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  1. Hi,

    I often record videos using a C920 Logitech webcam and covert them to MPEG2 in Sony Vegas for faster editing.

    Vegas takes roughly 55 minutes to render a 35 min video into MPEG2.

    Here's the original file format:
    Input Type : AVC1(GVC)
    Input Size : 1280 x 720
    Output Type : YV12
    Output Size : 1280 x 720
    FrameRate(Frame/sec) : 0.00 (15.08)
    Size: 1.56 GB
    And here's the exported format after conversion:
    Constant bitrate: 15,000,000
    Input Type : MPEG2_VIDEO(GVC)
    Input Size : 1280 x 720
    Output Type : YV12
    Output Size : 1280 x 720
    FrameRate(Frame/sec) : 29.58 (29.97)
    Size: 735 MB


    Is there an encoder (preferably with GUI) or software that can export from MPEG4 to MPEG2 faster than Sony Vegas?
    Last edited by lonrot; 26th Jun 2014 at 18:19.
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  2. CCE

    Oh, sorry, CCE doesn't support HD resolutions. I don't think they have an equivalent encoder for HD MPEG 2.
    Last edited by jagabo; 26th Jun 2014 at 18:19.
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  3. Member
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    Originally Posted by jagabo View Post


    "normal" CCE version does SD resolution only

    CCD-HD is expensive and doesn't do MPEG2
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    HCenc supports HD resolutions but I can't guarantee it's faster. It might produce BETTER quality output though than Vegas.

    A general rule of thumb is to use twice the bit rate in MPEG-2 as H.264 to achieve the same quality.

    HCenc is free by the way.
    Last edited by jman98; 26th Jun 2014 at 18:21. Reason: Added last sentence
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  5. Originally Posted by jman98 View Post
    HCenc supports HD resolutions but I can't guarantee it's faster. It might produce BETTER quality output though than Vegas.

    A general rule of thumb is to use twice the bit rate in MPEG-2 as H.264 to achieve the same quality.

    HCenc is free by the way.
    Is there any other tool that can read MPEG4 files by itself? It seems HCenc only reads avs and d2v files.

    Thank you
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  6. HeEnc, via HcGUI and an AviSynth script decoding a 1280x720 AVC video, encodes at about 130 fps on my i5 2500K. So a 55 minute 24 fps source would take about 10 minutes. That was at the Normal preset (out of Fast, Normal, and Best) and single pass Constant Quantizer encoding.
    Last edited by jagabo; 26th Jun 2014 at 18:38.
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  7. Originally Posted by jagabo View Post
    HeEnc, via HcGUI and an AviSynth script decoding a 1280x720 AVC video, encodes at about 130 fps on my i5 2500K. So a 55 minute 24 fps source would take about 10 minutes. That was at the Normal preset (out of Fast, Normal, and Best) and single pass Constant Quantizer encoding.
    What to do you suggest for MP4 files with different frame rate?

    The original video is 15.08 FPS and with the command "ConvertFPS(29.970)" HCGUI estimates 3 hours to render.

    It's ideal that the converted video retains the same timing as the original.

    Here's the script I came up with:

    Code:
    ffmpegsource2("Video 38.mp4", atrack=-1)
    ConvertFPS(29.970)
    Also: How do you enable Constant Quantization? It's grayed out.
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    Why aren't you just recording to an editable format in the first place -- no conversion required?
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  9. Originally Posted by smrpix View Post
    Why aren't you just recording to an editable format in the first place -- no conversion required?
    Because the only software for the Webcam C920 (Logitech Quickcam) only has MPEG4 as an output format.
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  10. ConvertFPS() will generate in-between frames that are a blend of the two surrounding frames. That's OK at high frame rates but a low frame rates I think it will just look like double exposures. I'd use ChangeFPS() instead it will simply duplicate frames. If you don't need to retain the exact running time I'd use AssumeFPS(15000,1001) and ChageFPS(30000,1001).

    I don't know why you can't select Constant Quantization. You must have something else selected that disables the option.

    What CPU do you have?
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  11. Originally Posted by jagabo View Post
    ConvertFPS() will generate in-between frames that are a blend of the two surrounding frames. That's OK at high frame rates but a low frame rates I think it will just look like double exposures. I'd use ChangeFPS() instead it will simply duplicate frames. If you don't need to retain the exact running time I'd use AssumeFPS(15000,1001) and ChageFPS(30000,1001).

    I don't know why you can't select Constant Quantization. You must have something else selected that disables the option.

    What CPU do you have?
    Thanks, so ChangeFPS() will retain the same duration?

    The CPU is Intel Quad Core 6600 2.4 Ghz.
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  12. Originally Posted by lonrot View Post
    Thanks, so ChangeFPS() will retain the same duration?
    Yes.

    Originally Posted by lonrot View Post
    The CPU is Intel Quad Core 6600 2.4 Ghz.
    That should only take about twice as long to encode as my 2500K.
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  13. vanished El Heggunte's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by lonrot View Post
    How do you enable Constant Quantization? It's grayed out.
    Hmmmm, I wasn't aware that "1-pass VBR" (which I've never used BTW) disables the Constant Quantization checkbox.
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  14. Originally Posted by El Heggunte View Post
    Originally Posted by lonrot View Post
    How do you enable Constant Quantization? It's grayed out.
    Hmmmm, I wasn't aware that "1-pass VBR" (which I've never used BTW) disables the Constant Quantization checkbox.
    Yes! Now it says 20 minutes to render

    Bye the way I just realized that VirtualDub can also capture webcam video but apparently it cannot record in MPEG2 format
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    Originally Posted by lonrot View Post
    Bye the way I just realized that VirtualDub can also capture webcam video but apparently it cannot record in MPEG2 format
    matrox vfw codecs (free) has a MPEG2 I-frame option , will show up in vdub compression menu
    http://www.matrox.com/video/en/support/windows/vfw_software_codecs/downloads/softwares/version1.0/

    I-frame (instead of long GOP) will make it smoother/faster to edit in vegas , but larger filesizes, because there is no temporal compression

    Another technique is to use " proxy edit " (edit with low res versions so editing is "snappy", then swap in original full quality with final render)
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    Originally Posted by lonrot View Post
    Originally Posted by smrpix View Post
    Why aren't you just recording to an editable format in the first place -- no conversion required?
    Because the only software for the Webcam C920 (Logitech Quickcam) only has MPEG4 as an output format.
    You are not limited to the Logitech software as you noted earlier with vdub. There are many more options. You may even be able to capture directly into Vegas.
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  17. Video Restorer lordsmurf's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by poisondeathray View Post
    I-frame (instead of long GOP) will make it smoother/faster to edit in vegas , but larger filesizes, because there is no temporal compression
    True, I-frame only is better here, but anything not lossless/uncompressed is still laggy by comparison. I just convert to lossless first, as the NLE will re-encode on export anyway.
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    Originally Posted by lordsmurf View Post
    Originally Posted by poisondeathray View Post
    I-frame (instead of long GOP) will make it smoother/faster to edit in vegas , but larger filesizes, because there is no temporal compression
    True, I-frame only is better here, but anything not lossless/uncompressed is still laggy by comparison. I just convert to lossless first, as the NLE will re-encode on export anyway.


    But typical consumer setups cannot handle uncompressed video (although he's only 1280x720), but 1920x1080 requires ~100MB/s . Most people will run into IO bottlenecks before anything else

    There is a wide spectrum of decompression speeds / latency for "lossless" codecs . There are "speedy" lossless codecs (e.g. ut video, magic yuv) and glacially slow lossless, high compression , with temporal compression (e.g. ffv1)

    Something like cineform will usually out perform them all speedwise , especially at higher resolutions like 4k , but isn't mathematically lossless (close enough)

    And some NLE's smart render and not necessarily re-encode everything e.g. Vegas can smart render MPEG2 (but not the matrox variant, at least I haven't been able to "convince" it to )
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  19. Originally Posted by poisondeathray View Post
    Originally Posted by lonrot View Post
    Bye the way I just realized that VirtualDub can also capture webcam video but apparently it cannot record in MPEG2 format
    matrox vfw codecs (free) has a MPEG2 I-frame option , will show up in vdub compression menu
    http://www.matrox.com/video/en/support/windows/vfw_software_codecs/downloads/softwares/version1.0/

    I-frame (instead of long GOP) will make it smoother/faster to edit in vegas , but larger filesizes, because there is no temporal compression

    Another technique is to use " proxy edit " (edit with low res versions so editing is "snappy", then swap in original full quality with final render)
    The matrox vfw codec 1.0 version causes VirtualDub and Vegas to Crash when loading codecs.

    The version 2.0 works but crashes in VirtualDub right after clicking "Capture video":

    An out-of-bounds memory access (access violation) occurred in module 'mvcVfwMpeg2HD'...
    ...reading address 1DA1E000...
    ...while compressing frame 0 from 1d77b000 to 11ec9020 using codec "Matrox MPEG-2 I-frame HD" (VideoSequenceCompressor.cpp:619).
    Here are the settings:

    Video > Capture Pin:
    Color Space: RGB24
    Output Size: 1280 x 720
    Frame Rate: 30 FPS

    Video > Compression > Matrox MPEG-2 I-Frame HD:
    Frame Rate: 30
    Everything else Default
    Note that selecting Color Space MJPG and/or choosing the standard Matrox MPEG-2 I-Frame codec will cause the following error message:


    Cannot start video compression:

    The source image format is not acceptable.
    (error code -2)
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    no idea about the crash

    Looks like HCEnc it is

    Alternatively you could use cineform. It's the preferred digital intermediate for NLE's like vegas for many users . The free version is called "Go Pro Cineform Studio", and it will show up in vdub compression menu

    Or use a edit friendly AVC settings in vdub e.g. x264vfw with --tune fastdecode and I-frame only (GOP size of 1)

    Or try one of the "fast" lossless codecs like ut video, huffyuv etc... but the filesizes will be larger than what you've been using by several times
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  21. Originally Posted by poisondeathray View Post
    no idea about the crash

    Looks like HCEnc it is

    Alternatively you could use cineform. It's the preferred digital intermediate for NLE's like vegas for many users . The free version is called "Go Pro Cineform Studio", and it will show up in vdub compression menu

    Or use a edit friendly AVC settings in vdub e.g. x264vfw with --tune fastdecode and I-frame only (GOP size of 1)

    Or try one of the "fast" lossless codecs like ut video, huffyuv etc... but the filesizes will be larger than what you've been using by several times
    Wow, both work and the file size is amazingly small specially for x264fw.

    There's one thing that worries me, I record myself playing games with bandicam (screen recording at 29.94 fps) and now with virtualdub (webcam at 29.94 fps).

    What settings might ensure that virtualdub will record at a steady framerate or speed along with x264fw/cineform?

    After an hour the two video tracks tend to go out of sync. (Previous experience with Logitech's Quick Cam Software)
    Last edited by lonrot; 27th Jun 2014 at 00:47.
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  22. I found these settings in the Bandicam website regarding Vegas compatility:




    Thanks a lot Poison!

    This is much better than the previous re-encoding method
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  23. Video Restorer lordsmurf's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by poisondeathray View Post
    But typical consumer setups cannot handle uncompressed video (although he's only 1280x720), but 1920x1080 requires ~100MB/s .
    I missed the HD part.

    Matrox MPEG codecs only support certain resolutions -- most all of them SD. So that's why those are crashing.

    For HD, I always use ProRes422 in FCP. I do all HD editing on a Mac.
    Last edited by lordsmurf; 2nd Jul 2014 at 21:10.
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  24. Thanks lordsmurf, ProRes is a Mac exclusive... If only I had a Mac

    Picvideo M-JPEG is another lossy real-time encoder that I tested and runs smoothly on vegas, not free though.

    It seems to be less resource hungry than X-264vfw, which is a good thing.
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  25. Member Cornucopia's Avatar
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    No it's not. QT on PC supports playback of ProRes, and ffmbc supports Encoding to ProRes.

    There are a number of MJPEG codec possibilities out there. Morgan, Mainconcept, Quicktime.

    Scott
    "When will the rhetorical questions end?!" - George Carlin
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