VirtualDub capture no keyframes, wants to 'decode' each frame I view

[agisthos]

I have successfully done a lot of captures using Avermedia's provided software for their CE310B SD capture card.
It seems to work well and output's very stable captures. Anyone who wants a cheap PCI-E SD capture card (about $60 USD) should check it out.

I want to now use VirtualDub for capturing and there are issues, and a lot of options. Display panes disappearing during capture so you cannot see anything, audio sync out e.t.c

But the main problem is when using VDub to trim the running time afterwards. With Avermedia captures, in the resulting AVI each frame has a [K] - meaning its a keyframe. I'm not sure what this does, but you can click to any point on a 50GB AVI and VDub will immediately view that frame.

But with captures done with Virtualdub itself, each frame is []. No K, and Virtualdub itself wants to 'decode' every single frame you try and view, creating a laggy mess when trying to do any sort of simple editing. Also I note that media players are also lagging when clicking at different points of the running time (on these Vdub captured avi's).

What have I done wrong in Virtualdub capturing that would output an AVI like this?

[DB83]

1. What Operating system are you using ? Windows10 by any chance.
2. Upload to here a mediainfo text-mode report of both the avi created with the card's software and by vdub

[agisthos]

Windows 10 Pro - clean install for the capturing.

Mediatext for the normal file

General
Complete name : C:\capture-normal-by-avermedia.avi
Format : AVI
Format/Info : Audio Video Interleave
Format profile : OpenDML
File size : 5.36 GiB
Duration : 4 min 35 s
Overall bit rate : 167 Mb/s
Writing library : VirtualDub2 build 44282/release ##this is just here because I used vdub2 to snip this file down for a fair comparison.

Video
ID : 0
Format : YUV
Codec ID : YUY2
Codec ID/Info : YUV 4:2:2 as for UYVY but with different component ordering within the u_int32 macropixel
Duration : 4 min 35 s
Bit rate : 166 Mb/s
Width : 720 pixels
Height : 576 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 5:4
Frame rate : 25.000 FPS
Standard : PAL
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:2
Compression mode : Lossless
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 15.981
Stream size : 5.31 GiB (99%)

Audio
ID : 1
Format : PCM
Format settings : Little / Signed
Codec ID : 1
Duration : 4 min 35 s
Bit rate mode : Constant
Bit rate : 1 536 kb/s
Channel(s) : 2 channels
Sampling rate : 48.0 kHz
Bit depth : 16 bits
Stream size : 50.4 MiB (1%)
Alignment : Aligned on interleaves
Interleave, duration : 40 ms (1.00 video frame)
Interleave, preload duration : 500 ms

Mediatext for the laggy file

General
Complete name : C:\capture-laggy-by-vdub.avi
Format : AVI
Format/Info : Audio Video Interleave
Format profile : OpenDML
File size : 5.76 GiB
Duration : 4 min 55 s
Overall bit rate : 167 Mb/s

Video
ID : 0
Format : YUV
Codec ID : YUY2
Codec ID/Info : YUV 4:2:2 as for UYVY but with different component ordering within the u_int32 macropixel
Duration : 4 min 55 s
Bit rate : 166 Mb/s
Width : 720 pixels
Height : 576 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 5:4
Frame rate : 25.000 FPS
Standard : PAL
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:2
Compression mode : Lossless
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 16.000
Stream size : 5.71 GiB (99%)

Audio
ID : 1
Format : PCM
Format settings : Little / Signed
Codec ID : 1
Duration : 4 min 55 s
Bit rate mode : Constant
Bit rate : 1 536 kb/s
Channel(s) : 2 channels
Sampling rate : 48.0 kHz
Bit depth : 16 bits
Stream size : 54.2 MiB (1%)
Alignment : Aligned on interleaves
Interleave, duration : 10 ms (0.25 video frame)
Interleave, preload duration : 410 ms

[DB83]

A fair comparison is not important here. By snipping with vdub may have altered the original 'good' capture since there is no appreciable difference between the two.


According to the avermedia site, this card captures 'uncompressed' avi or wmv. Both captures are uncompressed. Uncompressed capture in vdub is not really practical so you should use a lossless codec such as Lagarith or Huffyuv. The only other thing that the card does with its own software is to output progressive video against more 'normal' interlaced video.


But also ensure that you are using the most up-to-date driver for your card and not rely on one that Windows allocates. That being said, the latest driver appears to be dated 2017 and Win10 has gone under many a transformation since then.

[davexnet]

Usually with Virtualdub, for lossless source, set the video mode to "direct stream copy" then save the file

[agisthos]

I WANT to output uncompressed AVI, because I am doing various filtering and deinterlacing with Staxrip afterwards. And yes of course I know to direct stream copy when cutting an avi with Virtualdub. I am a noob but not that much of a noob!

There is something I am doing wrong with using Virtualdub for capturing, despite using Lord Smurfs guide. Maybe its the Avermedia card itself.

Davexnet I have even tried using your timings settings you posted.

[davexnet]

That's going back a bit! I haven't captured analog for almost 10 years. My own Avermedia capture card is in an anti-static bag in the closet somewhere.
I think I've seen the [] before but I can't remember the significance of it. Have you tried Amarectv for capture?
Also I would suggest the UT codec vs. uncompressed

[DB83]

Just to eliminate the possibility of corruption done to the original card software capture I would still like to see the media info report of that 50 gb capture.


But, honestly, your rationale in capturing uncompressed just does not stand up with current lossless codecs. Your quoted bitrate is 166 Mb/s. I did a short huffyuv sample a few days ago and that was a little over one-quarter of that at 42.7 Mb/s. And I would challenge anyone to tell the difference. And you can do all you want to do with this and with no data loss until the final encode to a delivery format.

[DB83]

Just one thing about vdub and capture whatever compression you choose. Turn of 'Enable Audio Playback' from the Audio menu. Less chance of dropping frames and at 166 Mb/s that could be severe.


So just as a test I did an uncompressed capture. Bitrate matches the mediainfo report. And all frames are Key frame.

[agisthos]

But, honestly, your rationale in capturing uncompressed just does not stand up with current lossless codecs. Your quoted bitrate is 166 Mb/s. I did a short huffyuv sample a few days ago and that was a little over one-quarter of that at 42.7 Mb/s. And I would challenge anyone to tell the difference. And you can do all you want to do with this and with no data loss until the final encode to a delivery format.

I will definitely look into this huffyuv that everyone is always talking about, as these uncompressed AVI's are huge.

[agisthos]

Just to eliminate the possibility of corruption done to the original card software capture I would still like to see the media info report of that 50 gb capture.

It does seem normal. Avermedia's software splits each piece into 40GB sizes as they are created.

General
Complete name : M:\crows\1_20210606_151743.avi
Format : AVI
Format/Info : Audio Video Interleave
Format profile : OpenDML
File size : 40.0 GiB
Duration : 34 min 12 s
Overall bit rate : 167 Mb/s

Video
ID : 0
Format : YUV
Codec ID : YUY2
Codec ID/Info : YUV 4:2:2 as for UYVY but with different component ordering within the u_int32 macropixel
Duration : 34 min 12 s
Bit rate : 166 Mb/s
Width : 720 pixels
Height : 576 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 5:4
Frame rate : 25.000 FPS
Standard : PAL
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:2
Compression mode : Lossless
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 15.997
Stream size : 39.6 GiB (99%)

Audio
ID : 1
Format : PCM
Format settings : Little / Signed
Codec ID : 1
Duration : 34 min 12 s
Bit rate mode : Constant
Bit rate : 1 536 kb/s
Channel(s) : 2 channels
Sampling rate : 48.0 kHz
Bit depth : 16 bits
Stream size : 376 MiB (1%)
Alignment : Aligned on interleaves
Interleave, duration : 10 ms (0.25 video frame)

[DB83]

Thanks. Yes. The report is consistant.


Well ANY file-splitting (most will remember the 2/4 gb split pre NTFS) is a PITA


Also, if vdub does not work for you then, as also advised, do try AmarecTV

[themaster1]

I WANT to output uncompressed AVI, because I am doing various filtering and deinterlacing with Staxrip afterwards.

No you don't, you want lossless (lagarith,huffyuv, utvideo codec) because uncompressed (RGB) 1: takes LOTS of space 2: is VERY slow to load in software 3: Takes all your RAM space