Bad Drive or failing controller ?

[DB83]

I'll start a fresh topic since this is only partially related to my earlier one.

To recap, I needed to restore an XP partition from a 'failing' drive to a brand new WD blue. The WD installed fine last night. I partitioned it as I thought to match the XP partition size on the old one. I did a quick test on the larger partition and that seemed fine as well.

So this morning, I started the restore process (using the Terabyte backup). My first problem was that the OS partition was not large enough. I had set 80000 kb whereas I program said I needed 80003. DOH !. So I expanded the partition to 80005 and restarted the restore.

The restore went up to 12% and then it stalled. After waiting an eternity, I tried to cancel the process and the program would not cooperate but it did say at one stage that there were bad sectors on the drive. DOH mk2 !!!!. I finally terminated the program under the Task Manager and then armagedon struck. The WD reported inaccassable in Windows explorer. A PC reboot and the drive was no longer seen in the bios and disappeared in Disk Management as if it was never there in the first place.

I should add at this stage that I only did a quick format of the partition. When I expanded the partition I did not even reformat. Was that my big mistake ?

Or do I simply have a bad drive which will have to be returned ? I guess there is nothing I can do to bring this drive back to life.

[Bjs]

You can make a mess of the partition setup / format without problems ... but for a drive to completely disappear no matter what you try sounds like the control board may have failed

Thou some drives are finicky with jumper settings so try changing those first and power connector to different power rail and see if the drive reappears in bios first before rma.

[pandy]

S.M.A.R.T. is OK? Perhaps you can test HDD with Victoria diagnostic (non destructive for sector scan) - part of for example Hiren's BootCD (last is quite old http://downloads.tomsguide.com/Hiren-s-Boot-CD,0301-51033.html but should work, also there is partition management software there and backup solutions - i use them quite frequently).

[DB83]

I mentioned the controller board. By that I meant the mainboard controller. I did try a different sata cable to the drive and still no luck. Have not tried a different power cable. You do not get jumpers on modern SATA drives ???

All other drives connected to the PC are appearing fine. But this one does not show up on the startup screen. IIRC the message said 'No Device Available/Found'

[Nelson37]

Double check all connections, carefully. Move the drive to a mobo port, SATA cable, and power cord, that are currently known to work. Check connections AGAIN. Disconnect ALL other drives, check if recognized in BIOS, NOT windows.

Drive failure, out of the box, is RARE, but this drive did work for a little while, at least. Possible errors with restore and partitioning should not cause BIOS to fail to recognize drive. If BIOS don't see it, with good connection, (which can fail), good cable, (which can fail), and good port, (which can fail), then replace the drive. Worthwhile and probably mandatory to use mfgr's utility to test and prepare drive in order to obtain RMA, or warranty return.

Personally, I NEVER, EVER, modify an existing partition structure. Delete ALL, re-create correctly, and do the LONG format, not the short one. IMO it is preferable to reveal any possible problems BEFORE spending hours restoring data, rather than AFTER.

[DB83]

^^ Thanks. Just pne 'blonde' question. If a PC can not see the drive how can one run the mfgr's test utility ?

I have just swapped the power cable from a known working drive(PC turned off) and the WD is still AWOL. Took the power cable from the WD in to a known working drive and that is still working. So methinks that eliminates power. Already have done the same with the data cable.

On POST I see 'No Device Detected' on the port where the WD was.

So methinks something did go amiss when I expanded that partition. Even more so as I usually do the full format yet the last two WD's I have bought came already formatted which might have clouded my judgement.

The drive goes back to Amazon.

[october262]

May not hurt to reset the bios to factory settings.

[DB83]

^^ Before I do that, I thought I would take out the WD blue and put back the drive I am replacing.

Now there was an odd rebooting issue which I also noticed this morning - sorry for not mentioning it earlier. The welcome screen plus 'F' options came up but not the POST screen. It just rebooted in to the welcome screen. Finally got past that with a reset.

The old drive now shows up and all the others in the PC so that kinda discounts cables.

So is that rebooting on startup telling me something ?

Now to reverse the above reverse. Watch this space.

[DB83]

^^ Done that. Same rebooting issue which, I suppose, is the bios telling me something. Same POST (when it finally appeared) message "No device detected" and no WD blue in Windows.

[october262]

Also see here - https://www.ifixit.com/Wiki/Installing_a_Hard_Drive

[DB83]

^^ You miss the important bit. The drive HAS been installed. It was working.

Now this rebooting on the welcome screen is doing my head in.

[october262]

Try reading on installing XP - https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/kb/978307

[DB83]

None of this is actually helping.

Try reading this:

https://forum.videohelp.com/threads/380802-Backing-up-and-restoring-OS-%28XP%29-drive-on-to-a-new-HDD

I have successfully installed XP more times than I have had hot dinners this month.

The issue here is the WD blue. Is it bad or not ? And what is now causing this rebooting of the startup/welcome screen BEFORE the POST screen. Not even OS related.

[october262]

Will it boot in safe mode ??

[DB83]

Can we get back on topic?

FYI When the drive (now removed) was attached and XP selected (Dual Boot with Win7) XP booted fine. The issue was the data partition. The other topic fully explains this.

XP is NOT installed. It is intended to be restored to the new WD blue which is no longer recognised. It was last recognised at appr 10 am UK time this morning during the attempted restore of the XP partition.

If I had this working HDD I could no doubt reinstall XP. But it is not working. I can not be any clearer.

[october262]

I would try taking the hard drive to your nearest computer repair shop
And have them test it. If it is bad then send back to Amazon.

[DB83]

My only thoughts on that rebooting issue at the welcome ie pre-POST screen - NOT the Win Welcome Screen - was that the WD passport was still attached to the PC.

Just restarted the PC with the passport unplugged and there was no rebooting issue.

[redwudz]

I've had a couple of PCs lock up and not boot when they had a USB device connected, mostly USB thumb drives.
I am guessing something in the BIOS tries to defer the boot to the USB device and if there is no OS there, nothing works.

[CobraPilot]

My only thoughts on that rebooting issue at the welcome ie pre-POST screen - NOT the Win Welcome Screen - was that the WD passport was still attached to the PC.

Just restarted the PC with the passport unplugged and there was no rebooting issue.

I have a netbook that will NOT boot if a USB thumb drive is attached. Your experience suggests that'll happen if I connect a USB HD.

Sometimes the simplest things will cause us the biggest headaches . . . .!

[bevills1]

I've had a couple of PCs lock up and not boot when they had a USB device connected, mostly USB thumb drives.
I am guessing something in the BIOS tries to defer the boot to the USB device and if there is no OS there, nothing works.

I've experienced that exact circumstance. If boot order in BIOS has a USB device before the boot hard drive, it will try to boot to the USB device. You can change the boot order to have the boot hard drive precede the USB device in the boot order to fix this issue.

[DB83]

Yes. The usb was an oversight on my part. And given the issues with the HDD I was thinking in that direction.

Well I have arranged for the drive to be picked up by Amazon and a replacement will arrive in some days. Having checked the cabling with other, working, drives I can not see this being my system. I'll not be so hasty next time and a) make sure the partition is the correct size b) do a full format of the partitions before going further. One can always learn from one's mistakes and if this topic helps someone else then all is not in vain.

[Nelson37]

One reason I always suggest unplugging everything not necessary to test the current problem is to avoid getting sidetracked on red herring issues. A device can't be part of the problem if it is not connected to the system. One optical,One hard drive. Simple system, limited number of possible problem causes. Other devices not specifically needed to test component simply provide possible additional error vectors.

The Mfgr utility usually comes prepared as a bootable file, sometimes this is able to access some basic functionality of a drive not recognized in BIOS. Such as ID the name of the device, etc. Error code from test is often required for return to mfgr, if within 30-90 days then original seller usually not as picky.

[DB83]

Well the only mfgr utility I could find for the WD blue was the 'Data Lifeguard'.

When I ran that it told me of all the HDDs in the system apart from this 'absent' one.

And, yes, Amazon have accepted the return without a quibble.

[DB83]

Well the 'replacement' drive arrives today (much quicker than I anticipated)

But rather than make more mistakes, maybe it would be better than I get talked through this process. Even though I have done it so many times.

I have fond memories of my very first Hard Disk - came on an expansion card that filled the length of the case and had a wopping 32 gig of capacity. Those were the days

And drives have got smaller and some you might not even recognise as a drive. And methinks the 'replacement' fits that category. Its so different to the one I sent back that I am totally confused. The package contents look more like 2 paperback books and some ladies toiletry.

So I need help. Should the power cable go in the top book or the bottom book. And where does the toiletry fit in ? No. I have not been at the wacky backy but Amazon have totally fecked up the replacement.

And time is running out to restore that XP partition with the evaluation software.

[davejavu]

And where does the toiletry fit in ?

You might want to rephrase that

[Nelson37]

Sounds like some of the toys my ex had.....

Pictures and/or a model number might help, are you saying there is more than one power connector on the drive? Could they have sent you two units?

My first HD was 20 MB. Yes, that's an "M".

[DB83]

You know that time plays havoc with the mind.

That 32g probably was 32m. All I do remember is that I bought it on Tott Ct. Rd (London) which in those days had a whole row of PC stores. And it cost appr £180 - recall writing out several cheques since a guarantee card only supported so much.

As for the 'replacement' that is definitely dual-booting

[redwudz]

Times have changed.

[DB83]

^^ Well I guess that was an 'external' drive

Maybe I can now write the final chapter to this epic. Picked up the replacement for the 'replacement' today since I was out when the delivery was attempted on Saturday. Oh well.

Learnt from my mistakes or I was just darn unlucky last time around. Partition size: Correct. Format: Full - Pretty quick on the XP partition (80gb). Not so for the data partition.

Ran the restore program and some 30 mins later XP was running again on this dual-boot. Will probably leave the restoration of the data partition folders (just plain copy/paste) for another day.

Many thanks to all who contributed here. And trust you had a wee giggle as well.