What exactly is bad about Princo DVD-Rs?

[Trenton_Net]

Hi guys,

Ok, Here is my take on the situation. I have purchased Princo media before, and my experiences are exactly the same as most. My symptoms match those discribed here (Bad data after %50 of the way through).

While it can be said that princo media is "Bad", I can only assume that to cut costs they had to do something. I would think that during the manufacturing process, most companys have a set of standard specs which each unit must meet (To pass Quality Control). There is a good chance that Princo makes media for other brands. In which case, they each might have diffrent standards regarding QC. As such, I think the Princo series made by Princo is just comprised of lower grade Disks which were marked as rejected during manufacturing. Thats not to say they don't work, or can't be used. It just means during some kind of tests for stability, or balance, or accuracy, there tends to be more wavering outside the designed specs. Which can be said why some disks works, but most don't.

I would think thats the whole reason why brand name companys rejected them in the first place. But then again, the cheap price comes at a cost. Its really up to the person if the "cost" is worth while for the quality you get.

Sounds reasonable guys?

[LanEvo7]

txpharoah you still haven't shown me or anybody else here that Princo's are better than Accu's or Riteks. You continue to claim those are crap and Princo's are better but when I ask you to prove it you avoid the subject.

Princo's have issues burning all the way to the end, yet most riteks and accu's don't.

And you claim they are all made of the same stuff. Well, suprise, ALL DVD-Rs are basically made of the same stuff. There is obviously something wrong with how Princo manufactures their discs. Ritek gets trusted by big name brands like Samsung. Even CMC gets Verbatim and Memorex's support.

[Gazorgan]

On the 'Myth' of DVD Rot. I have noticed that my cheapo APEX 1201 can get pretty hot. My kids are notorius for leaving disks in in the player. Now when I re-arranged my stereo and the VCR was on top of the APEX, the disks got REAL HOT (digital cable box is under the APEX). Hotter than when they come out of the burner. I modded the thing and put a fan on it, runs very cool now.

I haven't had any CDR's go bad, but a DVDR might (more sensitive dye due to smaller wavelength/tracks ?) have at the higher temperature.

Yes? No?

[BALLIN]

I just want to say that princo media is safe as far as scratching the top of the discs because all the data is now in-between the two plastic disk layers unlike other dvd-r such as sony!! The actual data is now in-between two really thin plastic cd layers in which now if you scratch the top, the only thing that you would be scratching is the plastic and not the sensitive data!! I have had a bad experince with sony white top where the data is on the top just like cd-r's!!! I actually had a data lift with sony's!!!! I can say that Ritek is also safe for the top of the discs!!!!

I know this info because I had a bad burn(because of a computer lock up) and i decided to tear apart the princo disk!!

[Bix]

Again I'd like to thank everyone for their replies.

I tested the Princos I've burnt, and their are no reading problems toward the end of the disc. No skipping or pixelation.

Back to the rot issue:

I'm curious to see how you all store your discs. I generally keep them in cases, usually in media rack of some sort. If they're stored dry & dark, should I really have any data loss issues?

Thanks,
-David

[Bix]

Another ? for pharoh since you seem to be the big Princo supporter:

How long have your Princos lasted so far, and how do you store them?

Thanks,
-David

[flaninacupboard]

A couple of things i wanted to throw in the mix,
the last movie laserdiscs were created in 1999, so four years ago. music laserdiscs (albeit in the smaller 20cm format) are still pressed today! they get used in video jukeboxes in pubs!!

Dual layer DVD-s -will- have rotting problems. i had to return a set of star gate SG-1, because the first discs had a bad layer problem. you could actually -see- where the two layers weren't bonded. defects obviously occur and so will rot.

KTH may have chosen a unique test, which would never be carried out in a lab, so his reliability level is totally different. is that bad? of course not! results outside the lab are often far more important! if i tell you that my new cd player has a signal to noise ratio of 108db then by all accounts it should sound fantastic. however, if it has this marvellous rating because i spent £5000 on a dedicated power line and super stable supply, but used a technics MASH DAC, it would sound like crap, even though the lab results would say it sounds great. this is one reason i prefer user comments to manufacturers or magazines. no vested interest, and real usage. personally i could quite believe heat being an issue, they get mighty hot in my sony.......

Chips has a point that larger sales mean more complaints. however, if i buy 10 pioneer discs for £20 and one goes bad, i have a 10% fail. i probably wouldn;t bother reporting that. if i spend £20 on 40 princos and get 4 die, it's again 10% and i probably won't report it. if eight die that makes 20%, then i'll moan.

[txpharoah]

Another ? for pharoh since you seem to be the big Princo supporter: How long have your Princos lasted so far, and how do you store them? Thanks, -David

2001 Princos are the oldest Princos I have. All going strong still. Store them in DVD cases or jewel cases. Mostly DVD cases. Some are mini-spindle cases, others doubles or singles.

In all cases, my Riteks from 2001 are now toast. Same for the early uncoated DVD-Rs I had of unknown brands, as well as CD-Rs from the olden days. I only go with coatings, and I'm happy with Apple and Princo, and to lesser extent Maxell and Optodisc. Pioneer is too expensive. Others did not impress me at all. Some of the worst discs I ever had were Accus and Riteks.

[tgferg67]

I'm pretty much a novice at video, but I came across this test report of dvd media by the German C'T magazine.
Has anyone seen this? http://www.thewholewideweb.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=167

Out of all the media they tested Princo was one of the the worst

[txpharoah]

I'm pretty much a novice at video, but I came across this test report of dvd media by the German C'T magazine.
Has anyone seen this? http://www.thewholewideweb.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=167
Out of all the media they tested Princo was one of the the worst

That's a decent and respectable lab test, and those findings are about what I would expect (yes I like Princo, but still classify it near the bottom) but the unfortunate aspect on lab tests is that the discs they have may be different from the ones in stores. That is the nature of industry. Suppliers/vendors of raw materials change from month to month, and shipment to shipment varies. These tests would need to take palce over a period of a year, with dozens, if not hundreds, of discs burned to get an accurate reading. Not to mention that each brand has several variations at any given time. Optodisc has at least 3 discs right now, Apple has 2 out there, Pioneer has 4 or so, Ritek has about 5 if not more, etc, etc. Also remember that Pioneer has even suggested (or may it was Apple) that burning a 2x discs at 2x will yield better results than burning a 2x at 1x. Did this test account for that? So while I won't deny that this is helpful, its also not an authoritative test. Just a decent test.

[LanEvo7]

2001 Princos are the oldest Princos I have. All going strong still. Store them in DVD cases or jewel cases. Mostly DVD cases. Some are mini-spindle cases, others doubles or singles.

In all cases, my Riteks from 2001 are now toast. Same for the early uncoated DVD-Rs I had of unknown brands, as well as CD-Rs from the olden days. I only go with coatings, and I'm happy with Apple and Princo, and to lesser extent Maxell and Optodisc. Pioneer is too expensive. Others did not impress me at all. Some of the worst discs I ever had were Accus and Riteks.

Umm, maxell and apple are the same discs... I also like how you just generalize unbranded uncoated discs as Accu's and Ritek's. You must not treat your uncoated discs well, because I've had uncoated discs and they are great. According to you Princos would be better than Taiyo Yudens because of the fact that they are coated...

[txpharoah]

Umm, maxell and apple are the same discs... I also like how you just generalize unbranded uncoated discs as Accu's and Ritek's. You must not treat your uncoated discs well, because I've had uncoated discs and they are great. According to you Princos would be better than Taiyo Yudens because of the fact that they are coated...

Most Apples are (or at least were) Pioneer-made. Only some are apparently Maxell. In any case, a wasted argument. Neither of them "make" discs anyhow. Somebody else does, and other brand them and coat them.

I don't blanket say "all" uncoated discs are Ritek, but a great many are. In terms of which will last longer against normal wear (handling), a coated Princo may very well last longer than an uncoated Tayo Yuden (easy to scratch from the topside).

[DaveKlassix]

From my personal experience, Princo 1x disks gave me better results on my "old" samsung v1000 then Accu or Ritek or even Optodisk. I'd get numerous skips using these other kinds of media, and never got a skip with Princo. I've since gotten a Toshiba, and the Optodisks and Accus play fine in it, so it must have been the player that didn tlike the media. However, for xbox games, the only media i had any success with backing up games was Ritek. Princo worked half the time, and other times wouldnt even boot.

[vric]

strange.. Princo skip at the end for me (over 4gig) and Ritek G03, even at 4.38gig (or 3.39gig.. yes I overburn one) it work with no problem.

all depend of the disk I think

My friend have a 50 spindle of Princo.. If I test them on my dvd player it work perfect, no skip (but it does skip on his Xbox) but my princo skip (buy 1 by 1) same ID, white with light purple dye..

[LanEvo7]

In any case, a wasted argument. Neither of them "make" discs anyhow. Somebody else does, and other brand them and coat them.

I don't blanket say "all" uncoated discs are Ritek, but a great many are. In terms of which will last longer against normal wear (handling), a coated Princo may very well last longer than an uncoated Tayo Yuden (easy to scratch from the topside).

All I know is I ordered a sample pack of dvdrs. Out of the two Princo's one burned correctly and the other failed. I don't like to roll dice with dvdrs and hope I get one that works perfectly. If you handle uncoated discs correctly, they will last you a really long time.

Maxell still makes discs. They have a media code of MXL RG01. Apple, TDK(regular) and Maxells all have this media code. [/quote]

[disturbed1]

Pioneer quit making discs for Apple some time ago when they switched their plants, about a year ago, maybe longer?

PVC discs (Pioneer Video Corp) won't be around much longer, they're going to exit the media business.

[videocheez]

I bought 50 princo DVD-RW and achieved a 50% success rate this is unaccepable. I was a fresh newbie however so I probably had something to do with it. I may give them another chance based on some of the positive comments that I've read here.

[txpharoah]

Pioneer quit making discs for Apple some time ago when they switched their plants, about a year ago, maybe longer? PVC discs (Pioneer Video Corp) won't be around much longer, they're going to exit the media business.

It probably happened at the same time when the boxes were re-designed for the media. I'm just now buying Apples again. My first batch of several hundred discs lasted from 2001-2003 (personal use only when archival was most important). Bought them for about $4 each in bulk (not spindled, jsut bulk purchase).

[txpharoah]

I bought 50 princo DVD-RW and achieved a 50% success rate this is unaccepable. I was a fresh newbie however so I probably had something to do with it. I may give them another chance based on some of the positive comments that I've read here.

Did Princo make DVD-RW discs? Hmm..

I had some Ritek DVD-RW discs (or so the company said), and they all died. All 10 of them, having been used only 1-3 times each. They wouldn't even read anymore. In either my 105 or 103 drives. I wasn't even able to test out the media type for the ID to confirm what brand they were. The discs died before I made a habit of looking at the discs.

I sat in the back yard with a shotgun one weekend and relieved my stress out on my newly-found skeet. They shatter quite nicely.