VideoHelp Forum
+ Reply to Thread
Results 1 to 19 of 19
Thread
  1. Member themaster1's Avatar
    Join Date: Nov 2006
    Location: France
    Search Comp PM
    Is there a good avi to gif software out there ? Or maybe there is a another animated images format other than gif that i'm not aware of ?? (gif is so 90's...)
    Let me know please ! (virtualdub is not good for this)
    Quote Quote  
  2. Member
    Join Date: Sep 2007
    Location: Canada
    Search Comp PM
    Originally Posted by themaster1 View Post
    Is there a good avi to gif software out there ? Or maybe there is a another animated images format other than gif that i'm not aware of ?? (gif is so 90's...)
    Let me know please ! (virtualdub is not good for this)

    apng (animated png) is lossless, full 8bit / channel color palette (not crappy 256 colors), but only supported by a few browsers like firefox , opera (IE doesn't) . Obviously large filesizes compared to gif
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/APNG



    For gif, photoshop is probably the one of the better ones . You have many options to adjust filesize vs. quality, dithering algorithms, compression . Unfortunately not free

    Gimp can do it, with floyd steinberg dithering, but filesize is larger than photoshop produced gifs at similar quality
    Quote Quote  
  3. VirtualDub's GIF export uses a fixed color palette without dithering. That results in severe banding of smooth gradients. There's a trick you can use that will help though. First save the sequence you want as an uncompressed video file. Then use VirtualDub's Tools -> Create Palettized AVI to make another AVI of that sequence. That AVI will have an optimized palette and dithering. Then open that palettized AVI and export as GIF from VirtualDub. The dithering will be preserved.

    Direct export as GIF:
    Name:  direct.gif
Views: 411
Size:  162.1 KB

    Palettized intermediate:
    Name:  palettized.gif
Views: 410
Size:  322.7 KB
    Last edited by jagabo; 7th Jul 2014 at 18:23.
    Quote Quote  
  4. Member
    Join Date: Sep 2007
    Location: Canada
    Search Comp PM
    But vdub "create palletized AVI" creates a non selective, noisy dither . But at least it's not as bad as some, where the static backgroud has a alternating/flickering pattern as well,.

    A single shade of "grey" - like the "grey" RGB 64,64,64 background shouldn't require dithering. Only when there are transitions or "shades" of grey or colors should be dithered. That non selectivity means excessively large filesizes

    162KB vdub gif
    322KB vdub palettized gif
    259KB ps seletive pattern dither gif

    Name:  ps_selective_patterndither_2.gif
Views: 416
Size:  259.8 KB
    Last edited by poisondeathray; 7th Jul 2014 at 20:59.
    Quote Quote  
  5. How much does Photoshop cost? Yes, the VirtualDub method was a cheap trick.
    Quote Quote  
  6. Member
    Join Date: Sep 2007
    Location: Canada
    Search Comp PM
    PS CS2 was actually free a while back, legit from Adobe server. You just needed to register an account

    Here is APNG . But you can't see it animate in some browsers

    (220KB only - usually filesize is larger compared to gif, but it depends on type of content)
    Name:  apng.png
Views: 383
Size:  220.1 KB
    Quote Quote  
  7. Member Cornucopia's Avatar
    Join Date: Oct 2001
    Location: Deep in the Heart of Texas
    Search Comp PM
    I was always partial to MS Gif Animator. It's free, can work with transparency and has custom palette support.

    Scott
    "When will the rhetorical questions end?!" - George Carlin
    Quote Quote  
  8. Member
    Join Date: Nov 2002
    Location: United States
    Search Comp PM
    Originally Posted by Cornucopia View Post
    I was always partial to MS Gif Animator. It's free, can work with transparency and has custom palette support.

    Scott
    I used to be until I tried Gif Movie Gear. I paid $12 for it back in the day. I think it's $40 now (version 1 and 2 were free I think if you can still find them). It accepts Adobe PSD files and some AVI files. Setting to preserve 24 bit color. Live Edit allows you to edit frame with Photoshop. Outputs compressed and non-compressed AVI, layered Photoshop PSD, GIF, BMP, PNG (image, filmstrip or animated), JPEG, ICO (Windows icon files), ANI (Windows animated icons), and CUR (Windows cursor files).
    Quote Quote  
  9. Member racer-x's Avatar
    Join Date: Mar 2003
    Location: 3rd Rock from the Sun
    Search Comp PM
    Speaking of animated gifs, here's a little something I made in gimp using IWarp. Yes I know I'm a sick pup.....
    Attached Images  
    Last edited by racer-x; 11th Jul 2014 at 14:10. Reason: Smoother version
    The memories of a man in his old age, are the deeds of the man in his prime.......
    Quote Quote  
  10. Member
    Join Date: Sep 2007
    Location: Canada
    Search Comp PM
    haha racer-x GIF boob animations used to be so popular! But now with youtube, video embedding, broadband. GIF's are like the dodo bird ... The art of GIF making is lost

    What makes or breaks a gif in terms of quality/filesize ratio is the processing options, pallete, dithering algorithms, optimizations used. What works well for some types of content might not be appropriate for others - so it's important to have options.

    A free gif optimization program is gifsicle (commandline only). It can reduce the filesize of most gifs, but for already optimized ones like those produced in photoshop, the filesize actually gets larger



    Here are some tests with an animation I did a few years ago (don't take the content too seriously, it was just for fun ) . It's primarily greyscale on a static gradient background, so predisposed to banding as you can see with vdub's default export. But because of those same factors it will also benefit from using a limited palette, adaptive dithering . Some programs like ffmpeg barely have any options , so they suffer immensely. Terrible GIF quality

    gimp 128color, floyd-steinberg 990KB, gifsicle optimized =>961KB
    Name:  gimp_128color_floydsteinberg_gifsicle_optimized.gif
Views: 321
Size:  961.9 KB


    ffmpeg 978KB
    Name:  ffmpeg.gif
Views: 319
Size:  978.9 KB


    photoshop 128color, adaptive 50% diffusion, lossy5 214KB
    Name:  ps_50%diffusion_128color_lossy5.gif
Views: 320
Size:  214.2 KB


    vdub default 241KB
    Name:  vdub.gif
Views: 319
Size:  241.6 KB
    Quote Quote  
  11. Member racer-x's Avatar
    Join Date: Mar 2003
    Location: 3rd Rock from the Sun
    Search Comp PM
    Thanks for that. I tried it out and it produced better quality and smaller file size I think:
    Attached Images    
    The memories of a man in his old age, are the deeds of the man in his prime.......
    Quote Quote  
  12. Member
    Join Date: Sep 2007
    Location: Canada
    Search Comp PM
    ahhhh so ffmpeg does have control over dither according to that 1st link by pandy with sws_dither

    Code:
    ‘sws_dither’
    
        Set the dithering algorithm. Accepts one of the following values. Default value is ‘auto’.
    
        ‘auto’
    
            automatic choice
        ‘none’
    
            no dithering
        ‘bayer’
    
            bayer dither
        ‘ed’
    
            error diffusion dither
        ‘a_dither’
    
            arithmetic dither, based using addition
        ‘x_dither’
    
            arithmetic dither, based using xor (more random/less apparent patterning that a_dither).



    For reference, the other free gif utility , gifsicle link
    http://www.lcdf.org/gifsicle/
    http://www.lcdf.org/gifsicle/man.html
    Quote Quote  
  13. Member racer-x's Avatar
    Join Date: Mar 2003
    Location: 3rd Rock from the Sun
    Search Comp PM
    This is the string I used in Aviutl ffmpeg export plugin:

    Code:
    -vf scale=640:-1:sws_dither=a_dither -r 10 -pix_fmt rgb8 -loop 0
    The memories of a man in his old age, are the deeds of the man in his prime.......
    Quote Quote  
  14. Member
    Join Date: Sep 2007
    Location: Canada
    Search Comp PM
    Same animation with ffmpeg sws_dither options


    Looks like "auto" used error diffusion , the default one posted above (the seizure inducing flickering POS )

    ffmpeg_a_dither 77.3KB
    Name:  ffmpeg_a_dither.gif
Views: 288
Size:  77.3 KB


    ffmpeg_bayer.gif 66.4KB
    Name:  ffmpeg_bayer.gif
Views: 277
Size:  66.4 KB


    ffmpeg_x_dither.gif 88.7KB
    Name:  ffmpeg_x_dither.gif
Views: 281
Size:  88.8 KB



    These are still terrible for this type of animation IMO. At least the filesize is reduced substantially. But I'll check again if I did something wrong
    Quote Quote  
  15. Code:
    @ffmpeg -i %1 -vf "pp=hb/vb/dr/al|f/tmpnoise|4|4|4,decimate=cycle=2,decimate=cycle=2,scale=w=640:h=-1:sws_dither=a_dither:sws_flags=bicubic+accurate_rnd+full_chroma_inp+full_chroma_int,format=pix_fmts=rgb8,setsar=sar=1/1" -y %1_a_dither.gif
    Decimate usually works better than simple framerate conversion (in gif case)
    Quote Quote  
  16. Member
    Join Date: Sep 2007
    Location: Canada
    Search Comp PM
    Originally Posted by pandy View Post
    Code:
    @ffmpeg -i %1 -vf "pp=hb/vb/dr/al|f/tmpnoise|4|4|4,decimate=cycle=2,decimate=cycle=2,scale=w=640:h=-1:sws_dither=a_dither:sws_flags=bicubic+accurate_rnd+full_chroma_inp+full_chroma_int,format=pix_fmts=rgb8,setsar=sar=1/1" -y %1_a_dither.gif
    Decimate usually works better than simple framerate conversion (in gif case)


    Or you can use avs scripts for decimation, resizing operations, if ffmpeg is compiled with avisynth support

    I don't see a way to adjust per frame delays in ffmpeg, but you can with gifsicle
    Quote Quote  
  17. Member racer-x's Avatar
    Join Date: Mar 2003
    Location: 3rd Rock from the Sun
    Search Comp PM
    Another great use for ffmpeg
    Code:
    -vf scale=1920:-1:sws_dither=a_dither
    is for 3-D animations. I applied it on some 3-D animations I made with blender and it really helped eliminate banding, especially with jpeg sequences. I applied the filter and rendered them out to ProRes 4:2:2 and the results were great with little to no increase in file size.
    The memories of a man in his old age, are the deeds of the man in his prime.......
    Quote Quote  
  18. Originally Posted by poisondeathray View Post
    Or you can use avs scripts for decimation, resizing operations, if ffmpeg is compiled with avisynth support

    I don't see a way to adjust per frame delays in ffmpeg, but you can with gifsicle
    Yes but AVS can be slow, usually gif doesn't require such HQ, there is few option for gif in ffmpeg, delays perhaps are controlled indirectly by framerate - not sure - usually for something fancy i prefer to use imagemagick, for quick ffmpeg.
    Quote Quote