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  1. Member
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    i have always wanted to know what Bitrate the video and audio was on a panasonic CD-i movie

    i had a look but only found one site saying they used a rez of 384x288

    Any info would be great thx

    also besides vcd dvd and divx movies was there any other movies that came out on compact disc
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  2. Member Noahtuck's Avatar
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    Do you mean the video bitrate of the game video or did they release some actual movies for the CDI on CD ?

    And I don't know about movies, but I do own some old music CD's that also have music videos or live videos of songs on them that only play on my laserdisc player.
    But the audio part will play on any standard cd player.

    also besides vcd dvd and divx movies was there any other movies that came out on compact disc
    Well, DVD never came on on compact disc, hence the name DVD........
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  3. Member
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    Originally Posted by Noahtuck View Post
    Do you mean the video bitrate of the game video or did they release some actual movies for the CDI on CD ?

    And I don't know about movies, but I do own some old music CD's that also have music videos or live videos of songs on them that only play on my laserdisc player.
    But the audio part will play on any standard cd player.

    also besides vcd dvd and divx movies was there any other movies that came out on compact disc
    Well, DVD never came on on compact disc, hence the name DVD........
    yes the cd-i had movies the disc and cases look the same as vcd do

    also i mean movies that came out on disc i know of hd-dvd also
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  4. Member hech54's Avatar
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    Like in every other circumstance, the exact video bitrate will depend on the length of the movie.
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  5. Member Cornucopia's Avatar
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    They did release some actual movies on CD-i, which predated VCD. However, they quickly switched to just creating movies on VCD, because the VCDs were playable on CD-i players AND VCD players, but the CD-i's were only playable on CD-i players.
    AND, not all exisiting CD-i players had the FMV ("full motion video") add-on cartridge, so those wouldn't be able to decode the video. VCD players of course had that built-in.

    The spec for CD-i FMV was not IDENTICAL to VCD, but it was close enough. I have that info stored in my CD archives and could look it up, but don't think that's really necessary, since you cannot CREATE a new CD-i.
    The equivalent - VCD, is 352 x 240 @ 29.97Fps or 23.976 -progressive (NTSC) or 352 x 288 @ 25Fps - progressive (PAL). All are encoded to MPEG1 System Stream (ISO 11172) Containers, using MPEG1 video @ 1150kbps CBR and MPEG1-Layer2 audio @ 224kbps CBR. Since the CD-i format wasn't really tied to national video systems like VCD/DVD/BD is, but was more computer-oriented, it probably did use ~384 x 288 (but at 4:3 DAR) at least as part of its spec. That sounds about right. Bitrate was also right around 1100-1200kbps, just like VCD. Remember, those needed to play on standard 1x CDROM drives, and that is the bitrate that one would get from a MODE2Form2 sector readout - ~1361 kbps (2324 user data B/sector, 75 sectors/second) and no higher.

    @jamespoo, I'm assuming you meant PHILIPS' CD-i movie, not Panasonic. Panasonic made the competing 3DO format.

    Scott
    Last edited by Cornucopia; 10th Jun 2014 at 02:17.
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    Originally Posted by Cornucopia View Post
    They did release some actual movies on CD-i, which predated VCD. However, they quickly switched to just creating movies on VCD, because the VCDs were playable on CD-i players AND VCD players, but the CD-i's were only playable on CD-i players.
    AND, not all exisiting CD-i players had the FMV ("full motion video") add-on cartridge, so those wouldn't be able to decode the video. VCD players of course had that built-in.

    The spec for CD-i FMV was not IDENTICAL to VCD, but it was close enough. I have that info stored in my CD archives and could look it up, but don't think that's really necessary, since you cannot CREATE a new CD-i.
    The equivalent - VCD, is 352 x 240 @ 29.97Fps or 23.976 -progressive (NTSC) or 352 x 288 @ 25Fps - progressive (PAL). All are encoded to MPEG1 System Stream (ISO 11172) Containers, using MPEG1 video @ 1150kbps CBR and MPEG1-Layer2 audio @ 224kbps CBR. Since the CD-i format wasn't really tied to national video systems like VCD/DVD/BD is, but was more computer-oriented, it probably did use ~384 x 288 (but at 4:3 DAR) at least as part of its spec. That sounds about right. Bitrate was also right around 1100-1200kbps, just like VCD. Remember, those needed to play on standard 1x CDROM drives, and that is the bitrate that one would get from a MODE2Form2 sector readout - ~1361 kbps (2324 user data B/sector, 75 sectors/second) and no higher.

    @jamespoo, I'm assuming you meant PHILIPS' CD-i movie, not Panasonic. Panasonic made the competing 3DO format.

    Scott
    thanks
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    Originally Posted by jamespoo View Post

    also besides vcd dvd and divx movies was there any other movies that came out on compact disc
    I've got an SVCD of Rambo III from Malaysia that was a commercial release there. It's spread out over 3 discs. It's been a long time since I looked at it, but I remember that it played OK in my DVD player but the directory (or "folder" if you prefer to use that term) names weren't quite right for SVCD. It has SVCD type video but it was built more like a VCD in terms of directory names and contents. It was a bit bizarre. SVCD never really took off and there was a competing similar format that also never took off called China Video Disc or CVD, which should not be confused with the laserdisc CDV variant alluded to by Noahtuck. CDV was probably on something like a CD but very little is known about the format as it wasn't popular and computers can't read them or create new ones. I have a laserdisc player and I've got some CDV discs, but all I can tell you is that the underlying disc is PROBABLY a CD because DVDs didn't exist at the time, but as I said since computers can't read these discs, I have no way to know what the disc is actually made of.
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  8. Member Cornucopia's Avatar
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    @jman98 & jamespoo,
    the CDV that you were thinking about is a Hybrid Digital+Analog disc. On the digital side (1st session), it is a standard AudioCD with 1 or more tracks. On the analog side (2nd session) it is a standard Laserdisc video. Being analog, that section is totally UNREADABLE on digital computers. Only way to get that into a computer would be to use a Laserdisc player and Analog capture card.
    There are 2 forms of CDVs: the "Video Single" that was the usual 12cm disc form factor which would play the audio in standard AudioCD players (and the video in LD players), and the "CDV EP" which was really a smaller form Laserdisc (about the size of a 45rpm record, ~9-10") that only played in LD players (whether the digital audiocd tracks or the analog video title).
    This is not to be confused with later LD video titles that included digital soundtracks (AC-3, DTS or LPCM).
    For the 1st session only, the disc is, for all intents and purposes, a standard AudioCD both in physical makeup and in logical structure.

    @jamespoo,
    There have been OTHER disc formats that have included video footage: CD-Extra/EnhancedCD, WMV-HD, 3DO, etc., but all of them are also-ran formats that never really got off the ground (though some were and still are pretty cool and should have had a better life). I can fairly confidently say that ANY title that was put out on them was also put out on a more popular format: LD, VHS, VCD, SVCD, DVD, HD DVD, BD. Heck, even RCA Selectavision CED discs had a better run.
    So you're not losing anything by not having those titles in that format.

    Scott
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  9. Originally Posted by Noahtuck View Post
    Well, DVD never came on on compact disc, hence the name DVD........
    That's not entirely true. There was a format called mini-DVD which was DVD content burned on CD-R. No, not SVCD or the 8 cm DVD of 1.4 GB, but a CDR.
    But it wasn't supported by many players so I guess it died quickly. I think it was Nero who offered the option.
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  10. Originally Posted by jamespoo View Post
    i have always wanted to know what Bitrate the video and audio was on a panasonic CD-i movie

    i had a look but only found one site saying they used a rez of 384x288

    Any info would be great thx

    also besides vcd dvd and divx movies was there any other movies that came out on compact disc
    Isobuster can extract the video from those CD-i/VCD movies easily.
    But in contrast with LaserDisc, I have never heard of any film/other that was exclusive to CD-i or VCD. In other words, why bother.
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  11. Member
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    Originally Posted by Spiny Norman View Post
    Originally Posted by Noahtuck View Post
    Well, DVD never came on on compact disc, hence the name DVD........
    That's not entirely true. There was a format called mini-DVD which was DVD content burned on CD-R. No, not SVCD or the 8 cm DVD of 1.4 GB, but a CDR.
    But it wasn't supported by many players so I guess it died quickly. I think it was Nero who offered the option.
    Geez. Way to split hairs. Noahtuck means there was never a COMMERCIAL format of DVD on CD media. Yes, Nero and other programs allowed people to force DVD content onto burnable CD discs and depending on how they were made some but NOT all DVD players might play them. We all know that. Noahtuck knows that. You could possibly in theory burn CD audio format to a DVD disc but there's so much wrong with that that probably only a PC would even try to play it and even then it might be iffy. The point of this thread was to talk about commercial formats, not crazy stuff that violates standards or doesn't have standards at all (there is no standard for "miniDVD"). There are threads from years ago about how to burn audio to CD-R discs but in XA mode where it uses precious error correction space for storage instead. There are no guarantees that such discs will play in all players or that the lack of error correction won't eventually prove to be a very bad idea, but again, there are all kinds of crazy things people can do that violate standards.

    By the way, since you want to be argumentative (YOU started it, not me) there actually are movies ONLY available on VCD and possibly old VHS tapes and no other format. I'm not telling you that it's common, but it is true for some older Hong Kong movies. None of these are what westerners would consider to be major releases though. The fact that YOU never heard of it doesn't mean it's not true. I'd have let that go except for your ridiculous crap arguing about miniDVD when that was not the point of this thread.
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  12. Member Cornucopia's Avatar
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    Yes, mini-DVD was NOT a commercial format, just a convenient "cheat" for those who couldn't afford DVD-Burnables (blanks & machines).

    @jman98, you could NOT burn AudioCD format to either DVD or BD, as their sector format is based on strict 2048-Byte User data sectors, while AudioCD used 2352-Byte Sectors.
    The format that people attempted to try was a type that was supposed to be already compatible with XA mode, because XA M2F2 was designed to support Audio (as well as Video). Packetizing LPCM without there being glitches in playback was probably the biggest challenge. CDi/GreenBook overcame that by specifying a few ADPCM (8bit & 4bit) modes, and VCD/WhiteBook added to that by adding MP2.

    @Spiny Norman, quit before you dig yourself deeper.

    Scott
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  13. Well excuse me for remembering that weird old option in nero dvd creator or whatever it was.

    I am SO SORRY I upset you guys by mentioning the odd exception. What was I thinking, annoying you with curiosities like that. People are here to get anwers, not to learn irrelevant nonstandard stuff.


    I also apologise DEEPLY for not knowing about some Asian movies that were only ever sold on VCD. How stupid of me to say that I had never heared of any, when in fact, it was just me who... had... never... heared of any? Well clearly I went too far when I said that.


    Not to mention my actually potentially useful suggestion of extracting the video content with isobuster. Unforgivable. There is no excuse really, is there.
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