Looking for Noise Reduction Suggestion/Settings

[jaysodyssey]

I would probably leave it alone noise wise and solely focus on color (but it is probably too bad to correct it in a meaningful way).

You really hate the 3300K range don't you! Should I just throw those filter plates out?

[jaysodyssey]

heh heh

[newpball]

I would probably leave it alone noise wise and solely focus on color (but it is probably too bad to correct it in a meaningful way).

You really hate the 3300K range don't you! Should I just throw those filter plates out?

Well just look at the attempted white balanced version I attached in the previous message and compare it.

[jaysodyssey]

did u look at my new version?

[jagabo]

I used this simple script in AviSynth:

ffVideoSource("NRTEST_DSC_0756.MOV") 
Trim(361,673) # ~same frames as the clip in the other video
ColorYUV(levels="PC->TV") # pc.601 to rec.601
Spline36Resize(856,480) # about the same size, mod8 x mod16
TemporalDegrain(SAD1=400, SAD2=300, sigma=16) # defaults

That much smoothing with TemporalDegrain() might cause too much loss of detail and ghosting in high motion shots. I usually tone it down from there (smaller values, 1/4 to 1/2 the above values).

I didn't address colors (aside from the pc.601 to rec.601 conversion).

CRF=15 encode (about the same bitrate as the other video) with x264:

[jaysodyssey]

I cannot really tell it SEEMS like its less grain
I should get AVISynth, is this a good starting point?

"I didn't address colors (aside from the pc.601 to rec.601 conversion)."

What language is that LOL

[jagabo]

Less grain, less chroma noise, more detail retained.

[jaysodyssey]

How do you arrive at those settings?, would they work for all footage shot from the camera, as a "template" , or is it dependent on the shot?

[newpball]

I didn't address colors (aside from the pc.601 to rec.601 conversion).

Sorry for being a pest jagabo, but what would be the point in converting?

[jaysodyssey]

Sorry for being a pest jagabo, but what would be the point in converting?

Also could be pest, but what did you think of my new colour version?

[jagabo]

Also could be pest, but what did you think of my new colour version?

Given that the woman is largely lit by the laptop screen she becomes purplish if you go for a full white balance on the background. I think you struck a reasonable compromise, keeping something closer to normal skin tones. Unless that's not what you wanted!

How do you arrive at those settings?

I just used the default settings (if you don't specify values you will get those default values). I included them so you could see which values have the largest effect on noise reduction.

would they work for all footage shot from the camera, as a "template" , or is it dependent on the shot?

You'll probably want to use lower settings for motion shots, or cleaner shots.

[jaysodyssey]

What is weird is this guy did not have any noise, and he is using the same lens I did

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5znGcbvBusg

[jaysodyssey]

In a little while I am going to shoot a clip on all ISO at 1080P at 24 fps to show you guys what I am seeing, then maybe we can see whats going on

Ill import the clips into my NLE and NOT transcode them, then you can watch them all at once, Ill keep shutter, exposure , and lighting the same though all clips

[newpball]

In a little while I am going to shoot a clip on all ISO at 1080P at 24 fps to show you guys what I am seeing, then maybe we can see whats going on

Ill import the clips into my NLE and NOT transcode them, then you can watch them all at once, Ill keep shutter, exposure , and lighting the same though all clips

Great thing.

I always advice people once they get a camera to experiment with it, see what it can and cannot do.

ISO, aperture, shutter speed, after awhile those things become second nature and your big toe can already tell you if you are under or over. But it takes time to do it! Same with manual focus, once it becomes second nature you would never want auto focus, unless perhaps when you are chased by a lion and still want your camera out to shoot, you never know you might survive and get the shot of the year even if it is in auto focus!

[hello_hello]

Of course some of those folks who like overly sharpened cartoonized videos will love noise suppression.

Is newpball talking about imaginary "folks" again?

[jaysodyssey]

Hey everyone sorry i took so long getting back to the thread, I am still packing for my huge trip

this test video was done tonight, maybe we can move closer to figuring out where the temporal noise is coming from

video shot on a 18-55 Nikkor lens

[LMotlow]

Your sample looks re-encoded to me, and the bitrate is too low for the video you're working with. There are low bitrate compression artifacts all over the place, not just "noise". Blacks are badly crushed. I note your narrative sez you used "high quality" setting? ? ? You also said you're shooting at 1080p ? ? This sample isn't 1080p.

It's not the lens that causes the grainy garbage you're looking at. The cleaner sample from "the other" guy has to do with the way it's processed, not with the lens he used. Seems to me like a lot of the noise in your ISOTEST is caused by underexposure and a low bitrate. Not a good idea with consumer cams.

[jaysodyssey]

Your sample looks re-encoded to me,

Thanks for the reply, as was CLEARLY stated in the video the sample was NOT transcoded (reencoded in anyway) you are seeing it straight from the camera

thanks

[LMotlow]

The narrative in your video states that you recorded 1080p. 1280x720 is not 1080p. Is your narration not correct? You also managed to underexposed by a wide margin. Not only can crushed darks and suppressed midtones be clearly seen by viewing, but a histogram easily shows the problem.

If your "highest quality" setting gives you less than 6MBbps for 720p HD video, something is wrong with your camera. I realize you were changing the ISO, but the sample at all ISO's is very low quality and clearly displays nasty high compression artifacts.

[jaysodyssey]

Ill double check it again in a bit

[jaysodyssey]

Ok I checked and your right it changed the output in the NLE export

Here is a clip from the camera directly, its native material straight out of the nikon D3200

thanks

[poisondeathray]

uggghh my eyes!

Get some lights already!

Shoot a bright daylight clip and if you have noise, it's probably a defective camera . Try resetting it (look at the manual), and white / black balancing it (look at the manual)



There is a bit of learning curve to using avisynth. What NLE are you using? There might be some plugins you can use for it. Neat video is quite good at reducing this type of noise, and is easier to use for most people than using/learning avisynth

[jaysodyssey]

Hey all, in reference to poisondeathray ,

I have not tried this camera or lens in broad daylight, I will do that tomorrow. My NLE is called lightworks, its very powerful but concentrates on speed not on NR so much. I thought of resetting the camera. i saw a tutorial online that although aimed at canons suggested certain settings for dslr when using video

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w8BzeZEGEYY

I guess the camera could be damaged, but it takes beautiful photos and all functions seem to be intact

I want to reiterate to everyone that the docu I am going to film is a very TINY crew on a limited (non exisitent) budget, and I am trying to make it work on what we have, I thank you all for your help. I leave for overseas sunday so the time to mess with this is running out

I also noticed something strange the other day. If I am in the movie settings for the d3200 there is a setting called manual movie mode as the last setting, if that is ON and the camera is set at IS0 100-800 the viewfinder shows a dark image. I do not have history with this camera so I can only guess it is POSSIBLE that when manual movie mode is OFF the camera is forcing an ISO no matter what I have dialed in, which would explain why the temporal noise never changed no matter what setting I had it on

I only wish a Nikon guru would drop by this thread

thanks again

[poisondeathray]

I hope your limited budget included a pro license for lightworks, because the free version is limited to 720p output

The 1st MOV seems to be a bit noisier than it should be, even with those lighting conditions. A typical DSLR would have less noise in those conditions. But that noise is manageable with avisynth or any number of other approaches

[jaysodyssey]

I hope your limited budget included a pro license for lightworks, because the free version is limited to 720p output

Yeah I saw how they threw that carrot on the stick at everyone, and also how they promised to make it open source "someday", but that day never came

I am impressed by the program, the crippling of the most needed feature is not something I am impressed with however

As for 720P since the webisodes will only be on youtube and the website nothing more will ever be needed

the first clip is an export from LW, the second is straight from the camera, there is to much noise for me as a photographer to believe that is ISO 100, I may not be a videography expert, but I know ISO 100 when I see it, and I suspect its never shot ISO 100 yet

As for changing all this in post, that was what this thread was all about, but everyone took it to different places

My thought is shoot the footage, compose the edit, export, then clean in a plugin or stand alone NR filter?

[jaysodyssey]

I did not forget about this thread, I have once again been delayed on my trip to start shooting, hopefully this will give me time to research this, I have seen many videos on Vimeo & Youtube where they were using similar lens and the same D3200.

I might try posting on the youtube videos to see what they might have done different. I am also going to go outside in a little while and shoot a DAYLIGHT seen at all ISO's

Hopefully it will reveal something

[jaysodyssey]

Video test complete, as before I saw NO CHANGE in the snow (still do not have a name for it yet) HOWEVER I did notice that the area where the sky is real blue you can almost NOT see the "snow" but in the shadow areas its very present. Also backing up my thoughts that the ISO is not really ever changing is no matter what ISO I am on I see no change the "snow" , it neither gets better or worse.

Who Knows

[LMotlow]

Dude, either your camera's in trouble, or you're using some weird settings. The pic is underexposed. You have crushed darks and a chroma range that exceeds RGB 255. Why is the image so saturated with blue?. I realize that the scene you picked is horrible lighting for any kind of test, but as we say down home, "That dog don't act right." (Now you know where the song came from). It's just a strange, raw, ugly looking video. I don't even think you can save the dark details, they're as seriously crushed as those in your earlier tests. The "noise" is minimal here. It's the least of your problems.

On the other hand, those other glitches might not matter. So proceed at will.

[jaysodyssey]

Yikes that last post was anything but helpful. I AM very aware this camera has an issue, I just want to find out what that is!

thanks

[LMotlow]

Technically I don't know what the problem could be called. I don't see a terrific noise problem in that last scene. The noise in the darker lighted sample is kind of typical for that kind of camera and that kind of lighting. In both cases the main problem I see is under exposure. That alone can cause color and noise problems, in some areas of the image if not everywhere. The test scene in the last sample has a contrast range that's beyond the limits that most digital cameras can handle, but which a film camera could likely tolerate better. The under exposure could be a metering problem, or it could be more complicated like an encoder issue. In a case like the high contrast scene, you'd likely have to set your own exposure depending on whether you want dark detail, or mostly middle tones, and let other elements like the sky go nearly white as being less important.

I think you'll find that most consumer cameras have digital noise, mostly chroma noise, somewhere in the still images as well as in video. We see a lot of digital video shot for Tv that looks like the crew just pointed the camera and started shooting. But their setup procedure is a lot more complicated and shots are painstakingly planned in every way.

Sometimes underexposure or poor metering response is an in-camera power problem. Could be as simple as replacing a battery.