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  1. I'm looking for a 3D Blu-ray player that can play BD-R DL. It'll be a plus if it can use USB port to open MKV.

    Region is USA.
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  2. I'm a Super Moderator johns0's Avatar
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    Just bring your disc and usb drive to your nearest walmart or best buy and test a blu-ray player,most if not all which are 3d capable will do what you want,sony,phillps,samsung,lg and panasonic to name a few.
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  3. Member turk690's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by johns0 View Post
    Just bring your disc and usb drive to your nearest walmart or best buy...
    Easier said than done. Sales staff at those two places, at least where I am in Canada, will always urge you to just "take it home and test it" and "if there seems to be a problem just bring it back". Tough. The requirement for BD-R playback is also a bit tricky.
    Unlike DVD-R and CD-R, BD-R and BD-R DL were conceived at the start along with pressed BD specs. So it should be an absolute given that any blu-ray player out there that follows specs should be able to play correctly authored BD-Rs. This is not the case, at least with the wretched RCA BRC3109 sold at walmart, which I bought to specifically play my beautiful BD-R/DLs and found out it resolutely does not. So much wasted gas; I should have looked at the amazon reviews first, my initial assumption notwithstanding.
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    The manual will normally say what optical disc types are playable. The manual for the LG BP220 I bought for my parents says it will play BD-R and BD-RE, and it does play BD-R. I haven't tested BD-RE or BD-R DL, which is not mentioned in the manual. I haven't had a reason to buy either BD-RE or BD-R DL yet.
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  5. I have read a lot of BD player's manual, and I haven't seen one explicitly said it supports dual layer BD-R.

    My local WM and BD do not demo BD player, so there is no way to test it at store.
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    Originally Posted by trumpet205 View Post
    I have read a lot of BD player's manual, and I haven't seen one explicitly said it supports dual layer BD-R.

    My local WM and BD do not demo BD player, so there is no way to test it at store.
    AFAIK, all of them support dual layer playback.
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  7. Member Krispy Kritter's Avatar
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    Maybe you are just not looking for the right thing.

    As a test, the first Blu-Ray 3D player I could find at walmart.com:

    http://www.walmart.com/ip/Samsung-BD-F7500-3D-Ready-WiFi-4K-Blu-ray-Player/31423839#Item+Description

    Open the User Manual from Samsung, specs on page 8:

    http://downloadcenter.samsung.com/content/UM/201303/20130325155832397/02349C-BD-F7500-...NG-0320_BM.pdf
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    Any currently made BD player, whether 3D BD or not, should be able to correctly play a BD-R DL. Now having said that, I do want to warn you that my experience is that NOBODY and I mean NOBODY ANYWHERE makes a BD player that will 100% of the time play a BD-R DL with zero problems. The best you can hope for is that most of the time playback will be fine. If it's not, then just eject the disc, reload it, and hopefully that time playback will be fine. Maybe Oppo makes a player that never has an issue with BD-R DL, but do you have the money necessary to buy one? All the other ones I've ever tried will mostly play BD-R DL fine, but sometimes they all have problems of varying kinds and all you can do is eject and reload.

    By the way, the ONLY BD-R DL brand I trust is Verbatim and using those over whatever cheap crap your local Staples/Office Depot/Sam's/Best Buy has is one way to reduce problems.
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  9. I have a question for Samsung BD player. On many of their models they said,

    * Your player will not play content that has been recorded on a BD-R or USB device at a bit rate that exceeds 25 Mbps.

    Yet on the next 2 pages they allow 30 Mbps for most 2D video, and 60 Mbps for 3D MVC. So which is right?

    Originally Posted by Krispy Kritter View Post
    Page 8 says nothing about BD-R DL.
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  10. Member Cornucopia's Avatar
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    Since the Blu-ray spec allows for up to 40Mbps video encoding/48Mbps Total encoding, or for a 3DBD, allows for up to 40Mbps per Base OR Dependent video stream (60Mbps for combined streams, 64Mbps Total encoding), the limiting of their guarantee to 25Mbps is a lame cop-out for Samsung and one they couldn't really enforce if push came to shove (since it doesn't even achieve the spec).

    They're probably assuming that BD-Rs and BD-REs are going to have more Read Errors to the point where there will need to be re-reads, which will slow down the effective read bitrate. This assumption only holds up if that media is that much worse WRT readability than stamped ROM media.

    Be a hardass about it and bring your own test discs. Don't put up with "try it at home first".

    Scott
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  11. Originally Posted by Cornucopia View Post
    Be a hardass about it and bring your own test discs. Don't put up with "try it at home first".Scott
    That's the thing, my local WM, Target, and BB don't demo Blu-ray players. All players are boxed up, so I couldn't test it at store, even if I was to allowed to do so.

    I'll give Samsung BD-FM59 a try. Seems to be a refurbished unit of F5900. They're on Newegg for $55.
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    I'm going to repeat myself because I'm not sure you understood what I said so I'm going to say it differently this time.

    If anybody makes a BD player that can't play BD-R DL, then it's a POS and you need to take it back. This is not common. Now you do need to understand the following though.
    1) Better media gives better results. If you are using whatever cheap crap discs you found on sale at Sams/Office Depot/Staples/etc. then you get what you pay for. If you want to give yourself the best chance for success, you need to use ONLY Verbatim BD-R DL discs.
    2) I've yet to see ANY BD player that doesn't occasionally have playback problems with BD-R DL discs. The solution is to eject the disc and reload it. Every player I've ever used, and I've used several, all had random, ,inconsistent problems with BD-R DL media. Once I ejected the disc and reloaded it, the problem went away. In fact, I've never been able to reproduce any of the "problems", yet every player I've ever owned has had problems at some point. For example, if you're watching a BD of TV episodes, the first four may play fine, then when it comes to episode five it won't play at all. Ejecting the disc and reloading it will fix the problem. Maybe next week every episode on the disc plays fine but you can't play any extras until you eject and reload. And so on. I don't know any players period that don't have at least middling problems with BD-R DL media. This is just reality. But I've also never seen a problem that couldn't be fixed by ejecting and reloading. Oppo's players are VERY expensive and they use the best components out there. It's possible that their players don't have any issues with BD-R DL discs at all, but my experience is that the media just is prone to random problems and if you use it, that's just the reality of the situation. However, I have never seen a BD player that wouldn't play BD-R DL at all, so that RCA player must be a POS.
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  13. jman98

    I do understand what you are saying. That is why I decided to pull trigger on a Samsung BD player. I'm sure that Oppo player is top of the class but at that price range I could've just go with HTPC route, which is something I try to avoid.

    I definitely won't be using crappy media. Bought couple TDK BD-R DL prior hand and will be using them.
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  14. Member fritzi93's Avatar
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    I'll mention one thing someone reading this thread may encounter. It's a bit tangential to the OP's question, so apologies.

    If you play a 3D Blu-Ray and get "dropouts", don't immediately blame the standalone player. Turn off any image processing on your 3D TV. Most particularly motion interpolation. Then see if the problem persists.

    I say this because when I got my LG 65LW6500 and LG BD670 player, I got occasional "dropouts" the first time I tested a 3D BD. (This was with the TV at default settings with everything imaginable turned on, before I calibrated the set.) Turning off image processing fixed it. Apparently the TV's processor couldn't quite keep up when playing a 3D BD. with image processing turned on.
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  15. Member turk690's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by jman98 View Post
    However, I have never seen a BD player that wouldn't play BD-R DL at all, so that RCA player must be a POS.
    It is, and the walmart sales staff have taken the cue and promptly tells would-be buyers it doesn't play BD-R. This would indeed be an illegal application of blu-ray standards/specs where RCA (or whoever made the player for them) is concerned, no? Where should we complain??
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    Originally Posted by trumpet205 View Post
    I definitely won't be using crappy media. Bought couple TDK BD-R DL prior hand and will be using them.
    TDK IS the very definition of "crappy media". Why on earth do you think they are not crappy? TDK uses Ritek to make their discs including BD-R DL. They're junk. A few years ago there was this false idea that all BD media was superb, but people know better now. Ritek gets as many complaints about its BD media as it does its awful DVD media now. I told you what is the ONLY reliable high quality media you will have access to via normal channels. If you want to use TDK garbage, then that is part of your problem.
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    TDK BD-R media probably was good at first, when TDK actually made them. Then they reportedly sold their BD production equipment to FTI/Falcon and outsourced production. http://club.myce.com/f33/my-tdk-bd-res-fake-330871/#post2671589
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  18. Well, TDK so far hasn't given me any trouble. I did try Verbatim/Mitsubishi in the past and had couple bad burns with them. Is Panasonic BD-R DL any good?

    Got FM59C from Newegg today. Haven't tried the disc but my USB testing result is interesting.

    * Despite manual states that 3D MVC is supported in .mkv, it is not. Plays only in 2D.
    * 3D MVC does work in .m2ts. Automatically switched into 3D upon playback.
    * LPCM in .m2ts does not work, which is strange cause manual says it is supported.
    * 25 Mbps bitrate limitation is indeed bogus. Played a .m2ts with 35 Mbps just fine.

    One thing I like about this Samsung player is that it is very responsive. It feels nothing like my old Panasonic player.
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    Interesting question about Panasonic BD discs. A recentish test by some French group indicated that Panasonic makes the best BD media of them all, but they tested Japanese Panasonic. If you can get "Made in Japan" discs then they SHOULD be pretty good but if they are made elsewhere, I would reserve judgement. I have never personally used them so I can offer no first hand experience. Verbatim did well in the French test, but not as well as Panasonic. This held led the circle jerk guys at MyCE to prefer Panasonic above all other brands.
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    Originally Posted by jman98 View Post
    Interesting question about Panasonic BD discs. A recentish test by some French group indicated that Panasonic makes the best BD media of them all, but they tested Japanese Panasonic. If you can get "Made in Japan" discs then they SHOULD be pretty good but if they are made elsewhere, I would reserve judgement. I have never personally used them so I can offer no first hand experience. Verbatim did well in the French test, but not as well as Panasonic. This held led the circle jerk guys at MyCE to prefer Panasonic above all other brands.
    I have experience with both Panasonic BD-R from Japan and Verbatim BD-R using a Pioneer burner. Both burn beautifully I have had no coasters with either, although I have burned many more Verbatim BD-R discs.

    There is a discussion about the French study here here: http://club.myce.com/f33/french-study-bd-r-archival-329441/ Panasonic did perform only a little better than Verbatim in the burning tests, but Panasonic came out WAY ahead of Verbatim in the simulated aging test. Panasonic media was readable for the full duration of the test. Verbatim HTL media became unreadable less than halfway through.

    I don't know how the BD-R DL media compares. Dual layer media could be a different story in every respect. However, if it is similar to DVD, burned dual layer BD media will fail sooner than single-layer media.
    Last edited by usually_quiet; 5th Jun 2014 at 22:45.
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  21. I'm a Super Moderator johns0's Avatar
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    I wouldn't trust any simulated aging testing ever.
    I think,therefore i am a hamster.
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    Originally Posted by johns0 View Post
    I wouldn't trust any simulated aging testing ever.
    Real aging takes too long. Panasonic's BD-R media was still readable after 2000 hours at 80C and 80% relative humidity. All of the other media tested failed sooner.
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  23. I'm a Super Moderator johns0's Avatar
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    To me that's unreal testing,most discs never get that treatment.
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    Originally Posted by johns0 View Post
    To me that's unreal testing,most discs never get that treatment.
    I'll take my chances that the results of the "unreal" testing used in the French study are indicative of what actually could happen over the course of 10 years. Beyond that, I don't care because by that time I'll probably be copying all my video files to some other type of storage to play with whatever sort of new video player is popular then.
    Last edited by usually_quiet; 6th Jun 2014 at 10:46.
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  25. Okay, got around and tested it with a BD-RE DL first. It works. The player have no problem with dual layer disc. Even try to seek ahead, and it still plays.

    That being said, there seems to be a problem with LPCM. I authored a BDMV with 7.1 LPCM audio, and the player always downmix it to 2.0. I changed the setting to PCM and Bitstream back and forward, and it always downmix no matter what.

    It'll give me 5.1 if I set it re-encode to DD/DTS then Bitstream. Funny thing is USB playback of .m2ts doesn't even recognize LPCM track.

    Is this a normal behavior? I thought in Blu-ray specification LPCM is a mandatory audio codec with support up to 7.1 at 96 kHz.
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    Originally Posted by jman98 View Post
    Interesting question about Panasonic BD discs. A recentish test by some French group indicated that Panasonic makes the best BD media of them all, but they tested Japanese Panasonic. If you can get "Made in Japan" discs then they SHOULD be pretty good but if they are made elsewhere, I would reserve judgement. I have never personally used them so I can offer no first hand experience. Verbatim did well in the French test, but not as well as Panasonic. This held led the circle jerk guys at MyCE to prefer Panasonic above all other brands.
    As far as I am aware, Panasonic Blu ray discs are only made in Japan. And Panasonic is now supplying DL BD discs to other companies, including JVC/Taiyo Yuden.

    The media folks over at MyCE test everything, ad nauseum, but at least they have their own data to back up their preferences.
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