AVCHD-DVD produced by Powerdirector works but multiAVCHD doesn't

[Panash]

multiAVCHD shows a lot of promise (it doesn't re-render video which puts it head & shoulders above PowerDirector which does ).

However multiAVCHD AVCHD-DVD discs don't work in my Panasonic BDP-130 whereas PD AVCHD-DVD discs do! I've used CDburnerXP to burn the filing system for both using UDF so that eliminates the burning software.

Both directory structures seem much the same, even when examining the meta-files using a hexadecimal editor & I've tried both strict & normal modes (I do believe these are something to do with menus but to simply prove the software I'm not using a menu (until I get it going that is).

I know the player can play the video files because it will play them if I navigate directly to them using the players file browser.

Any ideas? I'd love to use this software instead of PD.

Paul

[Baldrick]

Are all your video sources blu-ray compliant? The files that multiavchd does not reconvert. Check them with mediainfo. Especially the frame size/resolution (see https://www.videohelp.com/hd#tech ).

Because you may still be able to play the files using the navigator but they might have to be 100% blu-ray compliant for the blu-ray structure. And PowerDirector may reconvert them to correct format.

[Panash]

I was under the impression that one of multiAVCHD's 'key selling points' was its ability to accept almost anything (within reason; I've tried several different x264/AC3 files)

Something which indicates a fault in one of the metafiles is that if I substitute my original file in place of the PowerDirector's re-rendered version, the BlueRay player recognises the disc as AVCHD-DVD but refuses to play the video (not surprisingly as the meta files probably carry frame rate, size information).

I could try getting multiAVCHD to re-render but I would have thought that the program would have flagged this up if this was required.

[Baldrick]

Yes. That's one of multiavchd "key selling points"....but it doesn't mean it will work on all blu-ray players.

Try rerender and see if it works at all with multiavchd.

[Panash]

I've just remembered a key point which clearly identifies the problem being with the meta-files; after a PowerDirector AVCHD-DVD disc is inserted, the player actually acknowledges that it recognises the disc as AVCHD-DVD by momentarily flashing "AVCHD-DVD" in the top right hand corner. This is true with or without a valid video file in the stream directory. With a multiAVCHD disc it goes straight to the home menu.

I might post the meta files and a copy/paste of this thread straight to the author.

[johns0]

If any files you load into multiavchd aren't blu-ray/avchd compliant they will be highlighted in red in the compilation window and when you click on the compilation window it will show you the incorrect features in red text.

You can re-encode the non compliant files with uncropmkv.

[Panash]

Cheers, I'll look out for that if I get it working (because I want to). However I don't remember the filename having a red font (I would have seen that immediately) & an mp4 file was successfully remuxed to m2ts file by multiAVCHD which seems to indicate that the file was compatible.

The issue is with the meta files because the behaviour is displayed with or without the video files present in the stream folder.

[Panash]

Loading file structure into BDedit - multiAVCHD appears to generate two errors but movieObject.bdmv does exist in the directory structure

[Panash]

It's tsMuxeR which has the 'problem'. Single file authored refuses to play as well. I will continue to chip away at this.

[Panash]

I can succesfully burn the AVCHD structure directly from my Canon Legria R505. The disc is immediately recognised correctly as AVCHD (but with a slightly different menu).

Taking the mts file directly from the card (which the above test demonstrates compatibility) & using TSmuxeR, I can't play the file. This points the finger straight to TSmuxeR as the source of the incompatibility.

[Panash]

VSO can create the necessary files in the correct format (but you get an annoying splash screen)

http://www.vso-software.fr/products/avchd-editor/avchd-editor.php

It has drop downs for AVCHD long, short, BD & BD complient so it seems easy so why doesn't TSMuxeR get it right?

[Baldrick]

Maybe try an older version of tsmuxer and see if it makes any difference with single file authoring:
https://www.videohelp.com/software/tsMuxeR/old-versions#download


( forum testing: Splash should not create a link to mirillis splash...okey...)

[Panash]

will do.

The vso software does seem to be able to accept & correct TSMuxeR authored AVCHD directory structures so it may be able to be a final polishing tool for projects created by multiAVCHD - I'll have to pipe clean the flow next week. Not out of the woods yet because there are sound & aspect ratio issues that have appeared which I need to chase down.

[Panash]

I'd love to know where in the binary the differences are though - could go straight to it without an intermediate step or contact the authors & get the code altered.

[Panash]

Success! Authored Blu-ray disc in multiAVCHD & 'cleaned it up using VSO-AVCHD Editor. I had to author to BD - didn't seem to work if AVCHD-DVD as an intermediate step. I know it worked because I got the multiAVCHD splash screen at the end. Curiously I got a "copyright violation" message from the Bluray player.

Just got to learn how to use multiAVCHD now.

[Panash]

After lots & lots of experimenting I'm in a position to present some findings & draw some conclusions.

The package that can produce consistently playable & compatible AVCHD-DVD discs is Cyberlink's PowerDirector. Although the interface is clumsy & limited in scope it will produce a very compatible AVCHD-DVD that looks & feels like a DVD but with all the resolution of a BluRay disc. Its main drawback is the inconsistent way it decides to re-encode assets and the limited and quite poorly thought through user interface. The UI is easy to use at a superficial level but lacked really deep control of transitions etc. It refuses to accept x264 encoded material and some other sources without re-encoding. Sometimes it will accept its own encoded source material without re-encoding but I have yet to do an exhaustive test on what is & isn't accepted. I guess they can get this all correct because they have a critical mass of coders & relatively deep resources. Support of motion (video) menus is excellent.

Sony's DVD-Architect was better on the UI but had no native AVCHD-DVD mode. Some simple menu structures with a single play function could be 'converted' by VSO's AVCHDeditor AVCHD-DVD but more complex ones couldn't. I felt there was more control of transitions in DVDA than in PowerDirector. It would accept its own encoded h264 material but insisted on re-encoding x264.

multiAVCHD doesn't produce native Panasonic compatible AVCHD-DVD discs. It is possible to 'convert' them to being compatible through VSO AVCHDeditor but menus seem problematic (I think this may be a limitation in VSO). Menu creation is difficult & unintuitive and it doesn't seem possible to alter button position (X-Y) in the simpler menus. The XMB & carousel menus looked really nice but totally refused to play on my Panny even if I directly accessed the m2ts file directly in the file navigator. I do have this idea that fancy video work should be done in a video editor & imported by an authoring package and not created by the authoring package. It's not difficult in most editors & gives much more flexibility in production. Will accept almost anything, even non standard resolutions.

Why oh why won't the big players accept x264? It almost feels like a conspiracy against public domain software.

The gold standard in DVD authoring seems to be Mediachance DVD-lab which I played with a while ago. If that did AVCHD-DVD I might consider it. The fact that they haven't extended the product must indicate that although AVCHD-DVD & BluRay are probably simple, they are kept secret.

[TimA-C]

Just to throw a dampener on your findings, Panash, but I use MultiAVCHD to make a lot of AVCHD DVDs to play on my Panasonic DMP-BDT120 player. If you feed MultiAVCHD with compatible files then there's no problem with the resulting AVCHD disk. Sadly I usually have to re-encode most of my HD stuff either to remove a channel logo or to fit on to a DVD and, again, depending upon what I'm doing with the video, I tend to use either VideoRedo5 or Vidcoder to do this. I have recently started playing around with Hybrid and MeGui but so far with only mixed results.

I've found that I seem to get better results feeding .m2ts files to MultiAVCHD but that might well just be wishful thinking! I test in VLC Media player by right-clicking on main window, open media, open disc..., select Blu-ray and untick 'No disc menus' and then browse to the folders created by MultiAVCHD on my hard drive. If everything works in VLC then it seems to work in my Panasonic Bluray player. Then I burn to Verbatim DVDs at 8x writing speed or less with Imgburn.

Just to let you know that MultiAVCHD can re-encode media if a file is either in an incompatible format or just too large to fit on the chosen type of target media, but whenever I've tried this in the past I've had audio sync issues, so I tend to do any editing and/or encoding outside of MultiAVCHD and just use it to author. It's not the most intuitive piece of software and sometimes it's limitations are bloomin' frustrating but it is worth getting to grips with unless you want to spend on a commercial product that may well come with it's own frustrations and limitations. (I'm thinking of you, TMPGEnc Authoring Works 5! Don't get me wrong, it's great for authoring my DVDs but ALWAYS wants to re-encode everything H264.)

[Panash]

Might just be a detail difference between the firmware of the BDT120 & BDT130 & it demonstrates what a minefield it all is. What I did demonstrate to myself is that multiAVCHD AVCHD-DVD @ 1280x720 25p didn't play natively on my BDT130 but did on a friend's Sony but did play on my BDT130 after re-authoring with VSO AVCHD editor. This demonstrates that there is a fundamental issue with multiAVCHD (or more specifically TSMuxeR) that makes it not universally compatible at the binary level. PowerDirector produces a universally compatible AVCHD-DVD natively every time - except that it re-encoded every time)

This is just how I found it.

(I used the Just Eat 'Chicken Madras' advert downloaded from youtube as source material)

[Panash]

Just to clarify, DVDA does not re-encode the output from Sony Movie Studio & neither does PowerDirector re-encode its own edited output but they do re-encode any h264 from other sources, which is a shame really because x264 takes some beating.

The re-encoding includes Cyberlinks "Smart Video Rendering Technology" (SVRT) which does unnecessarily re-encode x264.

[Panash]

Sony DVDA -> isobuster -> VSO AVCHD Editor -> SD card or DVD -> Panasonic BD130 is rock solid now; works every time even with quite complex menus.

[sneaker]

Why oh why won't the big players accept x264? It almost feels like a conspiracy against public domain software.

They do. x264 has been tested with a number of "professional" authoring tools including DVD-Architect. Most likely you did not follow all the rules on creating BluRay compatible x264 encodes.

http://www.x264bluray.com
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=154533