Unable to remove pulldown - weird VOB format?

[bergqvistjl]

Are you using the GUI app from my site that I linked?

I am now, sorry... What settings do I need to check? It's currently set me up for an SVCD profile, which I don't think is right. Should it be set to MPEG-2? and is the fact that Pulldown is on "Auto" going to mess things up?

[Guest34343]

Program stream type MPEG-2
Pulldown none

[bergqvistjl]

Program stream type MPEG-2
Pulldown none

OK. The length of the pulled-down video file (before muxing is) 1:34:02 according to g-spot.

[jagabo]

Just a few notes:

The audio doesn't have to be the same length as the video. Nor does it have to start at the same time or end at the same time.

If you don't care about the logo at the start of the video you can skip it in DgIndex. Just include the main movie. That may be enough to get past the problems you're having. I usually do this. I don't need to see the studio and distributor logos when I watch a movie. -- Oops I just realized it was the title, not a logo at the start of your clip.

You may have better luck if you use VOB2MPG (you need the IFO files too) to convert the VOB files to MPG before you attempt to strip pulldown flags.

[bergqvistjl]

Just a few notes:

The audio doesn't have to be the same length as the video. Nor does it have to start at the same time or end at the same time.

If you don't care about the logo at the start of the video you can skip it in DgIndex. Just include the main movie. That may be enough to get past the problems you're having. I usually do this. I don't need to see the studio and distributor logos when I watch a movie. -- Oops I just realized it was the title, not a logo at the start of your clip.

You may have better luck if you use VOB2MPG (you need the IFO files too) to convert the VOB files to MPG before you attempt to strip pulldown flags.

VOB2MPG isn't working on my system -_- Just crashes when I launch it.

[Guest34343]

Program stream type MPEG-2
Pulldown none

OK. The length of the pulled-down video file (before muxing is) 1:34:02 according to g-spot.

What about the audio as reported by DelayCut? (Duration).

VOB2MPG won't help anything. You'll just have to demux the ES again anyway. Yes, the lengths can be different by a small amount, but if we have a lot it may imply something is amiss. The main thing is to mux properly (without commentary track for now) and then correct the offset.

Let's just try muxing with mplex and go from there.

[bergqvistjl]

Program stream type MPEG-2
Pulldown none

OK. The length of the pulled-down video file (before muxing is) 1:34:02 according to g-spot.

We knew that! What about the audio as reported by DelayCut? (Duration).

VOB2MPG won't help anything. You'll just have to demux the ES again anyway. Yes, the lengths can be different by a small amount, but if we have a lot it may imply something is amiss.

Let's just try muxing with mplex and go from there.

01:33:57.376 is the length of the audio tracks. I'm going to try Muxing again with mplex. Is the discrepancy due to the fact that DGIndex isn't joining the 4 VOB's together when it demuxes them all into single files?

Eac3to is giving me a total time for all 4 VOB's joined, as "01:33:56". I'm going to join all the 4 vob's together first before I demux it this time.

[Guest34343]

DGIndex joins the VOBs. I can't really answer any of these things without the VOBs. You can try doing all the demuxing with eac3to and then DGPulldown again followed by muxing. Joining the VOBs is a waste of time IMHO.

[bergqvistjl]

DGIndex joins the VOBs. I can't really answer any of these things without the VOBs. You can try doing all the demuxing with eac3to and then DGPulldown again followed by muxing. Joining the VOBs is a waste of time IMHO.

Debugging is frustrating when you use wrong tools and go off in other directions before we reach any conclusions on what we are doing.

I'm muxing now, but mplex isn't creating the output file :/ I've given it the correct path and everything & it has permissions.... It's attmpted to create it, but when I go find the file, it isn't there. Give me strength.... I tried to do it manually through the mplex command line, but I still got the same issue, audio delay was increasing throughout the video...

[Guest34343]

I feel for you, but we did mention early on about possible audio sync issues going this way. The thing is I think you may have the same problems re-encoding, because you'll have to mux again.

If you ever get a way to send me the VOBs, I'd be happy to try to process it. I did this stuff all the time as a consumer video engineer. You can snail mail them to me if you want, I'll give you an address, assuming it's all worth it to you.

Consider backing up with the flags intact if you don't think the bother is worth it.

[bergqvistjl]

I feel for you, but we did mention early on about possible audio sync issues going this way. The thing is I think you will have the same problems re-encoding, because you'll have to mux again.

If you ever get a way to send me the VOBs, I'd be happy to try to process it. I did this stuff all the time as a consumer video engineer.

Maybe next week then, if I can get on a fast internet connection for a bit

Well I'm giving up for now but I will send you the VOB's if I can It seems an intriguing problem :P

[Guest34343]

It seems an intriguing problem

Indeed it is. I never like to give up easily, so let's follow up when we can. I think we're very close.

[jagabo]

FINISHED 99.70% FILM

0.3 percent of a 90 minute movie is a lot more than 43 frames, about 10 times as many. So there must be more interlaced frames elsewhere.

[Guest34343]

Agreed. There's the stuff at the end too. And I'm not too sure how accurate DGIndex is with the film %. I remember making fixes for that in DGIndexNV. I'll double check it.

[bergqvistjl]

Agreed. There's the stuff at the end too. And I'm not too sure how accurate DGIndex is with the film %. I remember making fixes for that in DGIndexNV. I'll double check it.

I'll PM you when i'm ready, but it'll be sometime next week.

[bergqvistjl]

FINISHED 99.70% FILM

0.3 percent of a 90 minute movie is a lot more than 43 frames, about 10 times as many. So there must be more interlaced frames elsewhere.

I suppose it could be any time there's a fade or cut to black maybe?

[Guest34343]

Whoa, jagabo, you're right. I scrolled through more slowly looking for interlaced segments and voila, I found some.

That means re-encoding with either Force Film or external IVTC will be needed.

Your scepticism is appreciated.

I suppose it could be any time there's a fade or cut to black maybe?

Very plausible.

[manono]

Just reencode the thing if it absolutely has to be 23.976fps.. You'd have been done by now.

Doing anything else will result either in audio desynch or require a lot of audio work (and reencoding of the audio).

[Guest34343]

Sure, but that's the easy way out.

It would be worth trying to stretch the audio by 3 seconds if one really wants to avoid re-encoding the video. It would work if the interlaced parts are reasonably well distributed.

At this point it's sort of an interesting challenge.

[manono]

It would be worth trying to stretch the audio by 3 seconds if one really wants to avoid re-encoding the video.

In all likelihood just stretching it wouldn't put everything back in synch because the places it goes out of synch (the hard telecined parts) wouldn't be evenly distributed. The end result would be that it would be in synch at the beginning and the end, but be noticeably out of synch during many places in between. I was thinking that he'd have to play it and add silence or cut audio at various places where it drops to video. I've done some of that and it's no fun.

Do we even know why he thinks it has to be 23.976fps? There's something wrong with leaving it as it is? I can't believe this has gone on for three pages and 80 posts now. And that now I've added to the post count.

[Guest34343]

That's why I mentioned that it might work if the interlaced parts are well distributed!

It's just a bit of fun. And maybe somebody learned something from it all.

[bergqvistjl]

It would be worth trying to stretch the audio by 3 seconds if one really wants to avoid re-encoding the video.

In all likelihood just stretching it wouldn't put everything back in synch because the places it goes out of synch (the hard telecined parts) wouldn't be evenly distributed. The end result would be that it would be in synch at the beginning and the end, but be noticeably out of synch during many places in between. I was thinking that he'd have to play it and add silence or cut audio at various places where it drops to video. I've done some of that and it's no fun.

Do we even know why he thinks it has to be 23.976fps? There's something wrong with leaving it as it is? I can't believe this has gone on for three pages and 80 posts now. And that now I've added to the post count.

Well it was originally shot on film, but has been expanded to 30fps for NTSC TV, and with the pulldown flags I was getting jitter... So I figured if I removed the pulldown flags to get the framerate back to how it was originally shot, then playback would be smoother, as I wouldn't have those pulldown frames inserted in to bring the framerate up to 30.

[manono]

jagabo gave you the answer back in post #4:

The MPEG2 stream is a mixture of progressive and interlaced encoding.

There's your problem. You cannot produce a progressive video from that without reencoding.

Why are you still in denial? Had you reencoded you'd have been done a long time ago.

So I figured if I removed the pulldown flags to get the framerate back to how it was originally shot

You figured wrong. It's either reencode the video or start playing with the audio. And without a reencode there's the possibility of there being places where interlacing is visible.

[El Heggunte]

And if you are as lazy as I was , you don't even need to worry about deinterlacing.
Just re-encode as interlaced at 29.97fps, problem solved. That's what I did, when I had the same problem as you.

[Alex_ander]

I've seen a recommendation above in the thread to remove pulldown with DGPulldown. In my experience, it didn't work as expected (left some flags untouched) and I used another tool, Restream - which did it perfectly.

If you want to separate the 24 fps part, remove pulldown and re-encode this part with hard pulldown, you can try to separately demux it with PGCDemux using 'by VOB ID' option (most likely, it was encoded separately, so that might work). Then apply Restream with 'reset timestamps' box checked (to zero the pulldown), add hard pulldown in AviSynth, encode and join it with the rest parts in some MPEG editor.