lineTBC and poor signal video

[tugatomsk]

I have been successfully capturing old tapes using the Panasonic EH50 (PAL) as the lineTBC passthrough.

However, I have a few poor signal recordings where I think lineTBC is doing more harm than good. I say this because when playing straight from the VCR the image is far more stable.

However, I was wondering if there are avisynth filters that can restore such issues, line frames "jumping around", image "wobbling" and such.


I have the link for the video sample:

https://wetransfer.com/downloads/89c26d04904aafef232bd67362590d3c20230406205442/6f6ff8...ource=sendgrid

[themaster1]

you may want a VCR with the "Video Stabilizer" option, some JVC's have that, it will help for the vertical jump i believe.
The image is pretty much unuseable/unwatchable as is if you ask me

[tugatomsk]

you may want a VCR with the "Video Stabilizer" option, some JVC's have that, it will help for the vertical jump i believe.
The image is pretty much unuseable/unwatchable as is if you ask me

But the thing is that my current VCR, a Sony SLV-135, does not show any vertical jump on its own, only when I passthrough poor quality signal through the EH50. When the signal is good, the EH50 does a great job at stabilizing the framerate on virtualdub and keep the image stable.

[Sharc]

But the thing is that my current VCR, a Sony SLV-135, does not show any vertical jump on its own, only when I passthrough poor quality signal through the EH50. When the signal is good, the EH50 does a great job at stabilizing the framerate on virtualdub and keep the image stable.

This may happen for very poor sources. "TBC" external devices can indeed worsen the result for patalogical cases. Also, the captured format is progressive.
Maybe this tape is a candidate to be ditched?

[dellsam34]

There isn't much quality in those recordings, not sure what's the reason to digitize them? Are they that rare? Can't you find them in other formats?

[johnmeyer]

That's one of the worst captures I've ever seen. You didn't say whether your sample was with the TBC or without. Either way, I'd try it on another VCR and if that is bad as well then, sadly, your tapes are no longer viewable.

[tugatomsk]

That's one of the worst captures I've ever seen. You didn't say whether your sample was with the TBC or without. Either way, I'd try it on another VCR and if that is bad as well then, sadly, your tapes are no longer viewable.

It's not the tape itself, it was the signal reception that was very poor. These are Spanish channels recorded 30 miles from the border with Portugal. Sometimes the signal was good, sometimes it was terrible, like this one.

As I wrote at the beginning, I used the EH50 as a lineTBC passthrough. With that I meant the lineTBC of the EH50 was on (it can't be turned off as far as I know).

But today I tested a Sony RDR-HX710 which has NO lineTBC and the poor signal is managed more correctly. But I still prefer the EH50 with good signal recordings.

So, yeah, I guess you confirmed what I thought about "quasi" lineTBC from DVD recorders when playing poor quality signal. I would go the S-VHS + dedicated frameTBC route, but sadly I won't be able to afford such expensive equipment for a long time...

[lollo]

I would go the S-VHS + dedicated frameTBC route

I do not think this will solve your problem, given the bad recorded signal baked in the tapes...

[tugatomsk]

I would go the S-VHS + dedicated frameTBC route

I do not think this will solve your problem, given the bad recorded signal baked in the tapes...

The purpose wouldn't be to completely correct the issues - as you said, they're essentially baked in - so much as to mitigate them. I understand there are limits, but since most of you are vastly more knowledgeable of avisynth filters and their capabilities than myself, I thought I'd give it a try.

Thanks anyway. ��

[johnmeyer]

I understand now. The problem is that the signal was weak. I can see how a TBC might make the problem worse because it still needs some regularity in the signal and the phase shifts caused by multi-path and other atmospheric-caused changes from a distant station will probably fool it.

The best you can do is try some heavy spatial filtering. While not strictly a spatial filter, fft3D might help. You'd have to experiment a lot with the various Sigma settings.

[tugatomsk]

I understand now. The problem is that the signal was weak. I can see how a TBC might make the problem worse because it still needs some regularity in the signal and the phase shifts caused by multi-path and other atmospheric-caused changes from a distant station will probably fool it.

The best you can do is try some heavy spatial filtering. While not strictly a spatial filter, fft3D might help. You'd have to experiment a lot with the various Sigma settings.

Thanks. 👍