From Huffy to SVCD

[stokefan]

hi board,

2 questions:

1) I want to convert my captures in Huffy UV to SVCD, using TMPGenc, but it seems to give me a smoother picture when I first convert from huffy to divx, then over to SVCD. Can anyone tell me why this might be and how I can learn to get top quality direct to SVCD from my Huffy caps?

2) When I convert direct from huffy to SVCD (TMPGenc) however many formats I try (im in pal) I get a strangely shaped window for playback, its tall and thin, and doesnt seem to keep the aspect ratio, I have experimented with different keeping aspect ratio options in TMPGenc... anyone know what my problem might be there? thanks, stokefan

[Betamax]

2) When I convert direct from huffy to SVCD (TMPGenc) however many formats I try (im in pal) I get a strangely shaped window for playback, its tall and thin, and doesnt seem to keep the aspect ratio, I have experimented with different keeping aspect ratio options in TMPGenc... anyone know what my problem might be there?

I don't have an answer for the 1st question, but for the 2nd I can tell you that it is normal (PAL : 480x576 = SVCD). It's the normal resolution. Usually your captures would be like 704x576 or 720x576. TMPGenc will resize that to the standard resolution for SVCD.
Your TV however will resize this back to the normal resolution of 720x576 - so at the end you won't see the difference.
I think this 'strange' resolution is done to get more compression.

Best results for SVCD still is when you captures is in Interlaced mode (TMPGenc will auto-detect interlaced/non-interlaced video). While SVCD always is interlaced, if the source is it already, better results will be retrieved (only noticeble at the TV).

regards

[stokefan]

ok thanks Betamax, I never thought to try and burn one and test it, as it looked so odd on the monitor, but I will try that now. Thanks.

[Don2050]

To your 1st question...I beleive it may be smoother from DivX to SVCD cause of the filters that are applied automatically in a DivX encode, or something to the effect of a filter to reduce blocks. What you could do are 2 things I can think of to acheive similar results...

1. Adjust the settings in TMPEnc...ie, the Quantize Matrix, or the Noise Reduction filter
https://www.videohelp.com/tmpgencexplained.htm

2. Apply filters on the Huffyuv avi in Virtualdub to acheive the 'smooth' look first then encode in TMPGenc.


goodluck

[stokefan]

thanks Don, but do u mean when you say "applying filters to my huffy avi in Virtualdub" that I should reencode after capture, or apply filters on capture? I don't quite understand at what stage you think i should apply filters

[DJRumpy]

Can you describe what you mean by 'smooth'? Converting to divx from huffman, and then to svcd actaully causes a hit to quality, as divx is not a lossless codec like huffman. You should be able to get the best results converting directly from Huffman to SVCD.

Don't worry about the aspect ratio on your pc. Unless you have the latest version of MediaPlayer (v9), then it will ignore the aspect ratio on an SVCD (it will look tall and skinny). Played back in a standalone dvd player, or in an MPEG-2 compatible player like WinDVD, it should look fine. AVI doesn't understand aspect ratio, so everything encoded in AVI looks 'right' already. When you put this onto SVCD however, you must squeeze the video into the svcd resolution for PAL (480x576). This makes it look tall and thin. It will be stretched back out on playback, according to the aspect ratio used on the MPEG (should be 4:3 for SVCD).

Best results for SVCD still is when you captures is in Interlaced mode (TMPGenc will auto-detect interlaced/non-interlaced video). While SVCD always is interlaced, if the source is it already, better results will be retrieved (only noticeble at the TV).

SVCD is not always interlaced. It can be either progressive, with pulldown applied, or interlaced. It supports both. Both formats will look fine on a television. You normally cannot change what method you capture in. This is source dependant. If your capturing an interlaced source, then your capture will be interlaced. If your source is progressive 25fps, then your capture will be progressive 25fps. Leave it in the format it was captured in. Converting from progressive to interlaced, or vice versa will only degrade your quality.

[stokefan]

hi DJrumpy, thanks for your detailed response.

About the smoothness issue - i apply a deinterlace filter when i convert to divx5.0 in Virtualdub, and it deinterlace in TMPGenc doesnt seem to give as drastic a response as it does in vdub. I wonder what I can do about this, im not impressed with my VHS -> Huffy -> MPEG2 results I want to improve them.

P.S Why do u call "Huffy" "huffman"?!

[klined4lyf]

P.S Why do u call "Huffy" "huffman"?!

Hi,

Although I often refer to the huffyuv codec as "Huffy," it's really Huffman YUV, where Huff stands for the Huffman encoding algorithm, and YUV is the colorspace (luma and chroma components).

K

[DJRumpy]

It's just become slang. They are one in the same. Regarding your Interlace problem, is there a reason your trying to deinterlace? Unless you plan to watch these on your PC, you should leave them interlaced. If you intend to watch these on your PC, then you can deinterlace. I'd suggest you try a 3rd party filter for VirtualDub. Try some from this site: http://shelob.mordor.net/dgraft

Look at the smart deinterlace filter.

Of course, if you deinterlace in VirtualDub, you are not setting your input or output as interlaced in TMPGenc right?

[stokefan]

Good point there DJ, im a bit confused about the interlace situation. Is PAL tv recorded to VHS interlaced or not?

[DJRumpy]

You'll just have to examine it to be sure. Look here for details on recognizing interlaced, and inverse telecined material: www.lukesvideo.com

[Don2050]

Stokfan,

if it is only the interlace problem then DJ Rumpy offers good advice. If afterwards still you are not satisfied with the quality....then during the capture you could either apply some kind of noise reduction filter or smoothing filter to the huffman avi. Or TMPGenc's noise reduction filter has worked good for me alone. With TMPGenc's different NR settings and color correction settings I was able to clean up VHS captures tremendously. But try to see if it is just an interlacing problem first.....then play with the different settings in TMPEnc.

[MrKGB]

stokefan,

It looks like divx works for you as a noise filter, so
you should try to use better noise filters using vdub and see how you like them. Try TemporalSmoother and "smart smoother HiQuality" by Klaus Post (use google to find it).
You don't have to reencode your file with filters, you can just frameserve from Vdub.

[ZippyP.]

You don't have to reencode your file with filters, you can just frameserve from Vdub.

Exactly what I was going to say. Instead of re-encoding to Divx you can select uncompressed and frameserve to TmPGEnc. No intermediate "saved" file required and no re-compression.

[DJRumpy]

Good point there DJ, im a bit confused about the interlace situation. Is PAL tv recorded to VHS interlaced or not?

It can be. PAL could be either interlaced, or progressive. If you plan to watch your output on your television, then avoid using any deinterlacing filters, as they will needlessly add deinterlace artifacts to your output. Your television can display an interlaced signal natively, so leaving it interlaced is the way to go.

Since your source is VHS, you should definately use a good temporal filter to remove any analog noise from your source. VirtualDub has a decent built-in filter. There are also a lot of 3rd party filters. You can find some here as well: http://shelob.morder.net/dgraft

By cleaning your source, it will compress better, and have less compression artifacts when converted back to MPEG. It's a win/win situation...