I'm trying to send a film I made to discmakers.com, so they can make around 25 DVDs for me. They told me I need to send them the TS_Video and TS_Audio files, which I can create in Toast. I have Toast 11 Titanium 11.0.2. I drag my .mov file to Toast with quality on "Best" Destination: Disc Image. Once it is done, it creates a .Toast file. When I open the toast file with disc utility, there are 6 files in the Video_TS folder, only one of which is my movie, "VTS_01_1.VOB" The problem I'm facing is that the quality on the new file is terrible compared to the original mp4, and it seems that the image is also smaller. Is there a way I can fix this, or another program I can use? Also, the TS_Audio folder is empty, which I've been told is fine.
Any help would be greatly appreciated.
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How long is your film ? (running time duration? )
Regular DVD's (as in DVD-video) are standard definition only, so if your original MP4 or MOV was an HD source, it's going to look worse on a DVD
Video_TS is the only one actually used, the other folder is supposed to be empty -
You want to send discmakers a properly authored DVD. Use toast to burn a copy of your authored disc to high quality media and send that disc to discmakers. Test it on a standalone player before sending it. "VTS_01_1.VOB" is NOT your movie, it is PART of a DVD.
FWIW, I've always had excellent results with them using the method described above. (Though I use Encore to author and imgburn to burn.)Last edited by smrpix; 7th Aug 2014 at 16:55.
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mediainfo is free , at least the one not from the mac app store
mac version
http://mediaarea.net/en/MediaInfo/Download/Mac_OS -
The Original .Toast File:
General
Complete name : /Volumes/LaCie 1TB/BITB DVD New/Beauty in the Breakdown.toast
Format : MPEG Video
Format version : Version 2
File size : 1.03 GiB
Overall bit rate mode : Variable
Video
Format : MPEG Video
Format version : Version 2
Format profile : Main@Main
Format settings, BVOP : Yes
Format settings, Matrix : Default
Format settings, GOP : M=3, N=15
Bit rate mode : Variable
Width : 720 pixels
Height : 480 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16:9
Frame rate : 29.970 fps
Standard : NTSC
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0
Bit depth : 8 bits
Compression mode : Lossy
The VTS_01_1.VOB File:
General
Complete name : /Volumes/Beauty in the Breakdown/VIDEO_TS/VTS_01_1.VOB
Format : MPEG-PS
File size : 909 MiB
Duration : 17mn 38s
Overall bit rate mode : Variable
Overall bit rate : 7 203 Kbps
Video
ID : 224 (0xE0)
Format : MPEG Video
Format version : Version 2
Format profile : Main@Main
Format settings, BVOP : Yes
Format settings, Matrix : Default
Format settings, GOP : M=3, N=15
Duration : 17mn 38s
Bit rate mode : Variable
Bit rate : 6 867 Kbps
Maximum bit rate : 8 000 Kbps
Width : 720 pixels
Height : 480 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16:9
Frame rate : 29.970 fps
Standard : NTSC
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0
Bit depth : 8 bits
Scan type : Interlaced
Scan order : Bottom Field First
Compression mode : Lossy
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.663
Time code of first frame : 00:00:00:00
Time code source : Group of pictures header
Stream size : 866 MiB (95%)
Audio
ID : 189 (0xBD)-128 (0x80)
Format : AC-3
Format/Info : Audio Coding 3
Mode extension : CM (complete main)
Format settings, Endianness : Big
Muxing mode : DVD-Video
Duration : 17mn 38s
Bit rate mode : Constant
Bit rate : 192 Kbps
Channel(s) : 2 channels
Channel positions : Front: L R
Sampling rate : 48.0 KHz
Bit depth : 16 bits
Compression mode : Lossy
Stream size : 24.2 MiB (3%)
Menu -
Bit rate : 6 867 Kbps
Maximum bit rate : 8 000 Kbps
Also was this a theatrical film or digitial film equivalent, shot 24p ?
Where is the mediainfo for the original, original video ? (The MP4 or MOV before toast) -
Oh, Sorry. Here's the info for the original .mov
General
Complete name : /Volumes/LaCie 1TB/Beauty in the Breakdown Final Cut.mov
Format : MPEG-4
Format profile : QuickTime
Codec ID : qt
File size : 13.3 GiB
Duration : 17mn 38s
Overall bit rate mode : Variable
Overall bit rate : 108 Mbps
Encoded date : UTC 2014-04-23 11:31:45
Tagged date : UTC 2014-04-23 17:32:00
Writing library : aapl
©TIM : 00:00:00:00
©TSC : 24000
©TSZ : 1001
Video
ID : 1
Format : ProRes
Format version : Version 0
Codec ID : apcn
Duration : 17mn 38s
Bit rate mode : Variable
Bit rate : 107 Mbps
Width : 1 920 pixels
Height : 1 080 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16:9
Frame rate mode : Constant
Frame rate : 23.976 fps
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:2
Scan type : Progressive
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 2.144
Stream size : 13.1 GiB (99%)
Writing library : Apple
Language : English
Encoded date : UTC 2014-04-23 11:31:45
Tagged date : UTC 2014-04-23 11:31:45
Color primaries : BT.709
Transfer characteristics : BT.709
Matrix coefficients : BT.709
Audio
ID : 2
Format : PCM
Format settings, Endianness : Little
Format settings, Sign : Signed
Codec ID : sowt
Duration : 17mn 38s
Bit rate mode : Constant
Bit rate : 1 536 Kbps
Channel(s) : 2 channels
Channel positions : Front: L R
Sampling rate : 48.0 KHz
Bit depth : 16 bits
Stream size : 194 MiB (1%)
Language : English
Encoded date : UTC 2014-04-23 11:31:45
Tagged date : UTC 2014-04-23 11:31:45
Other
ID : 3
Type : Time code
Format : QuickTime TC
Duration : 17mn 38s
Time code of first frame : 00:00:00:00
Time code settings : Striped
Language : English
Encoded date : UTC 2014-04-23 11:31:45
Tagged date : UTC 2014-04-23 11:31:45 -
Yes, well prores 1920x1080 10bit 422 source. The fact is the DVD is NEVER going to be remotely close in quality. You need blu-ray to get similar quality, at least the same resolution
The other point I was trying to make was this is a 23.976 ("24p") source, so it should be done using soft pulldown, encoded progressive. That's the way Hollywood does it. The way toast is doing it is encoding interlaced with 25% more repeat fields (that's effectively an additional 25% bitrate wasted)
Will they accept your prores source directly ? I haven't used them, but it's worth asking. There is a higher chance they'll do it right compared to toast which for sure doesn't do it optimallyLast edited by poisondeathray; 7th Aug 2014 at 23:49.
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I just made an edit - see above. Check to see if they will accept your prores source directly . Some places do.
or is there a list somewhere on their webpage that details what they will accept ? -
They can take my original .mov file, but then it will cost me an extra $200 for them to do the extra work. That's why they told me to send a TS_Video file. If you know if another program I can use besides toast that will give me the best quality, I'm up for that as well. BluRay does make more sense also.
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Yeah, for an 18min-only clip, you could easily have done a, say, ~9200kbps CBR or 9000kbps AVG+9600kbps MAX VBR encoding.
And Toast's encoder has always been pretty mediocre. If you don't already have Compressor available, I'd suggest trying out ffmpegX.
Also, IIWY, I would create not just the VIDEO_TS folder structure, but a whole actual ISO disc image. I'm confident Discmakers can accept that format (even though they don't specifically mention it). Most preferable would have been a DDP image file, but Toast doesn't do those (only DVDStudioPro & Encore, for Macs).
Scott -
Right, the extra fee
But won't they charge you extra for sending the a blu-ray as well? (since you're doing a short run of DVD's not BD's, so they'll have to re-encode it, re-author it = more work)
I don' t know precisely how to do this on a Mac, but for certain those are 2 areas that will help improve quality for a DVD 1) higher bitrate , at least closer to the maximum allowed 2) progressive encoding with 3:2 soft pulldown -
How do I create an ISO disc image? And I don't have Compressor or ffmpegx. I also Don't have DVDStudioPro or Encore. I've heard a lot of people talk about Encore. Is it still being Sold? I also have no idea what a DDP image file is. Sorry, this is all very new to me. I just need someone to step me through getting my original .mov file to a format discmakers.com can take and with the best quality.
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If I send them a .mov file, they will charge me an extra $200 on top of whatever is costs to create the short run of DVD's or BluRay's. If I send them a TS_Video file, they wont charge me the extra $200. I was only doing DVD's because it's cheaper, but I can probably do BluRay's instead. If I wanted to convert my .mov to a filetype that can be burned onto a BluRay, is it still a TS_Video file, or is it something else?
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From a simple eHow search:
Things You'll Need
Toast file
Instructions
Disk Utility
- Double-click the toast image file (.toast) to mount it in Finder.
- Open Disk Utility. Select Go > Utilities from the Finder's menu bar.
- Highlight the mounted drive directly below and indented under the .toast file within Disk Utility's sidebar.
- Select "New Image" from the navigation toolbar. Type a name and select a save destination for the new file. Select "DVD/CD Master" from the Format drop-down menu. Select "OK" to begin the conversion process.
- Open the folder containing the newly converted image file. You will notice it has a .CDR extension. Double-click the text of the file to edit the name. Delete the ".cdr" extension, replace it with ".iso" A warning will pop-up asking if you want to change the file association from .cdr to .iso, select "Use .iso" Your toast file is now an ISO.
Encore is still sold (as part of the PP CS6 Download capability available to CC subscribers), though what you're paying for is PP CC (a decent value there, too).
Don't worry about DDP for now, especially if they (DiscMakers) will take an ISO (which you CAN make).
How did you make the film to begin with (editing app)? How did it come to be in ProRes? The app that did that might be the app that can do more of these other things you need done...
BTW, stop calling it a TS_video file, please. The "VIDEO_TS" folder is the specified folder that DVD-Video compliant video/audio/subtitle, menu & navigation files go into. The video itself is contained (along with other items) within the "VIDEO_TS.VOB" or one or more of the "VTS_##_X.VOB" files. But they should be taken TOGETHER AS A WHOLE UNIT. (see the "What is DVD"? section at this site). That's why I recommend the ISO. So, you make a *.toast file & convert it to .ISO. Or go a different route with ffmpegX, etc.
Scott -
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No offense taken. Just thought that:
1. When continually used incorrectly like that, it casts a worse light on your apparent abilities.
2. It can end up confusing other newbies who may later happen upon this thread in search of a similar problem
3. Part of "videohelp" is setting you on the right path to understanding (of both nomenclature & tech process workings)
If you are referring to using the "*.toast -> *.ISO image conversion", then YES. As long as Toast can output a validly authored Blu-ray image in *.toast format (or *.dmg) the abovementioned utility can convert it to an ISO that is both burnable & mountable/readable.
If you are referring to the ability of Toast to create BD (aka "Blu-ray Disc") images vs. DVD-Video images, it would only do so with either the Supplemental (and $$) plugin, or using the Pro ($$) version of Toast 11/12. Again, there are other, perhaps better, options on Mac. But no many. Mac is no friend to Blu-ray (that's their official stance!).
Scott -
Okay, so I called them to confirm the file types again, and she said with Blu-Ray, I would have to send them a burned Blu-Ray disc. I don't have a Blu-Ray Burner, so that's out. She said with DVD i can send them a Video_TS folder, or udf, ISO, DDP, or an IMG file. Would any of those other options be better? I followed the steps you posted to create the ISO file, but I'm just worried, because when I watch the "VTS_01_1.VOB" file from what toast created, the quality looks like shit. Is it possible that it will looks better once it's burned onto a DVD?
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If it already looks like shit to you, it'll look like shit to (most likely) everyone else, too.*
I already said Toast is a mediocre encoder. Don't use it for that. Encode your files elsewhere (e.g. ffmpegX), then add the already-DVDVideo-compliant files to Toast to author (hopefully, it's not so stupid as to re-encode). Or bypass Toast altogether by going the Encore route.
First make sure your title is encoded correctly to your quality standards. Then author to DVD-Video specifications. Then burn (to disc or to discimage file).
Scott
*Exception: because of your player/display combination, interlaced video might be looking like crap on your PC, but burned to actual disc and played in an actual player and shown on an actual TV, it might look OK. YMMV.