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joepic
Member
Joined: 29 Oct 2002
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New negotiations for an international Anti-Counterfeiting Trade Agreement (ACTA) kick off today, and this round focuses on a secretive Internet piracy plan drafted by the U.S government. No text has been released, but leaks have surfaced. It's not looking good.
The leaks suggest that countries who sign up to the U.S promoted plan would have to force ISPs to proactively police copyright on user-generated content, cut off those accused (or face liability), and put "graduated response" clauses in customer contracts. An example of graduated response is France's "three strikes and your out" law. There, you get two warnings if caught sharing music or movies, then you're banned for up to two years.
This provision would mean that every country that signs up to ACTA must allow content owners such as record companies and Hollywood studios to sue ISPs for failing to stop their subscribers from illegally sharing copyright-protected material such as music and movies.
By the way, two major sources of counterfeiting—Russia and China—aren't in the talks. If you want to get your head further around the issue, these sites do a great job of breaking it all down: [Electronic Frontier Foundation and PC World via BoingBoing]
http://gizmodo.com/5396757/secret-copyright-treaty-details-leak-i ... right-cops
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jagabo
Member
Joined: 09 Dec 2005
Location: none
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mh2360
Long Member
Joined: 01 Aug 2001
Location: UK
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This is totally incompatible with the EU's E-Commerce Directive 2002, which grants ISPs "mere conduit" status and does not hold them legally responsible for what is transmitted over their networks.
Good luck to the US if they think they are going to get that changed.
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jagabo
Member
Joined: 09 Dec 2005
Location: none
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| mh2360 wrote: |
| This is totally incompatible with the EU's E-Commerce Directive 2002, which grants ISPs "mere conduit" status and does not hold them legally responsible for what is transmitted over their networks. |
That is why the music and movie business is spending so much money bribing key officials. France has already fallen. The UK is close.
Interesting point of view from a copyright lawyer:
http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/news/2009/11/big-content-using ... ht-law.ars
| Quote: |
The term graduated response should be replaced with a more accurate term 'digital guillotine,'
The DMCA is the 21st-century equivalent of letting copyright owners put a chastity belt on someone else's wife. |
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mh2360
Long Member
Joined: 01 Aug 2001
Location: UK
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| jagabo wrote: |
| mh2360 wrote: |
| This is totally incompatible with the EU's E-Commerce Directive 2002, which grants ISPs "mere conduit" status and does not hold them legally responsible for what is transmitted over their networks. |
That is why the music and movie business is spending so much money bribing key officials. France has already fallen. The UK is close. |
French ISPs are not required to monitor what goes across their networks, just as UK ISPs are not. The copyright cops in the EU rely on the old method of IP tracing from P2P apps such as Bittorrent. The legislation being proposed in the UK still relies on proof being provided by the copyright holder that their work is being shared by an individual.
Users of Rapidshare and newsgroups are still as safe as they have always been and are likely to remain so for the foreseable future.
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lordsmurf
Video Restorer
Joined: 10 Jun 2003
Location: Want my advice? PM me.
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Wouldn't government-imposed "cut off" circumvent due process? I believe it would.
_________________
digitalFAQ.com -- Help with VHS to DVD, DVD recorders, other video/photo issues.
NoMoreCoasters.com -- How to avoid bad burns, how to find the best blank DVDs.
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jagabo
Member
Joined: 09 Dec 2005
Location: none
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| lordsmurf wrote: |
| Wouldn't government-imposed "cut off" circumvent due process? I believe it would. |
Like government imposed jail sentences cut off due process? They are two different issues.
France's three strikes law requires judicial oversight. It's not clear whether that's anything more than a rubber stamp from the judge's office though.
This also appears to be an attempt to bypass legal issues by forcing users to contractually agree to the policies before they can get internet service.
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mh2360
Long Member
Joined: 01 Aug 2001
Location: UK
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| lordsmurf wrote: |
| Wouldn't government-imposed "cut off" circumvent due process? I believe it would. |
The UK version does presume guilt, which is why at least one ISP is taking legal action to stop it, or at least delay it. The present UK government has 6 months left at best, so I doubt we will see it come into force.
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deadrats
Member
Joined: 29 Nov 2005
Location: United States
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| lordsmurf wrote: |
| Wouldn't government-imposed "cut off" circumvent due process? I believe it would. |
have you been paying any attention to the legal climate in this country for the last, oh i don't know, say...200 years?
i can think of hundreds of times when constitutionally guaranteed protections such as free speech, free assembly, due process, the right to face your accuser, and numerous other protections are trampled on.
doesn't a gag order infringe on free speech?
don't laws prohibiting the congregation of gang members (such as those laws that exists in california) violate the freedom of assembly?
don't laws that make it a crime to have a gang tattoo (in some states it's a crime) violate free speech protections?
don't restrictive covenants (more commonly called "non-compete" agreements) violate anti-trust laws and free speech protections?
isn't the right to bear arms severely restricted in many states? (i happen to live in one such state)
i can go on for hours with specific examples of instances where constitutionally guaranteed rights are ignored for some supposed "greater" good purpose, but that discussion would definitely end up in the "political discussion" spectrum and as we all know that is forbidden by this forums rules (how ironic is that statement in the context of what i just wrote?).
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jagabo
Member
Joined: 09 Dec 2005
Location: none
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Don't forget the IRS where you're presumed guilty until you prove your innocence. And forfeiture laws where you property is confiscated because you are suspected of a crime and you can't get it back until you've proven you didn't commit the crime.
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16mmJunkie
Member
Joined: 03 Apr 2008
Location: Reel World
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Just another example of the US trying to run everything in the World. For some reason the USA thinks the rest of the World should follow their rules/beliefs ! So much for Freedom and Diversity.
16mmJunkie
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jagabo
Member
Joined: 09 Dec 2005
Location: none
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Face it, Big Business has figured out a way to rig the system in their favor. Elected governments are becoming the new royalty and big business the new feudal lords.
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KBeee
Member
Joined: 17 Jun 2003
Location: United Kingdom
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| jagabo wrote: |
| Face it, Big Business has figured out a way to rig the system in their favor. Elected governments are becoming the new royalty and big business the new feudal lords. |
Yup, the modern day Robber Barons
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fritzi93
Member
Joined: 01 Nov 2003
Location: U.S.
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| 16mmJunkie wrote: |
Just another example of the US trying to run everything in the World. For some reason the USA thinks the rest of the World should follow their rules/beliefs ! So much for Freedom and Diversity.
16mmJunkie |
Pffft! Most Americans would much rather not be bothered by the rest of the world. 
But the U.S. has out-sized influence, that's certain. Like it or not. This is just another instance of an interest group pushing for adoption of laws (or Senate approval of treaties) favorable to them. Collectively, they have political clout, and this will work itself out as a political issue. Can they get enough votes in the U.S. Congress? And if so, will other countries go along? We'll see. ISPs are another interest group with political clout, they will surely oppose this.
_________________
Pull! Bang! Darn!
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bendixG15
Member
Joined: 24 Aug 2004
Location: United States
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Its getting a bit political here.......
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redwudz
Mod Neophyte
Joined: 07 Sep 2002
Location: AZ, USA
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Discussing political issues is in violation of our rules. Further political discussion will cause this thread to be locked or deleted. Please stay on topic and keep politics out of it.
Fair warning.
Moderator redwudz
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jagabo
Member
Joined: 09 Dec 2005
Location: none
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deadrats
Member
Joined: 29 Nov 2005
Location: United States
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these people need to get a clue, they are never going to stop file sharing, most torrent clients already have encryption technology, all that's going to happen is that the encryption technology that allows file sharers to hide their activities is going to improve.
as far as the sites and the trackers they run, we'll just see them move their base of operations to countries with more lax copyright laws, such as russia, china, parts of africa, south america, the list goes on...
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