Blu-ray prices go up following HD DVD's death

[sanlyn]

As jagabo has already pointed out, these HD-DVD&&Blu-Ray related
threads really look like discussions/quarrels about religion. ...
Anyway, here goes my "uneducated guess" of the day:
HD-DVD lost the format war against Blu-Ray only because "HD-DVD" does not
sound "cool" --- if it had been named "Purple-Ray" for example, things might
have run quite differently.

For some folks, midsuki, the quest for higher numbers is indeed a religion, and like many such endeavors it can attract its share of extremists.

Purple? Nah, try Green-Ray or Red-Ray. Purple has too many syllables.

[DereX888]

As jagabo has already pointed out, these HD-DVD&&Blu-Ray related
threads really look like discussions/quarrels about religion. ...
Anyway, here goes my "uneducated guess" of the day:
HD-DVD lost the format war against Blu-Ray only because "HD-DVD" does not
sound "cool" --- if it had been named "Purple-Ray" for example, things might
have run quite differently.

For some folks, midsuki, the quest for higher numbers is indeed a religion, and like many such endeavors it can attract its share of extremists.

Purple? Nah, try Green-Ray or Red-Ray. Purple has too many syllables.

True.
From marketing classes - the more catchy the product name, the higher the chance of its popularity.
"HD-DVD" was bad unmarketable name. They really should have go with "RedRay"

But OTOH not that would have change the outcome anyways. S*ny had to "win" because it was about their main livelihood, they couldn't afford to lose this one at all for their near future sake.

[Midzuki]

sanlyn wrote:

Purple? Nah, try Green-Ray or Red-Ray. Purple has too many syllables.

However "Green-Ray" or "Red-Ray" would be even more inaccurate than "Blue Ray"
--- technically speaking, the Hi-Def Video Discs are read with a violet laser.

[maek]

As jagabo has already pointed out, these HD-DVD&&Blu-Ray related
threads really look like discussions/quarrels about religion. ...
Anyway, here goes my "uneducated guess" of the day:
HD-DVD lost the format war against Blu-Ray only because "HD-DVD" does not
sound "cool" --- if it had been named "Purple-Ray" for example, things might
have run quite differently.

For some folks, midsuki, the quest for higher numbers is indeed a religion, and like many such endeavors it can attract its share of extremists.

Purple? Nah, try Green-Ray or Red-Ray. Purple has too many syllables.

True.
From marketing classes - the more catchy the product name, the higher the chance of its popularity.
"HD-DVD" was bad unmarketable name. They really should have go with "RedRay"

But OTOH not that would have change the outcome anyways. S*ny had to "win" because it was about their main livelihood, they couldn't afford to lose this one at all for their near future sake.

Considering Toshiba's success, shouldn't they have called it Death Ray?

[DereX888]

sanlyn wrote:

Purple? Nah, try Green-Ray or Red-Ray. Purple has too many syllables.

However "Green-Ray" or "Red-Ray" would be even more inaccurate than "Blue Ray"
--- technically speaking, the Hi-Def Video Discs are read with a violet laser.

Well then, "ViRay" or whatever

As jagabo has already pointed out, these HD-DVD&&Blu-Ray related
threads really look like discussions/quarrels about religion. ...
Anyway, here goes my "uneducated guess" of the day:
HD-DVD lost the format war against Blu-Ray only because "HD-DVD" does not
sound "cool" --- if it had been named "Purple-Ray" for example, things might
have run quite differently.

For some folks, midsuki, the quest for higher numbers is indeed a religion, and like many such endeavors it can attract its share of extremists.

Purple? Nah, try Green-Ray or Red-Ray. Purple has too many syllables.

True.
From marketing classes - the more catchy the product name, the higher the chance of its popularity.
"HD-DVD" was bad unmarketable name. They really should have go with "RedRay"

But OTOH not that would have change the outcome anyways. S*ny had to "win" because it was about their main livelihood, they couldn't afford to lose this one at all for their near future sake.

Considering Toshiba's success, shouldn't they have called it Death Ray?

Hehehe
I would

BTW (OT):
Anyone want to suggest good non-S*ny progressive BR-DVD player / DVD/XVID player / DVD-R recorder below $1K?
My dad wants one, but all I can find are just S*ny make...

[maek]

Does Panasonic hit too close to home?

[terjeber]

My discussion with "sanlyn" centers around the following sentiment expressed by him: "The quality differences are easily distinguishable. I am talking about BD's color problems, not lines of resolution."

Every Blu-Ray presentation I've seen has obvious chroma upsampling errors,

And this is what it comes down to. You have watched two Blu-Ray players at Best Buy connected to badly calibrated TVs, and you use that information to extrapolate something about a format. The problem you have "sanlyn" is that you stated that there was a difference between the two formats, and that that this difference was easily distinguishable. You also stated that this was an issue separating Blu-Ray from HD DVD.

Now, the problem you have is that that is an absurd statement. 100% totally absurd. The data on a Blu-Ray disk and a HD DVD disk is either identical in quality or the Blu-Ray has a slight quality edge. Only theoretical, but it is there. What comes after that is implementation, and not related to format at all.

Decoding chips are commodities and HD DVD and Blu-Ray manufacturers will use the same chips. Since the data on the disk is identical, the chips decoding that data are format neutral, stating that one format has an edge over the other is utterly, totally and insanely absurd. It simply isn't even theoretically possible.

Now both formats may have issues you find troublesome, but there isn't any possible way you can use image quality to favor HD DVD over Blu-Ray, since the image quality is either identical or slightly better with Blue. In all circumstances. No matter what your religion might tell you.

Again, I am not arguing against your support for HD DVD, by all means, it had many good qualities. I was arguing against your dumb statement, a statement that can not even theoretically be true.

[NICEBUD]

terjeber shut the FU*K UP.MY original thead (yes mine not yours) was about GREEDY retailers .It is not about
how good YOU think blue fu*king POO is.

Anyway heres more of whats to come DIG DEEP if you love blue/poo.




http://www.smh.com.au/news/articles/bluray-price-hike-as-winner-takes-all/2008/04/04/1...249417350.html

Bashing doesn't help. You are in breach of the forum rules and are being issued with a formal warning.
/ Moderator SatStorm

[bbanderic]

terjeber shut the FU*K UP.MY original thead (yes mine not yours) was about GREEDY retailers .It is not about
how good YOU think blue fu*king POO is.

Anyway heres more of whats to come DIG DEEP if you love blue/poo.




http://www.smh.com.au/news/articles/bluray-price-hike-as-winner-takes-all/2008/04/04/1...249417350.html

Bashing doesn't help. You are in breach of the forum rules and are being issued with a formal warning.
/ Moderator SatStorm

You sound like a very bitter HD-DVD supporter, it's time to get over it. Talk to me when Christmas rolls around and/or when the new models are released, you'll see the prices come down significantly. Be patient and let the natural progression of price reductions happen which I think you'll see now that the competition between hardware manufacturers starts to heat up. How much could you buy a DVD player for two years into it's life cycle? How soon we forget.

These price increases, or should I say increase back to the regular price is temporary:

http://www.smartmoney.com/dealoftheday/index.cfm?story=20080220-blu-ray

[rhegedus]

Except that prices haven't gone up, they've gone down over the past 30 days:



And, just to compare with when this thread was started:



So from an average price of $29 in February to $26 in April is an increase, huh?

[jagabo]

Wow, Blu-ray players for $26 now?

[rhegedus]

Disks.....

The original post referred to disks as well as players.

But you knew this already

[maek]

It's a natural mistake...I thought I was looking at the price of gas in the UK converted to dollars, myself. But it's Blu-Ray discs.

The price will eventually come down. It has to, or why will DVD consumers bother with the upgrade? Yeah, yeah, it looks great, blah blah blah...but if a new release costs $10 more than the DVD counterpart, people are more likely to opt for the SD option. Now, if it's a $2-$3 difference, we'll see.

Same thing regarding players. Apart from the wavelength of the laser, a faster processor, and the mechanics involved with reading finer streams of data, what is there inside a player that's significantly different? It will come down eventually as more plants are brought online, more investors jump in (because the perceived loss of investing inside a format war is pretty much gone), etc.

If not, then buy the SD DVDs and feel better about your choice. Me, I'm waiting for the cost to come down. I remember a time when DVD players were exorbitant during the time that VHS ruled the playing field. It was a more difficult battle then. But if the Blu-Ray player can play standard DVDs AND the costs come down, they should have an easier time.

Time will tell.

[usually_quiet]

I didn't begin reading this thread until today because I didn't have a dog in this fight. I have analog SD CRT TV's, plus a VCR and an analog tuner DVD recorder, all of which I hope not to replace before they die. Going Hi-Def would be a huge expense for me. TV's of the size needed to get the full benefit of Hi-Def video are close to $1000, if not more, and they are a little large for my living space. In addition to new recording/playback devices, I'd need a different cable package to enjoy my new TV, which would cost me a fair amount more per year too. Unless the prices drop considerably, I intend to stay with SD for as long as I can. Blu-Ray and Blu-Ray players? No thanks.

Early in this thread, the subject of China and Blue-Ray came up. Sony may not be licensing it to the Chinese, but I remember reading here months ago that the Chinese announced they are developing their own Hi-Def technology for internal use because licensing costs for Blu-Ray were too high. If that is successful, it might be accepted by other countries in the region as well, in lieu of Blu-Ray. Blu-Ray will likely have real competition in the future, at least on the Asian continent. Then there's India, which has a huge movie industry of its own. Will they go with Blu-Ray, China's way, or their own way?

[Video Head]

I didn't begin reading this thread until today because I didn't have a dog in this fight. I have analog SD CRT TV's, plus a VCR and an analog tuner DVD recorder, all of which I hope not to replace before they die. Going Hi-Def would be a huge expense for me. TV's of the size needed to get the full benefit of Hi-Def video are close to $1000, if not more, and they are a little large for my living space. In addition to new recording/playback devices, I'd need a different cable package to enjoy my new TV, which would cost me a fair amount more per year too. Unless the prices drop considerably, I intend to stay with SD for as long as I can. Blu-Ray and Blu-Ray players? No thanks.

Dogs? The dogs are long gone. After the dogs came knives. Then guns. Right now it looks like everyone either has a grenade launcher or RPG's...this thread's subject should have been changed to "Gunfight at the OK Coral" along time ago

I believe you represent the average consumer. I have asked alot of people if they own either BR or HDDVD...nadda one. Not me either. I'm waiting it out too. Upscaled SD DVD is still looking fine and I am not about to start buying the over 1,000 DVD's that I currently own over again...let's see now: 1,000 x $20 = ...nope, I'm going to use that money towards my '08 Boss Mustang...but thanks anyways Hollywood.

[rhegedus]

I'm going to use that money towards my '08 Boss Mustang....

Now we're talking!

I'm pleased to hear it's going to have a decent suspesion set-up instead of that live axel crap.

Now all that's needed is a decent tune-up to get 500bhp.

[Video Head]

I'm going to use that money towards my '08 Boss Mustang....

Now we're talking!

I'm pleased to hear it's going to have a decent suspesion set-up instead of that live axel crap.

Now all that's needed is a decent tune-up to get 500bhp.

BHP? A thousand undernourished ponies will not put up a single hoof against 450 well bred and well fed thoroughbreds...give me torque any day.

Oh, and real men can drive 4 or 6 link high powered live rear axles...Neon drivers need not apply...except to the Skippy Barber school... :P

[FulciLives]

I like my front wheel drive car that gets me from point A to point B ... it even has a CD player and FM/AM radio built-in!

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

P.S.
Auto transmission of course ... I've never ever driven a stick shift ... too much work

[rhegedus]

Torque all you want - spinning wheels go nowhere fast

[Video Head]

Torque all you want - spinning wheels go nowhere fast

Hmmm....Chevy Sprint? And your mom thinks its fast?

[Video Head]

I like my front wheel drive car that gets me from point A to point B ... it even has a CD player and FM/AM radio built-in!

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

P.S.
Auto transmission of course ... I've never ever driven a stick shift ... too much work

That's why they take the time to put up the "Slow Traffic Keep Right" signs, FulciLives.

[DereX888]

I like my front wheel drive car that gets me from point A to point B ... it even has a CD player and FM/AM radio built-in!

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

P.S.
Auto transmission of course ... I've never ever driven a stick shift ... too much work

That's why they take the time to put up the "Slow Traffic Keep Right" signs, FulciLives.

LOL
But you are so right

I'd extend that further - i.e. in Florida they should have automatic *gates* (like railroad crossings) for all those people who just can't see red lights, or drive so slow that they can't even make it through the green lights

[rhegedus]

Torque all you want - spinning wheels go nowhere fast

Hmmm....Chevy Sprint? And your mom thinks its fast?

What the hell are you on about?

[usually_quiet]

Give FulciLives a break guys. Stick shift automobiles are not big sellers in Pittsburgh on account of the terrain and driving conditions. City traffic... hills everywhere you go, with stops at the top of most of them... Not that you won't see some muscle cars in and around Pittsburgh, but if you had to drive a stick-shift there every day, you'd find a manual transmission somewhat less charming. Clutches wear out quickly too.

Getting back on topic: I probably am an average consumer in most respects. My DVD collection doesn't enter into why I have no interest in Blu-Ray. I own 2 commercial DVD's and that is only because I couldn't rent them. No children in the house, so I don't watch many movies more than once. Renting makes sense for me.

My DVD collection consists almost entirely of things that I recorded myself, much of which is instructional in nature (cooking and how-to shows). Quality isn't too much of an issue for these. I only save them for the content since generally some time passes before I can make use of what is on them.

[sanlyn]

My discussion with "sanlyn" centers around the following sentiment expressed by him: "The quality differences are easily distinguishable. I am talking about BD's color problems, not lines of resolution."

Every Blu-Ray presentation I've seen has obvious chroma upsampling errors,

And this is what it comes down to. You have watched two Blu-Ray players at Best Buy connected to badly calibrated TVs, and you use that information to extrapolate something about a format . . . . .
Again, I am not arguing against your support for HD DVD, by all means, it had many good qualities. I was arguing against your dumb statement, a statement that can not even theoretically be true.

Try a Google search on the chroma upsampling error. Most players, of every type and price, have it. HD-DVD players did, too. Gimme a little credit, terjeber: why do you assume I'd base a major purchase of any kind on the junkware flouted at BestBuy? Good source of sales on blank discs, though, I bought 200 Sonys this past Friday for $35!

I don't think we should invest much time on this which-is-better debate, especially since you make conflicting statements about "numbers" that have nothing to do with why I don't care for BlueRay. There is a very large community on this planet that remains unimpressed by BlueRay or HD-DVD. I'm happy to say I haven't spent any money on either. I will agree, BlueRay has built up some mighty impressive numbers, but only to produce what many see as an underwhelming product. Today's BlueRay is already obsolete. As soon as the market gets anywhere near glutted, say in maybe 5 years if that long, people will be using their "ancient" BlueRay players for foot rests.

"The medium is the message", sayeth Marshall McLuhan. How right he was.

[Video Head]

Torque all you want - spinning wheels go nowhere fast

Hmmm....Chevy Sprint? And your mom thinks its fast?

What the hell are you on about?

Some questions are not worthy of an answer... :P

[Josh Mickens]

Egh, the sad thing about this is I already have a blue ray player because of my PS3 but i'm still not willing to dish out extra money for the blue ray dvd. Jeezes Christ 6 of those babies could buy me another PS3. It's not that I don't have the money but I just thing the prices of it are really unreasonable. I hope the market of it comes down and I don't know why it hasn't yet because I don't really have anyone in my commmunity or area speaking about it.

[rhegedus]

You might want to spend some of that money on a calculator first:

average disk price <$30, six disks for <$180.

PS3 is $400.

[FulciLives]

You might want to spend some of that money on a calculator first:

average disk price <$30, six disks for <$180.

PS3 is $400.

LOL now that's funny

I just ordered DAWN OF THE DEAD and DAY OF THE DEAD (not the crap ass remakes but the originals) on Blu-Ray through a website that had an Anchor Bay Entertainment Blu-Ray sale ... price for each was $12.21 and that includes shipping. EVIL DEAD 2 is also on sale for $12.21 so I might pick that up before the end of the month (the sale is good through April 29, 2008 at DeepDiscount.Com)

I still feel that the average priced Blu-Ray is a bit overpriced ... lot's of stuff I would buy if it was $20 or less but hey look for the deals that will be there (from time to time) and eventually prices will come down. In the mean time rent from NetFlix etc.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[terjeber]

My discussion with "sanlyn" centers around the following sentiment expressed by him: "The quality differences are easily distinguishable. I am talking about BD's color problems, not lines of resolution."

Every Blu-Ray presentation I've seen has obvious chroma upsampling errors,

And this is what it comes down to. You have watched two Blu-Ray players at Best Buy connected to badly calibrated TVs, and you use that information to extrapolate something about a format . . . . .
Again, I am not arguing against your support for HD DVD, by all means, it had many good qualities. I was arguing against your dumb statement, a statement that can not even theoretically be true.

Try a Google search on the chroma upsampling error. Most players, of every type and price, have it. HD-DVD players did, too. Gimme a little credit,

Sorry for the late response, I've been traveling. Anyway, why should I give you credit? I have never talked about whether there may be chroma upsampling problems in disk-based HD content. I disputed your claim that there was a significant difference between HD DVD and Blu-Ray in this regard. I never meant it as a slight at HD DVD or a fan-boy post about Blu-Ray, I simply pointed out that stating there is any kind of difference is absurd. In the extreme. Is there a chroma problem? Probably. I have never commented on it one way or another and I don't care all that much. I only arrested your absurd statement about there being a clearly distinguishable difference between HD DVD and Blu-Ray in that regard. Do you not understand the difference?

terjeber: why do you assume I'd base a major purchase

I try not to assume too much, but when someone, like you, are incapable of understanding the difference between:
"There is a chroma problem in HD DVD and Blu-Ray movies" and
"There is a significant chroma problem with Blu-Ray and that is why HD DVD is better"

then I have to assume a massive lack of basic comprehension capabilities.

I don't think we should invest much time on this which-is-better debate,

I never did. I just pointed out a glaring error in your post. A totally absurd statement in fact.

especially since you make conflicting statements about "numbers" that have nothing to do with why I don't care for BlueRay.

Well, why do you not care, and why did you think HD DVD was better? Given that they have identical chroma problems, what is the difference?