Will all amd quad cores work on a am2 socket? (no + just am2)

[yoda313]

Ok Here is my information from a thread I will have closed. Basically I want to know if I can buy any amd quad core processor and install it on my am2 socket board. I have a dual core amd in it right now but it is a am2 not an am2+. I have read that any am3 will work on a am2 but will have its ht reduced to 2000 or something like that. Will that still mean the full four cores will be useable by software for encoding and the like? Will this "reduced" quad core still outperfom a dual core given all other things being equal in the same computer?

Also one I looked at had a 125w power rating. My current dual core is 65w. I have a 600 watt power supply so I don't think its a problem but is there a program to show your current power usage in the system as a whole? I do have an older version of cpu-z but I don't know if that shows total system power usage. Thanks.

Here is the detail from the other thread I am requesting to have closed:

I have a socket am 2 board after all - I dug this up from my original post when I first upgraded to dual core:

asustek computer inc

nyssa
nvidia id03ea
southbridge nvidia id03e0
sensor fintek 581

bios
phoenix technologies
5.04
12-18-06

amd 64 3800+
socket am2 940 90nm voltage 1.1v

Is this compatible with any quad core amd processors? How expensive are they?

http://www.dailytech.com/Socket+AM2+...rticle3169.htm

I have to do more research on this but this old link above would seem to suggest it might be. Were quad cores designed for am3? Does that mean a quad core WOULD work on a am2 motherboard?

edit 3 - ASUS M2N61-LA

That is the motherboard according to the hp website for my particular pavilion desktop model.

I have been doing some reading and it does seem that the amd phenom quad core will work on a am2 socket. But it seems like it will be slower than if it was in a am2+ or am3 socket. Would this be a significant improvement over the dual core I am using now?

It mentions a bios upgrade but i think I am at the max for this board - 5.05 is what the hp website says and I think thats what I've got. Does that support amd quad core? Is there a way to find out?

edit 4 - http://www.gigabyte.com/support-down....aspx?pid=2500

I found this on the gigabyte website:

Originally Posted by website
(Note) If you install an AMD AM3/AM2+ CPU on AM2 motherboard, the system bus speed will downgrade from HT3.0(5200 MT/s) to HT1.0 (2000 MT/s); however, the frequency of AM2+ CPU will not be impacted.



-------------

Does that mean than that I can get the cheapest quad core amd I can find and put that in my am2 motherboard and it will work just fine? It says the frequency won't be impacted - that means the ghz rating right?

Also if a program calls for a quad core and its this downshifted quad it will still use all four cores correct?

Would this downgrading of a quad core still be a significant improvement to a dual core on the same system without any other alterations?

[sum_guy]

I'm pretty sure your going to want an AM3 socket board to get the benefits of going quad.

[yoda313]

I'm pretty sure your going to want an AM3 socket board to get the benefits of going quad.

Ideally yes that would be the best scenario. But that isn't in the cards right now for me at the moment.

But technically speaking will I still have access to all four cores? It will still be a boost for video encoding correct?

[johns0]

Buy the quad core and then upgrade the mb in the future.All 4 cores will be there on your mb.

[sum_guy]

The system bus determines the benefit, doing one and not the other, minimal benefit, microscopic level of benefit, save your money and do it correctly the first time. Having gone this route personally, I would buy the board and chip together.

[deadrats]

@yoda

i'm almost 100 percent positive that a quad core will not work on that board, even if it were socket/pin compatible, you're talking trying to get 2010 cpu technology to work with pre-2006 chipset technology.

i understand times are tough but save up your pennies until you can do things the right way.

[yoda313]

i'm almost 100 percent positive that a quad core will not work on that board, even if it were socket/pin compatible, you're talking trying to get 2010 cpu technology to work with pre-2006 chipset technology.

If we can get a consensus on that I'll abandon this line of thinking for the time being.

Thanks sum_guy and johns_0.

---------------------------------------------

This leads me back to my original post that I deleted then.

Will a nvidia card with cuda boost h264 encoding on a dual core processor?

Will it be beneficial at all?

I saw an entry level nvida geforce 210 for 50.00 at best buy. Would I gain improvements in processing time that way?

Does anyone know if dvdfab 3d bluray ripper can utilize cuda processing?

[jagabo]

Will a nvidia card with cuda boost h264 encoding on a dual core processor?

Yes, but CUDA is still mediocre at h.264 encoding. You're better off using x264 with the "veryfast" preset. That's not quite as fast as CUDA but it's higher quality.

[yoda313]

You're better off using x264 with the "veryfast" preset

Thanks.

What applications are available to use x264? I'm too much dependent on pre packaged point and click outfits to know the full reaches of the encoding world. Though I love customization in point and click suites like avstodvd but I just want to start it, make the choices and click run.

Thanks everyone for your inputs. I may just stand pat and wait for a more opportunistic time to upgrade or replace my current system - sometime down the road unfortunately.

[jagabo]

If you want an easy all-in-one try Xvid4PSP. I normally use AviSynth, x264, and mmg to make MKV files.

[yoda313]

If you want an easy all-in-one try Xvid4PSP. I normally use AviSynth, x264, and mmg to make MKV files.

Sounds great. Thanks a lot. I've used it before of course. But I haven't looked into that aspect before.

[nic2k4]

To clarify the CPU situation; to use an AM3 CPU in an AM2+ board you need two things:

- CPU support in the BIOS
- motherboard regulator that can handle the CPU power requirement (TDP rating and voltage)

Many AM2 board could not handle AM2+ CPU for those same reasons. Trying to push an AM3 onto one is just asking for too much even though there were some solid AM2 boards that could probably do, the BIOS support just isn't there. You're even less likely to get BIOS support form HP.

As for a quad core outperforming a dual, keep in mind that the number of cores only helps performance for multi-threaded applications. On single thread apps, a fast single core will blow the doors of a slow quad (XVID is a good example).

[lacywest]

At Newegg ... the MSI K9N6PGM2 - V2 ... is a AM3 AMD CPU mobo ... about $50 bucks

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813130241&Tpk=K9N6PGM2


I just recently put one in a customers Compaq Tower ... her old mobo had swollen capacitors.

[mh2360]

As for a quad core outperforming a dual, keep in mind that the number of cores only helps performance for multi-threaded applications. On single thread apps, a fast single core will blow the doors of a slow quad (XVID is a good example).

Xvid is a bad example since the latest versions have improved multi-threading. On my system using 4 cores with Xvid does make a big difference.

FFmpeg is probably a better example, since (with the exception of x264) all the video/audio encoders have very little in the way multi-threading capabilities.

[jagabo]

As for a quad core outperforming a dual, keep in mind that the number of cores only helps performance for multi-threaded applications. On single thread apps, a fast single core will blow the doors of a slow quad (XVID is a good example).

Xvid is a bad example since the latest versions have improved multi-threading. On my system using 4 cores with Xvid does make a big difference.

I agree. Xvid doesn't double in speed going from two cores to four, but the improvement is significant. I see about a 35 percent increase in compression speed with four threads rather than two. So a dual core CPU would have to have at least a 35 percent higher clock rate (more likely around 50 percent higher since rendering speed doesn't increase 1:1 with clock speed either), to beat a quad.

Obviously, if Xvid is being fed by a single threaded app that's doing a lot of heavy filtering, that filtering will be the bottleneck, not the Xvid encoding.

[yoda313]

Thanks everyone.

@@lacywest - I have never done a motherboard installation nor a transplant. I also do not see a cpu included with that so that would add to the cost. If I were to do this I was looking to keep it close to a hundred bucks (as was my original look at cheap quads with the hope of simply plug and play swap with the original dual core).

Also - how complex would this get trying to fit it in a hp pavilion desktop tower?

Will an oem vista 32bit home premium copy accept a new motherboard and cpu without requesting a new activation? What if I'm one of the ones microsoft wouldn't let reactivate vista? - I don't want to buy win7 yet and that would add more to the cost.

[Nelson37]

Yes that will almost certainly require a new activation and if you have an HP OEM windows disk it will fail to install.

Plus, HP pavilion cases are an absolute nightmare to work inside. Power supplies are often quite weak.

[yoda313]

Yes that will almost certainly require a new activation and if you have an HP OEM windows disk it will fail to install.

Plus, HP pavilion cases are an absolute nightmare to work inside. Power supplies are often quite weak.

Actually I replaced the power supply with a 600 watt unit awhile back.

So if I were to attempt a motherboard switch I couldn't do it by leaving the os installed on the main drive? I'd have to do it completely fresh? And in that case it would still need an activation?

This is getting a lot more complicated than I was bargaining for.

I think I may wait and either do a full custom build when I can better handle the finances or a new prefab job off the shelf.

Oh well you try to do things piecemeal and eventually technology outpaces you. I guess I"m lucky I was able to upgrade my rig as much as I have (from single to dual core and lots of other inside stuff - video card, sound card, that kind of thing).

I'll just have to sit tight for now.

[jagabo]

So if I were to attempt a motherboard switch I couldn't do it by leaving the os installed on the main drive?

You might. In my experience the odds are about 50:50 in general. The more similar the motherboards are the more likely the swap will work.

And in that case it would still need an activation?

Probably. The OS watches for hardware changes and if it sees too many in a short period of time it will request activation again.

I'd have to do it completely fresh?

As Nelson37 pointed out, upon installation, an HP OEM version of Windows will check to see that the BIOS reports an HP motherboard. If not, Windows won't install.

[yoda313]

Thanks jagabo and nelson37.

I've decided to hold off on this endeavor for now.

[johns0]

Will an oem vista 32bit home premium copy accept a new motherboard and cpu without requesting a new activation? What if I'm one of the ones microsoft wouldn't let reactivate vista? - I don't want to buy win7 yet and that would add more to the cost.

I've installed 2 different motherboards and video cards and cpus and win7 64 oem activated both times with no problems

[TBoneit]

johnso, yes you can use the key on the HP computer to activate if you have a OEM windows disc. Anything that uses a recovery set not seperate windows, drivers and applications will not run.

[TBoneit]

At Newegg ... the MSI K9N6PGM2 - V2 ... is a AM3 AMD CPU mobo ... about $50 bucks

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813130241&Tpk=K9N6PGM2


I just recently put one in a customers Compaq Tower ... her old mobo had swollen capacitors.

Why didn't you just change the bad capacitors? Cheaper too.

[Nelson37]

There are a couple different issues here.

Whether or not the original, OEM Windows disk from the PC maker will run, or not, depends on whether or not it actually checks the board and/or BIOS that it is OEM equipment. I know for certain Dell disks do, not sure about HP. If it does, and it ain't, the install will not run. However, if the install does run, then the activate will be OK even if you have to do it by voice. The hard drive crashed, nothing but the drive was replaced.

Whether or not the PC will boot without requiring activation, or boot at all, is a crapshoot. If activation required, see above. If it does not boot, again, see above.

Just a note on the crapshoot. I recently replaced a power supply, nothing else, in a 3-year-old box and it triggered activation. I also removed an old Zip drive. No new hardware other than the PSU was added.

It is often possible to use a standard Windows install disk with the code number on your current box and activate.

[lacywest]

Thanks everyone.

@@lacywest - I have never done a motherboard installation nor a transplant. I also do not see a cpu included with that so that would add to the cost. If I were to do this I was looking to keep it close to a hundred bucks (as was my original look at cheap quads with the hope of simply plug and play swap with the original dual core).

Also - how complex would this get trying to fit it in a hp pavilion desktop tower?

Will an oem vista 32bit home premium copy accept a new motherboard and cpu without requesting a new activation? What if I'm one of the ones microsoft wouldn't let reactivate vista? - I don't want to buy win7 yet and that would add more to the cost.

Without reading everything written here ... is that part of the reason your wanting to put a quad core cpu in a mother board ??

Will it work ?? You will probably not only trigger having to re-activate your copy of windows but ... most very likely ... have to Re - Install windows. Reason is different mother boards use different systems ... Nvidia ... ATI ... Intel ... VIA ... related mother board parts will not be happy and would require Windows to be re-installed.

And the mother board is in a HP Tower ... ?? Oh boy ... without seeing the insides of your HP PC ... I cannot say ... for sure.

It is easy to do this ... but there are HP PCs that are different and same goes for Compaq PCs

On the Compaq PC ... It just turned out the tower was a generic tower that had standard parts in it ... its on Ebay right now.

And the one I mentioned above ... oops ... my mistake ... it is not a Compaq ... but a Emachine ... which may as well be a Compaq ... the thing I'm saying is ... some PCs by ... HP ... Compaq ... Emachine ... and Gateways ... can have the guts taken out and replaced with a better mother board ... and all the parts that go with it.

I'm doing this .. in my little shop.

What you do is ... a customer brings you a Compaq S4020WM Tower ... that dont work ... you open it up and find swollen capacitors ... you tell the customer it cannot be fixed ... the capacitors are shot ... swollen ... leaking. The customer than tells you ... okay ... keep it ... maybe you can use the parts ... so I've got it on Ebay right now ... with a ABIT AN-M2 mother board in it. Ready to go ... with WIN XP Home Edition installed ... using the CD Key ... from the sticker on it.

[lacywest]

There are a couple different issues here.

Whether or not the original, OEM Windows disk from the PC maker will run, or not, depends on whether or not it actually checks the board and/or BIOS that it is OEM equipment. I know for certain Dell disks do, not sure about HP. If it does, and it ain't, the install will not run. However, if the install does run, then the activate will be OK even if you have to do it by voice. The hard drive crashed, nothing but the drive was replaced.

Whether or not the PC will boot without requiring activation, or boot at all, is a crapshoot. If activation required, see above. If it does not boot, again, see above.

Just a note on the crapshoot. I recently replaced a power supply, nothing else, in a 3-year-old box and it triggered activation. I also removed an old Zip drive. No new hardware other than the PSU was added.

It is often possible to use a standard Windows install disk with the code number on your current box and activate.

This happened to me back in December 2010 ... I have Vista Home Premium 32bit Retail ... but the Gateway PC that I was working on ... would not let me use that ... Vista Home Premium Retail Disk. Everything installed just fine ... but when it was time to type in the CD Key from the sticker on the Gateway PC ... it would not except ... I was trying to make a OEM key work for a Retail version of Vista Home Premium.

I even contacted Microsoft and did a chat ... he even took over my tower and controlled the mouse ... weird !!

He figured it out and helped me understand ... I was trying to install with a Retail disk ... when what I needed was a OEM disk.

So I reached into the box that the customer also brought and got out the Gateway Install Disk with Vista Home Premium 32bit on it ... everything went fine ... Microsoft Technician called the next day ... but I didn't bother to pick up the phone.

I should have made a copy of that Gateway install disk ... I didn't want to use it because I thought I would end up with a bunch of Gateway Crap Ware ... but nope it was just a simple disk with a OEM version of Vista Home Premium.

I've got some ACER PCs that have Vista Home Premium CD Key stickers on them ... I hope it wont be a hassle installing them.