Macrovision...A stupid question!

[FearWorks]

Okay, call me stupid, daft, idiotic, a damn fool, whatever, but...

I author DVDs, and really want to put them out with Macrovision protection, but need to know how. What software and what processes. There's enough of you out there to tell me how to disable it on a disc that is protected, but can any of you rise to the challenge of telling me how to put it ON a disc I make?????

Please, don't say "the authoring program has to have it built in".

No plugins? No standalone software?? Is it not just a flag in the datastream???

Please...tell me!!! Put me out of my misery...

[MOVIEGEEK]

Macrovision is a trademark and you have to add it professionally.
www.macrovision.com

[txpharoah]

Apple DVD Studio Pro
Some info, about halfway down the page (Search for "Macro")
http://www.kenstone.net/fcp_homepage/review_dvd_studio_pro.html

Sonic Scenarist:
http://www.motionmedia.com/vendor/sonic/Pricing_Scenarist100502.pdf

You cannot use CSS on DVD-R General Discs. Only DVD-R Authoring. Macrovision is part of the video file.

But why? It's not like anybody that would want to copy it wouldn't know how. If I can see it, I can copy it. Period. I think MPAA and RIAA are the only ones still being anal about it.

[Quigonsean]

You can add Macrovision, and CSS with Maestro. In one of the options you can tick the boxes to do so. But you are 'spossed to pay royalties or something for its use.

Sean

[FearWorks]

But from where do I get DVD Maestro??

For download???

[txpharoah]

You absolutely CANNOT add CSS onto a DVD-R General disc (Pioneer 103, 104, 105, +R drivers). It is physically impossible, as that part of the disc does not exist for writing. You MUST use a DVD-R Authoring drive, made exclusively by Pioneer or it will be done at duplication.

Only Macrovision can be done on DVD-R General drives or +R, and it is added to the video signal during the disc authoring process. Several professional programs can do it, but it must have a license, and since most people do not buy those $10K+ programs (with the exception of MAYBE DVD Studio Pro), they will not be able to order this additional Macrovision license for their software.

DVD Maestro is an expensive professional program that has been discontinued. It was never for download. It is a professional program that costs about $32,000.00 US (what I can remember). Scenarist is the other option, but it is not for consumers, and downloading an illegal version of it will not help, as you can still NOT get Macrovision enabled on it.

http://www.macrovision.com/solutions/video/copyprotect/obtain.php3
This is why bootlegged videos do not have copyright protection. This is a company that runs checks on you before you ever get to look at the software, much less use it.

[FearWorks]

I can't believe that there's not a program out there somewhere that will modify the authored disc files or the encoded files (whichever stage the flag or bit is set at for Macrovision to operate)... Plenty of programs out there to delete it from the disc, but not one to add it back in?

It must be simple...tell me what needs to be done and I'll write my own program to do it!!

Come on, someone must have a little program that will whizz through a dvd video_ts folder and add the protection, or the m2v files, or the whatevers it is added to.

And don't bombard me with "it's not possible without $$$$ or £££££!" So you've already said, but hey - I'm now looking for the one dude who has that little program or can tell me where to look and I'll write it myself.

Besides, this is purely for research/educational purposes, so I haven't got $$$$ or £££££ to spend.

After I've received anything you might have I'll delete it, of course.

Honest.

After I've uninstalled it.

Promise.

I will...

[txpharoah]

It's not as simple as you're thinking. It needs hardware and software working in conjunction, and you're not going to have either of them without spending money.

I'd love for a hacker out there to prove me wrong, but this issue has existed for a long time, and I don't see it changing anytime soon. Some things are just unavailable in this world.

If that weren't the case, we'd all be married to a Playboy model that always stayed 20 years old. (Not sure what the gals would want, but I'm sure it'd be similar.)

[sapiendut]

Macrovision is basically adding signal in vertical blank of each frame with controlled signal burst to "fool" a VCR to "think" that the signal's amplitude is ocassionally too high making video AGC to lower and resulting in the darkening of scenes.

Another form of Macrovision is by creating real-fast color streaks which no TV is fast enough to detect but can be detected by a VCR and will be poorly recorded resulting in permanent color streaks on the tape.

The above signals are actually imbedded on the frame and on the vertical blank of each frame.

With DVD, the signal is actually generated by the DVD player itself. The player only requires an "on" signal coded anywhere on the DVD material.

To hack for Macrovision to be "on" should be simple, but it's illegal to 'hack' to turn the Macrovision on due to licensing issue.

CSS is a completely different beast, it's not a simple "on" signal, and can only be done either at the replication center, or if you're using DVD-R for Authoring PLUS the appropriate software to imbed the CSS.

[gll99]

This subject is interesting. The following point seems relevant to the question asked and the answers provided.

So could we say that it would be against forum policy to tell someone how to hack macrovision as far as adding it to a video even if we discovered how to do it. Or am I stretching too far with this?

Removing it is no problem because we only want fair use of something we already own.

[sapiendut]

actually, if you can proof that you'll use it for educational purposes (much easier to proof than to proof archival purposes), then you can just knock on Macrovision's door and ask for it. (I'm not being sarcastic)

Fair Use includes Educational Purposes.

[drewson99]

It must be simple...tell me what needs to be done and I'll write my own program to do it!!

Come on, someone must have a little program that will whizz through a dvd video_ts folder and add the protection, or the m2v files, or the whatevers it is added to.

And don't bombard me with "it's not possible without $$$$ or £££££!" So you've already said, but hey - I'm now looking for the one dude who has that little program or can tell me where to look and I'll write it myself.

come on sir, if you have the programming capabilities to do what you are implying, then you have the mental resources to find this out in a more formal and useful way than pleading on a message board.

i do feel for you - i posted about this myself once. but if your product is so worth protecting in this way, take your master to a video house and have them put whatever you want on your copies.

[miamicanes]

I suspect there's another reason why no hacks to ADD Macrovision exist: motivation. Learning how to do it would take lots of effort and work, none of which would be rewarded. The author of such a hack wouldn't even dare to be non-anonymous -- Macrovision, Inc. would have him sued and/or prosecuted into oblivion. Add to this the fact that most people content to work hard to semi-anonymously release something like that for free tend to despise it (both as a product and a concept), and the reason why it doesn't exist seems obvious.

I personally know nothing about how it's encoded, but I suspect the flag to activate it is itself encrypted with a private key that Macrovision literally guards with its life. That would explain why only manufacturing facilities can activate it... if the private key exists only as embedded hardware, Macrovision could safely dole out copies of it to trusted companies who paid lots of money for the privilege and sign EULAs agreeing to let Macrovision agents break down the door and personally seize it should the company ever go bankrupt or otherwise close its doors.

That would also explain why stripping it out is easy, but adding it is non-trivial. The "flag" might very well be something like the md5 hash of some chunk of the .vob file, encrypted with Macrovision's private key. The player would simply hash the chunk, then decrypt it with Macrovison's public key (known to the player). If the hash matches the decrypted value, Macrovision is turned on. If it doesn't, it's not. Thus, removal would require only that the value be corrupted by a single bit (or zeroed out, or omitted entirely).

I suspect that its removal wouldn't be nearly so easy had Macrovision known that CSS would be broken so quickly.

[yg1968]

As an aside, macrovision does not prevent a person from making a copy of the DVD with a DVD burner. Macrovision only prevents copying the DVD on a VCR. A person could make an exact copy of the macrovision protected DVD and could still play the copy of the DVD without problems on a DVD player. For example, DVD shrink removes CSS but doesn't bother removing macrovision. In a nutshell, CSS is a digital protection that prevents the copying of a DVD with a DVD burner. Macrovision is an analog protection that prevents the copying of a DVD with a VCR.

[Gazorgan]

You can remove the macrovision effect with a few $$$ worth of parts placed in-between the DVD Player and the VCR. Don't ask me details, do a WWW search.

The whole point about adding Macrovision is moot. Why spend months figuring out how to do something that can be undone in 10 minutes with a click in a ripping program?

[sapiendut]

those stuff only MINIMIZE the macro but don't remove it. Only $$$$ (yes, four figures) equipment can completely eliminate macro.

The only problem is, when you remove macro, you're also removing close-captioning, it's because they both reside within the vertical-blank of each frame.

[FOO]

I might suggest you rip part of a DVD twice,
with and without the "remove macrovision" flag
set and examine the results with a differencing
utility. I think DVD decryptor and Ifoedit both have
this setting. VOBedit may give you a clue too.

It's interesting that you wish to prevent people from
from stealing your stuff by stealing macrovision.

Note also that macrovision DOES sometimes affect
TV playback to some degree..

[SLK001]

You cannot put CSS protection on any writeable disk - either GENERAL or AUTHORING. Both disks have the location embossed out.

You can, however, add Macrovision. Just obtain a license from them (~$25,000, if my memory serves me correctly) and pay them a "per item" fee of about $1.00 per disk. And, Macrovision doesn't need a "hack" to add. The advanced authoring programs have a box to check to add the "protection", since it is just a flag in the data stream (the DVD player does all the protecting thing).

Like the others here, I question what could be so important of yours that you think that you need to add "protection" to it (notice the protection in quotes, because it really isn't)? I could crack your disk in only the time it takes to rip it to my hard disk.

If you really want to protect your work, make only one copy, and keep it in a floor safe with a 4 inch minimum wall thickness, and divulge the combination to no one. Then, remove the disk only when you want to view it, then replace back into the safe.

[FOO]

I feel compelled to note that equipment costing $9999.00
is not required to eliminate Macrovision and keep the
captioning. I built one with a PIC microprocessor and
a few other parts costing about $10.00. The PIC is fast
enough to switch the video only during Macrovison
sections without hurting anything else. It is true that
the standard pure hadware circuits found on the Web
destroy Captioning ( and other stuff ).

One of the plans for the firmware based video processor
was to detect (and blank audio during )commercials. Unfortunately I never finished that part. Maybe some year.

[rallynavvie]

I'm confused. Are you worried people are going to copy your DVDs to VHS? That could be the only possible motivation for adding Macrovision to the stream. Any fool with a DVD burner (or even those without) can easily find out how to rip the VOB file and copy it to another DVD, or just outright copy the whole disc. The only possible reason could be to keep people from copying to VHS. I'd say let 'em do it. You're going to lose a lot more in the transfer than you initially think of. No more easy navigation with menus and chapters, you'll need to rewind after viewing, not as good a quality as the DVD, bulkier in storage, and they're not as archivable. I'd say all those reasons make protection enough from duplicating to VHS.

If you want to find programs that are out of your price range then we're not stopping you from getting on a P2P network and finding them. Good luck though, the DVD mastering apps are probably pretty hard to come by. And FYI Maestro was going for only $18k new just as it was taken off the market. A local dealer still had a copy that I'm sure they'd let go for maybe $15k (if anybody's looking).

[FearWorks]

I thought I'd post an update.....

Since beginning this thread, I have found two pieces of software downloadable over the net that would allow macrovision to be turned ON and added to a DVD project.

I have to state that I have not used either piece of software to actually do so, because as so many of you pointed out, without paying MacroVision the appropriate royalties, it is not permitted.

But there you go...see! I said someone must have written a piece of software that would do it...and they have!

Now all I have to do is start saving many thousands of pounds for the above-mentioned royalties.....

[ryn05]

I thought I'd post an update.....

Since beginning this thread, I have found two pieces of software downloadable over the net that would allow macrovision to be turned ON and added to a DVD project.

I have to state that I have not used either piece of software to actually do so, because as so many of you pointed out, without paying MacroVision the appropriate royalties, it is not permitted.

But there you go...see! I said someone must have written a piece of software that would do it...and they have!

Now all I have to do is start saving many thousands of pounds for the above-mentioned royalties.....

For the eighteenth time, why do you want to add the puny macrovision that gets removed by dvddecryptor, in the short time it rips to your hard disk???? All hollywood dvds have this on them and we have no trouble backing them up at all....why spend 25 grand on this sh*t protection???

Go buy a couple plasma tvs with the money to watch your "golden" dvd on.

[indolikaa]

those stuff only MINIMIZE the macro but don't remove it. Only $$$$ (yes, four figures) equipment can completely eliminate macro.

Wrong.

I feel compelled to note that equipment costing $9999.00
is not required to eliminate Macrovision and keep the
captioning.

Correct.

You can add...CSS with Maestro

Wrong.

You absolutely CANNOT add CSS onto a DVD-R General disc

Correct.

Don't believe me? Try a forum search.

[FearWorks]

In response to the above...

Some of my clients have asked me about MacroVision on their discs that I produce, so I started investigating the very topic right here on this forum.

They too are aware of the ease with which MacroVision can be removed...but as I pointed out to them, some protection is better than none...and although it's a bit cliched now, not everyone knows how to remove MacroVision - it puts a lot of people off just because they can't be bothered to do anything about it.

There are goodness knows how many DVD players the world over...many of those people have probably tried to record a DVD to VHS at home, not even realising it was copy-protected. Yet as soon as they realise that there's "something" stopping them from doing so, they give up. Those who don't give up are the people like us who contribute to forums like this - clever sods - but we're in a minority.

The vast majority of DVD player owners do just "give up" or don't bother finding out how to enable copying. You only have to consider how many people are registered here to realise that at the end of the day, most DVD player owners have no interest in defeating such copy-protection.

Most of them just live with it.

But like I said previously, I can't use MacroVision anyway because of the issues with royalties. However, it's interesting to note that there are programs out there readily available to us all to do so if we ever wanted to...

[FearWorks]

OK. While I'm here I'm gonna sort this out.

those stuff only MINIMIZE the macro but don't remove it. Only $$$$ (yes, four figures) equipment can completely eliminate macro.

Wrong.

Actually correct. If you read his post, he's referring to electronic boxes that you connect between the video and DVD player. And these do only reduce the Macrovision bursts, to a level that your VCR can cope with - they do NOT eliminate it completely. Digital Video Recorders recording an input of such an analogue signal will still detect the very faint Macrovision signals.

I feel compelled to note that equipment costing $9999.00
is not required to eliminate Macrovision and keep the
captioning.

Correct.

Why are we so concerned with Closed Captioning...? DVDs can support multiple subtitle streams!!!

You can add...CSS with Maestro

Wrong.

Actually, you can add CSS with DVDMaestro. Yes - you have to use a rather specialist writer and authoring discs, but the settings are all included in the program.....as too are the settings for adding Macrovision with DVDMaestro.

You absolutely CANNOT add CSS onto a DVD-R General disc

Correct.

This, one has to admit, is perfectly true.

Well this is definitely becoming interesting! Boy, how this topic's moved on...!!!