VHS to DVD/complete capture to edit to menu creation to DVDr

[actvlsnr]

Hi, this is my first post here, just to get my fet wet.

Interesting to read your post. I also just started a tape to DVD transfer business in Northern Mexico and am also struggling to get good/reliable info about how to do it well. This site has been invaluable as a resource as have been some of the DV trade magazines like DV and Computer Videographer to learn about professional equipment.

Here is my set-up

Source is:

Entry-level JVC S-VHS (HR-S2901U)
Consumer Betamax 2400

then:
DataVideo TBC-1000 through S-Video
then:
ADS Pyro A/V Link to get DV AVI. It has S-Video Out so I can monitor on external monitor.

I capture and edit this DV AVI stream via Firewire with Premiere 6.5 and if necessary Restore with VirtualDub´s excellent filters. (flicker, cropping, levels, etc)

I author, encode simple DVDs with Ulead DVD Movie Factory

Burn with Sony Dual Format DVDburner vis USB 2.2

For those of you that have done this for a while, is this an efficient setup?

This month I will be upgrading to:
Adobe Premiere Video Collection
-Adobe Premiere Pro
-After Effects 6
-Adobe Encore DVD
-Adobe Audition

[pixel]

It is a relatively good setup.

The only 2 bits I could criticise are:
1. Your VCRs. These probably won't give the best quality for your customers, and might not play quite beaten up tapes. The best is a JVC HRS9xxx (visit www.lordsmurf.com he has experience of making DVDs from VHS for others and he knows his stuff about VCRs.) Basically, you need a good VCR, because you can't get any better than the source material, so you want the source displayed the best way.
2. Using Ulead DVDWS to encode. It is a poor encoder. I use it only for authoring DVD's. Use a different encoder to encode to DVD format (or even an add-on encoder for premiere) and use DVDWS to author the DVD with the "do not convert compliant file" flag on.

[Will Hay]

This is rubbish, but I think it's just a case of your naivety (no offence).
As overloaded quite rightly points out, you are not encoding at all, you are simply converting your DV footage to your PC via firewire.

So, it's an act of magic that an analog video is converted to a digital signal? Perhaps it is niave to call it encoding, but when that video is being changed over by a hardware codec, I call it encoding.

It's not encoding, plain and simple, nor is it an act of magic.
These boards are here to help everyone learn, and the simple fact is you are not encoding.
It's a function called passthrough which converts the anaolgue signal to digital.
How would you feel if someone with three posts to his name went out and spent ££££ on the same camcorder because you claim it encodes on the fly?
Okay, so you got your terminology wrong, but by not identifying your error to other users simply means confusion and incorrect information.
Simple.
I don't respond soley to help you as you claim to be able to produce a six hour dvd with no loss of quality, I post to help anyone who wishes to read and learn.
Again, no offence, but someone asking such basic question will never, ever, ever convince me that putting six hours of footage on a dvd will result in anything but a noticable loss of quality.
In fact, Baldrick couldn't convince me.
Will Hay

[Jimbo71]

Pixel, what do you suggest?
To remove all my codecs? and replenish?

I know I have encoding codecs installed, but yes I do have quite a lot, how do I know which to delete and which to keep?

Once they are deleted from the control panel/audio & video setup of XP, are they removed permanently from my PC?

[pighead]

Maybe I'm being a little simplistic but I use my sharp dvd recorder (standalone) and either the iee 1394 port on the front if it is a dv camcorder or svhs or composites if it is vhs.

The sharp does the mpeg encoding in the 1,2, 4, or 6 hr mode based on the amount of content and I burn to an RW and finalize.

I take the finalized RW and load it into my pioneer A06 and copy the VIDEO_TS directory to my hard disk and edit it in DVD Author and add menus and the title page and then burn to r, if it ends up too large then use a shrink app to make it fit to 4.9.

I have good quality and the most time consuming parts are off my cpu and onto the Sharp!

[FOO]

If DV isn't encoded, why are the little programs that deal
with it called Codecs ?
Of course its encoded ! DV is a lossy compression encode.
Just because it's done in the camera (and before it goes on tape)
doesn't mean it's not encoded.

Raw 720 x 480 video is 10 megapixels/sec. At 2 bytes/pixel
its 20 megabytes/sec. DV is 3.5 megabytes/sec.
How do you do that without encoding it ?

[actvlsnr]

thanks PIXEL

Just staring out so in my innocence I bought the HR-S2901U and can't return it now. Next VCR purchase is HR-S9911U or industrial model. Also, for Beta, am trying to get my hands on a version of the Industrial Sony EDV-9500 that has S-Video out but they are soooo expensive on eBay and other Beta sites ($1200-$1800) so doing some Flea-Market diving in my area to get my hands on at least a hi-fi beta. Beta survived a bit longer in Mexico so more old Beta tapes that need transfering.

On the business/marketing side, has anyone purchased the Video/Book called "Secrets of Running a Successful Video Transfer Business" by Steve Yankee--$70.00. or DVD Authoring & Production by Ralph LaBarge $54.95. Any review of these books would be appreciated

[Will Hay]

If DV isn't encoded, why are the little programs that deal
with it called Codecs ?
Of course its encoded ! DV is a lossy compression encode.
Just because it's done in the camera (and before it goes on tape)
doesn't mean it's not encoded.

Raw 720 x 480 video is 10 megapixels/sec. At 2 bytes/pixel
its 20 megabytes/sec. DV is 3.5 megabytes/sec.
How do you do that without encoding it ?

Yes, okay.
My point was it's not encoded to a format for a dvd player is all, hence the following question in my very first post in this thread

As I've used neither I can't comment but I'd be interested to learn of camcorder that can encode (presumably to dvd/mpeg2, right?).

Will Hay

[Will Hay]

[deleted] duplicated message, sorry

[lordsmurf]

I'm about 5 minutes away from upgrading my Win2K machine up to WinXP-Pro, as I finally got Adobe Encore today.

Just to share my new editing method, for editing video at least:
- ATI AIW using AVI capture (uncompressed raw)
- Adobe Premiere & After Effects & Photoshop -> MPEG Encoder -> Encore

Old editing method:
- ATI AIW using AVI capture (uncompressed raw)
- Adobe Premiere -> MPEG Encoder
- Photoshop menus -> DVDit! PE -> Nero 5.5.10.20

My pure transfer method remains the same:
- ATI AIW MPEG2 capture
- Womble splicing to remove commercials/whatever
- Photoshop menus -> DVDit! PE to author
- Nero 5.5.10.20 to burn

The Encore and After Effects looks pretty damned hard from what I've seen and heard, but I'm up for the challenge. Again, don't ask me anything about them, the boxes are not even opened yet. I'm trying to finish all of lordsmurf.com before I start my next project.

If you have money and patience, try it the Adobe way!

[FOO]

I've got a Sony Hi8 with a USB(1) coming out. I can't seems to capture
anything except with the supplied software. I don't know
how to figure out what format is coming out of the USB but
when it gets on the disk it's MPEG1. (and Very poor quality BTW)
Of course even if I had control of it, the USB bandwidth wouldn't
allow anything very good.

I always capture analog out of it. :Looks much better

[Anonymous843]

I've got a Sony Hi8 with a USB(1) coming out. I can't seems to capture
anything except with the supplied software. I don't know
how to figure out what format is coming out of the USB but
when it gets on the disk it's MPEG1. (and Very poor quality BTW)
Of course even if I had control of it, the USB bandwidth wouldn't
allow anything very good.

I always capture analog out of it. :Looks much better

You need USB 2 or firewire for any decent video transfer.

[FOO]

Not much use knowing that is it if I can't change the camera

[Will Hay]

Not much use knowing that is it if I can't change the camera

No, but if you didn't know before at least now you know you're fucked.

[FOO]

How true

[pixel]

Pixel, what do you suggest?
To remove all my codecs? and replenish?

I know I have encoding codecs installed, but yes I do have quite a lot, how do I know which to delete and which to keep?

Once they are deleted from the control panel/audio & video setup of XP, are they removed permanently from my PC?

Unless, you have the original install program stored on CD or soemthing, then yes your codecs will be removed from your PC completely once you delete them. If you don't want to delete them, maybe try a different version of VDub, or even a different AVI capturing program. If none of your codecs show up in the other AVI capturing programs, it is probably likely some codecs are having conflicts.

[Jimbo71]

What other capturing programs can you recommend?
I have just been using Studio 8 up until now.

[pixel]

What other capturing programs can you recommend?
I have just been using Studio 8 up until now.

Maybe try FreeVCR or AVIIO to see if you can access the codecs.

[jborge]

It is a relatively good setup.

The only 2 bits I could criticise are:
1. Your VCRs. These probably won't give the best quality for your customers, and might not play quite beaten up tapes. The best is a JVC HRS9xxx (visit www.lordsmurf.com he has experience of making DVDs from VHS for others and he knows his stuff about VCRs.) Basically, you need a good VCR, because you can't get any better than the source material, so you want the source displayed the best way.
2. Using Ulead DVDWS to encode. It is a poor encoder. I use it only for authoring DVD's. Use a different encoder to encode to DVD format (or even an add-on encoder for premiere) and use DVDWS to author the DVD with the "do not convert compliant file" flag on.

Finally!
I have been looking for for a guide for VCR capture and www.lordsmurf.com is it!

Thanks for the advice!

[themichael]

May I suggest dual booting with XP. I have found out the hard way, if XP works - it works great. If it don't work correctly from the start it will get worse. This directly linked to driver issues. Very few people/companies (including Microsoft) can write truely compliant drivers.

The dual boot will allow you to test your machine without losing any data as 2k can read XP partitions. If it all works out, do a complete fresh install and have at it.

XP - love it or hate it, no middle ground.

-----change in subject-------

How do you survive during a new business with no civilian customers?
I tried to start up a conversion biz, the only competition was a mail order service at some Walgreens and a store front 60 miles away. Couldn't find anybody. Offered video montages, convert to DVD, video copy, etc.

I did have several major local businesses looking to outsource some of their video production but I couldn't afford a Beta-Cam system (US$10K-used) they used as masters.

Mike

[onetrueday]

How do you survive during a new business with no civilian customers?
I tried to start up a conversion biz, the only competition was a mail order service at some Walgreens and a store front 60 miles away. Couldn't find anybody. Offered video montages, convert to DVD, video copy, etc.

I cant speak for everyone, but I'm only doing it as a hobby. I dont know how easy it would be pay the bills on it. I dont expect to make a whole lot of money, so I'm hoping to at least pay off the hardware I've purchased. I've almost reached that point and then it'll be all profit. I work and go to school full time, plus I have a wife and two beautiful girls.

It's just something I really enjoy. Plus, I've learned a great deal about starting up a business.

[Brainiac]

Hi all

This post is right up my alley. I too have started a VHS, 8mm, Hi8, miniDV, VHS-C, S-VHS to DVD service. Really slow getting going, with so many stores (Walmart, Target, Walgreens) also in on the act.

First, here is the rundown on my equipment and software:

P4 2.2GHz CPU, 512 Megs ram, Intel D845BG motherboard (400 MHz FSB), Sony DRU500A DVD Writer, LiteOn 32x12x40x CD Writer, Canopus MVR-1000 MPEG-2 Capture board, Firewire card, JVC HR-S9911U S-VHS VCR, JVC HR-DVS3U S-VHS and miniDV VCR (with firewire port that allows avi captures of VHS tapes as well as the miniDV, of course). Both machines have TBCs built in.

Software: Ulead DVD Workshop, Ulead Cool 3D Production Studio, Ulead MediaPro 6.5, Dazzle DVD Complete, TMPGEnc Plus, Windows XP Home.

I do my VHS captures using the Canopus MVR-1000. MiniDV will be captured as AVI and converted to MPEG-2 through either MediaStudio or TMPGEnc Plus.

Would like comments on above system.

BTW, I charge $20.00 for up to 2 hours per DVD. I don't really like going lower than 2 hours, but will if the client insists. No DVD labels are used; DVDs are printed onto directly using EZ/CD printer. I also use ONLY name-brand media, full-sized DVD cases and full-sized inserts.

Thanks

[gee69]

I, too, am a newbie trying to transfer 8mm tapes to DVD.

I was looking at TMPGEnc Plus 2.520 and then saw TMPGEnc DVD Author 1.5, so now I am totally confused. Does Plus 2.520 create the video_ts folder and the respective files needed to burn to DVD or do I have to get TMPGEnc DVD Author.

My caputre is Canopus ADVC-100 and just great. Now I am using Pinnacle Studio 8 to add titles, transitions, and edit the avi file. Nothing fancy, but I would like to later on since just learning Studio 8. I have Nero and RecordNow. I have not burned any DVD yet from my edited avi since I still have to get a bigger hard drive.

In the meantime, looking and reading on how to's, perusing sites that have some info on video editing and reading the manuals. Pinaccle manuals are not that helpful at all.

Friend recommended Dazzle's DVD Complete which was just bought by Pinnacle and want users to upgrade to Studio of which I have. My friend says Dazzle is very simplistic and easy to learn..

Any advise/recommendations out there.

Thank you to all

[pixel]

Brainiac. The setup looks good. Its nice you have the dual burner Sony. I hope that's so your customers can choose their preference of DVD+/-R.

I don't know much about the canopus board, but if it is full hardware encoding that is fine.

Its nice you also have a sizeable array of software too.

This is not something that you need to change, but maybe if there is a sale on, get another 512MB of RAM. You don't really need to, but if you are going to be using a lot of programs simultaneously and large videos, it will help.

gee69. TMPGEnc Plus just encodes the video and outputs it as MPEG format. So you need to use another program to author the DVD.

TMPGEnc DVD Author reencodes the video, and also creates the menu's etc. Although some people say it is rather simplistic.

Its nice to hear someone reads the guides for help instead of posting questions of their problems.

[overloaded_ide]

If you're capturing via a software method, you're limited to how much you can do with your pc while this is taking place. Even the radeon 9800pro aiw is subject to these limitations. Otherwise you'll drop frames.

On the other hand, the encoding to mpeg2(or 1) process doesnt need be to such a sole focus point. I've run two encoding programs at the same time and then played a game, obviously with no loss of quality and minimal slowdown.

Well, first get another PC
I never drop frames with my 7500 Radeon ATI AIW. I have 4 Pcs though so I seldom worry much about gameing while capturing
I think I have burned a disk while capturing though, and a few other things.
Also IF I remember corectly, ATI AIW cards are BOTH hardware and software based. Not just software. Anything you capture to a PC is subject to loss! DV can also drop frames if your PC can't keep up for some reason. Though it maybe less likely to occure. You are still doing a real time capture, just in a different format. The VHS analogue tape is running even if the camcorder is doing the converting to DV, also if capturing from a DV tape, the tape is running. So either way you are doing a live capture and if the computer chokes for a split second then you drop frames. Even with DV, it is not like a copy from disk where if it misses some info it goes back and reads again. Once you missed it in a capture of any type it is gone for good.

I know someone that was capturing a FM radio station, he was running a program that maxed out his ram and CPU. The program was set for High Priority and his radio capture Dropped FRAMES in video terms! Various results like noises and just lost sections. WHat can be simpler than capturing a Fm radio broadcast through the line in of your soundcard?

Also, I am capturing directly to Mpeg2 DVD compliant files, ready for an authoring program! I consider my results as good as the original tapes. You can change change things many ways, but you never get better than the source! What you gain here, you lose there. Often like adjusting colors manually. Want deeper darker blues? Your red turns purple! It's all a balance based on the source. Though you can adjust the balance to suit your taists. There are things you can do with a progrm like Tmpgenc Plus to improve a capture file. De-interlace, remove noise ect.. that might help some. I don't use it though, takes too long for me. I am happy with VHS quality from a VHS source, and 4 hours for minimal improvements I am not patient enough for. Also I can de-interlace on the fly durring capture, have to experiment with that some still.

You encoded to mpeg2 with 2 programs at the same time and played a game with minimal slowdown?? Well I haven't tried that, but based on my knowledge of PCs I find it hard to beleave! Maybe encoding doesn't use much CPU and Ram resources?? But then again, why does it take 4 hours to encode a file? There must be something slowing the process somewhere or it would be as fast as just transferring the file from one drive to another
SOmething must be doing some work, and if you double the work it would seem as though it would take a bit more time! Perhaps not, I have had no need to do 2 at once so I am kinda geussing.
As for quality loss, no I would not expect any loss in quality. That is not based on anything except the program doing the work and settings you choose. As long as it gets the job done, then you have the same quality rather it took 10 minutes or 10days. Doing more than one at the same time will not effect quality. Kinda like transfering 2 4gig files to 2 different computers on a 10/100 lan. It will take longer most likely doing 2 at once, but when done both are as they should be. Course it takes longer because either the drive or the lan is a bottle neck and can only transfer the data so fast, so twice the data means nearly twice the time.

[gee69]

Pixel,

since I have Pinnacle Studio 8, I can use that to author (meaning to edit which includes, adding menus, music and some other stuff) and instead of using Studio 8's create DVD (which I take is encoding), use TMPgenc to encode (which I think means that it creates this Video_TS folder with all the .vob, .ifo and whatever other files needed by a DVD).

Correct me if I am wrong on the encoding and authoring process above.

Thanks.

[pixel]

I've never really worked with pinnacle products, so don't rewally understand what you mean, but I think you are looking for an all in one program. Am I right?

If you are TMPGEnc DVD Author (not PLUS) will encode AND create the Video_TS folder containing all the vobs etc.

(Remember an encoding program just converts a file from one format to another.
An authoring program creates the menus, Video_TS folder and vobs etc.)

Some other good all in one programs are Ulead DVD Workshop and DVDLab. (Never used DVDLab, but people on this forum do and they praise it.)

[overloaded_ide]

Ok your corrected, wrong

I don't know anythng about Pinnacle except my Grandfather used to play it

Tmpgenc and Tmpgenc Plus are encoders. DO various things, like filtering, converting from one format to another, resize files ect..
They do not make the DVD files though. You can create mpeg2 files (or others) then use those for authoring in a different program.

Tmpgenc DVD Author is a seperate program (I like it very well myself)
that Authors the DVD files. You can take a mpeg2 file, make menus, add chapters, cut out parts, use multiple files, and it creates the DVD files for you on the hard drive. VIDEO_TS folder and .ifo .bup .vobs, then you can use the program to also burn the created files to DVD r.

Basicly you were correct kinda, it's all Tmpgenc just that there are a couple programs that do different things.

I like DVD Author. Lots of things I have not tried yet but it is supposed to do. Motion menus for one thing. I need to try em sometime.

30 Day free trial, and it is fully working! How many DVDs can you make in 30 days to see if you like the program? Very easy to figure out and I think it had good help files too, though it's been along time since I looked at em, and then I just glanced through, program so easy I didn't need help for basic stuff. Now if I decide to get fancy and try motion menues, Ilook and see wheat it says

[gee69]

That is why I am confused...

[/img]

If you are TMPGEnc DVD Author (not PLUS) will encode AND create the Video_TS folder containing all the vobs etc.

In that the Author version will encode. maybe it is just semantics but being a newbie makes it totally confusing.

So what you are saying, if I get it correct, is that TMPGenc Plus, just converts .avi to MPEG2 and not .vob, .ifo files and not VIDEO_TS folder.

Let me show a scenario.

1. Capture video using ADVC-100 and output is .avi file
2. Edit, create menus, crop, add using using Studio 8. (still .avi file)

Now, this is where I need help, although Studio can create the DVD disk, let us say I want to use TMP products.

So from .avi file, what program should I use to come up with the VIDEO_TS folder that already has the .vob, .ifo and other files...

Lastly, burn Video_TS and Audio_TS folder using Nero...or RecordNow.

[pixel]

Well, overloaded_ide said that TMPGEnc DVD Author will only take MPEG2 files.

I think you will have to use TMPGEnc Plus to encode to .mpg.

Then use TMPGEnc DVD Author to create all the .vob, .bup.ifo files.

Luckily you should have seen guides for both of the above on your travels through the guides section.