caveman you can't handle it all because you have no frame of referrence.

Read some guides. Dig into it. Otherwise leave us alone and buy a stand alone DVD recorder.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[reenie143]

i really appreciate all of the help everyone has been giving us.....we are college students and don't have the time to learn every single aspect of this kind of project. We realize that we don't understand all of the terminology, but this is like learning French on an all French website when all you know is English-i don't think that makes us cavemen. We are trying to learn as we go along which is rough, but we can't afford to do this as a full time job right now. Please keep the advice coming....every bit helps. Sorry if we are offending anyone by taking the easy way out. Thanks again.

[reenie143]

does anyone know if we can set our bitrate lower when using Dazzle to capture our files?

[Bob W]

A simple program that will not ony author your files but allow you to edit, shrink, and even burn the finished files is NeoDVD Plus. I think it sells online for around $50 USD.

[reenie143]

ok, but does anyone know if we will be able to set our bitrate lower when we begin to capture using Dazzle?

[lordsmurf]

i really appreciate all of the help everyone has been giving us.....we are college students and don't have the time to learn every single aspect of this kind of project. We realize that we don't understand all of the terminology, but this is like learning French on an all French website when all you know is English-i don't think that makes us cavemen. We are trying to learn as we go along which is rough, but we can't afford to do this as a full time job right now. Please keep the advice coming....every bit helps. Sorry if we are offending anyone by taking the easy way out. Thanks again.

Are you referring to yourself as "we" ?

Anyway, your analogy doesn't really fit. We're talking the same language. You say you're in college? Imagine taking the final exam without reading any books and never going to class. That's what you're trying to do.

Don't have time? Well, sorry, can't help you. This is going to take time to learn. If it is such a burden on time, maybe this isn't for you. They do make DVD recorders, which are easier, but more expensive.

I'd try to help you, but I don't think you'll understand my advice. You should read, experiment, work with things for a few weeks, then come back after you have a grasp of concepts.

Start with the documentation that came with the card and your software. Then go to the card maker's or software maker's website and read. Then come here and read. Then test things out. Experiment. Invest in DVD-RW discs. And know that most software has trials, so don't buy anything until you see results you like.

And the Dazzle card? Well, it's not the greatest, but I guess it'll do. The only introductory device I ever liked was the now-discontinued Pinnacle Bungee DVD. Beyond that, I'd stick to an ATI AIW card.

[reenie143]

"we" refers to my sister and i.....i understand where you are coming from....we're researching and reading more to get a better grasp on this stuff....thanks for the advice

[Don2050]

You are on the right track now that you are trying to lower the bitrate in Dazzle...unfortunately I do not use any Dazzle products so I cannot help...but I would imagine it is under any advanced options or encoding options....just keep looking...or untill someone who uses dazzle replies....

UPDATE: ok...here is a guide to capture and encode using dazzle...it is for VCD's but can be applied to DVD's https://www.videohelp.com/dazzlecapture.htm

The most salient part of this is the bitrate settings ....

STEP 1: The method i use.
First and foremost, i highly recommend using a small portable fan and have it blowing on the Dazzle. This keeps the device cool and helps stop frame dropping and/or possible audio and video off sync.
Next we are going to change some settings in the Dazzle software. Change the template to "movie quality" and change the bitrate to 2900 (or however many zeros follow) also making sure "high" is also checked. By doing this you are increasing the data rate(bitrate) at which the Dazzle will capture. If you have a slower pc, i would also check the "post process". What that does is after you record your clip it will put the audio and video together. Doing it that way takes a lot of stress off your pc and is mainly for those with a slower machine, this way you can capture long clips with no problems. If you can uncheck the "monitor while recording" this also helps the pc make a better capture. Once this is all done watch your captured clip and you will see a big difference then when you captured using the video cd template. I also never have the sharpeness set higher then "1" doing so will add extra noise and other artifacts to your clip. Trust me, "1" is high enough.

[reenie143]

thanks a lot.....tomorrow morning i am going to try and lower the bitrate and see how that works....i will keep you posted on the outcome

[gmatov]

Don2050's post alone is enough to tell me you should take this device back and have someone install a 125 buck ATI, or have almost any other actual PCI card installed in your machine.

My own main machine has an MSI card in it, and it gives me at least a dozen choices of bitrate/formats, from MPEG4 to full DVD.

If the Dazzle is as complicated/crippled as you are intimating that it is, take it back!!!

There are other cards that will make a movie for you as you capture.

Hell's bells, girls, my Pinnacle PCTV allowed me to cap VHS and cut out all the non-essentials before I told it to "Make Movie".

You just keep arguing with those who have been trying to help you, saying you want to do this before Christmas. Good Grief, if you had a decent capture device you would be done by this time tomorrow.

Get a cheap ATI cap card, an AIW VE, or 128 or something and go to Lordsmurf's site and get all the info you need. They'e probably 50 bucks or less.

If you were my daughters, I'd probably recall you from school, as you two do not seem to be able to learn anything from all the advice given here. Just complain that you don't have time to learn "all this stuff".

Your only alternative is to buy a standalone DVD recorder and play the tapes into it, same as recording VCR to VCR.

Sorry if I offend you, but....

George

[DaveS]

reenie143 - here's a suggestion ...

- take a break from all of this for a few days; just let the dust settle & clear your heads

- decide A: do you want to / have time to invest in learning this stuff, or is it just getting in the way of your school work and what you really want which are the dvd's; it will take some time on your part if you go the route of putting the videos on a computer and making your own dvd's; there's no way around that; also, be aware that a little more $ may be needed if you don't like how the dazzle is working out; also you'll need to buy blank dvd's

- decide B: do you have the $ available for a stand alone recorder if you don't have the time to invest in A; suggestion in this case - sell the dvd burner you have & get some cash for it if you're not going to use it

- decide C: is this a one-shot deal (e.g. videos for the holidays) or is this something which you will continue to learn, work on, etc. if it's a one shot deal, and cash is low, buy a set-top recorder from a reputable place, use it for a few hours and bring it back in perfect condition w/ all of the box and packaging (and don't lose that stuff or your credit card will take a hit) - maybe this would only cost 10-15% restocking fee. if this is more than a one-shot deal, then congratulations on gettig started(!) on the road to learning this stuff, read the guides, and let us know how it's going; also, take some time to gather your thoughts so you don't have to post so many posts in a row - give us one w/ some well thought out questions and people will be very willing to help (and, I'm not trying to be rude, just helpful in terms of what people will respond well to).

good luck & let us know how it's going for you....

[overloaded_ide]

Got tired of reading and skipped alot. I'll go back and read more.

Here's the cheapest and fastest and easiest way to get your movies done probably, though not the best!

Go to wallmart, make sure they still have the 90 day return policy, buy a standalone DVD recorder ($450) connect that to your VCR, hit play on VCR, record on recorder, when movie is done, start next one!
1 hr movie take 1 hour to make, 3 hour movie takes 3 hours.

When done take back recorder and tell them you don't like it and get your money back. That will probably be the trueth, you won't really like it and won't want it, so you did nothing wrong in trying it and using their 90 return!! If you do like it, keep it!

Other wise for fast and decent results to start with that you can expand on latter, get a ATI AIW capture card. Use the MMC 7.7 or above software that either comes with the card or Download it from the ATI site if you get an older version with the card.
Capture to mpeg2 files with 48,000hz audio. Select a bit rate using the bit rate calculator for the amount of time per disk you want. More time equals less quality, but 2-3hrs should be fair to good. DO NOT use the built in templates, look for best settings and such in guides for capturing like lordsmurfs. 352X480 I think is what I use.

Get tmpgenc DVD author, 30day fully working free demo, use that to open your mpeg 2 files and author the dvd files. You can also burn the disk with it too. Great program, never fails me! You can make a fast no brain required DVD or you can read the help files and make a fancy DVD with motion menus and such, your choice.

Get DVDshrink ver 2.3 AND 3beta5, both are free! If you author a disk that is too big, shrink it with those. Only thing I ever use for ripping and shrinking!

Lots more you should learn and ways to do even better, but for a fast and get it over with solution this works great!
Primarily how I do most of my VHS to DVD conversions, though I do alot more also. I try lots of new things and do lots of reading!!!
Many of my old VHS movies I just want on DVD same as tape, so I just capture, author, and burn with few advanced options. Others I want fancier and I use motion menu, background pics, or other more fancy stuff.

I also try other programs, but for a beginer I can't recomend tmpgenc dvd author enough, there may be better and easier solutions to start with but I have not found them.