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  1. Member
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    I'm not sure if there is any danger of corrupting data saved onto (any of the) hard-drives after a blue-screen crash/error/reboot/shut-down problem.

    Should one always perform a chkdsk after this?
    /f or /r or none?

    For example, it's happened to me that I was deleting some files, went into the Recycle Bin, and all of the sudden: blue-screen, "memory dump", reboot, etc.
    I did a chkdsk /f.
    However, I also had to run CCleaner to get that MEMORY.DMP - over 500 MB - file deleted, as well as the files from the Recycle Bin - over 3 GB - also removed permanently. (You see, they were no longer showing up in the Recycle Bin or in the original place of deletion, but they were still eating up the space.)

    I would / used to perform chkdsk always up until now, but with hard-drives created by incompetent companies (- western digital, yes, those nincompoops -) I'm getting the feeling that whenever I run chkdsk on drives prone to failing (even when seemingly healthy, yes) I'm getting more problems, and the errors are happening more often, and even other errors showing up (such as, for example, a system file - pagefile.sys, if you must know - showing up as corrupt and needing to be deleted/recreated), and so on.
    It just seems that more problems appear if I do the chkdsk command on crappy drives.

    So, should I give up chkdsk after a system error reboot, or what?

    Thanks.
    Last edited by jeanpave; 29th May 2014 at 11:15.
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  2. If chkdsk flags a problem, that is because it's a problem. If you don't want to be told about the problem, or have it fixed, then don't run it. Just wait till it stops working altogether.

    My advice would be to have somebody else run it and interpret the results for you. You're not doing it right.
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  3. Member johns0's Avatar
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    It's better to use a windows repair disc on bootup,anytime i try and use chkdsk/p or r it takes too long and doesn't always repair.
    I think,therefore i am a hamster.
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  4. Member Cornucopia's Avatar
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    Sounds to me like you have power-supply/brownouts and/or mobo/memory problems and that it (along with the consequential BSOD and reboots) has corrupted your HDD to the point where your OS is now corrupted.

    I'd say it has LITTLE to do with WD drives vs. any other, and more to do with your continuing on blindly without proper backup/restore and analysis/recovery habits.

    IIWY, I'd:

    1. Backup all the valuable Data files (flix/pix/tunz, docs, ebooks, favorites, settings, etc) to external HDD or burn onto CD/DVD/BD
    2. Gather up the install discs for your OS (with patches/updates either applied as slipstreamed, or on a separate disc to be applied later), and all your main/valuable apps.
    3. WIPE the drive (using a Bootable CD/DVD as your source OS)
    4. Run chkdsk, spinrite, etc on the drive THOROUGHLY (perhaps multiple times), also from the Boot CD OS. Whatever is left is all there is gonna be. If one of those apps tells you the drive is bad/fragile/failing, chunk it and get a new drive. Do a similar check on the new drive, just in case.
    5. Also, HAVE YOUR PS, MOBO & MEM CHECKED (preferably by a reputable PC repair service) and OK'd. Replace if necessary.
    6. Get a UPS (with voltage regulator/power conditioner) and put it in-line.
    7. Reinstall your OS onto the drive, run the OS updates, add/install the apps, and restore the data from the backups
    8. Enjoy your restored PC, but remember to continue with regular backups (and test restores), as well as regular disk checks.

    Do this ASAP! You might lose valuable and unique stuff otherwise (perhaps permanently, depending on your current backups or lack thereof).

    I have seen this happen MULTIPLE TIMES before (including once to myself), so I'm not just making this up or trying to scare you. And stop with the "WD = crap" BS, nobody believes you or cares, as they don't have those problems with their WD drives (I have a variety of brands including WD myself and none is much better or worse than the rest).

    Scott
    "When will the rhetorical questions end?!" - George Carlin
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  5. Member
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    I agree with what Cornucopia posted. And for every person who hates Western Digital disk drives, there's another person to tell us that every Seagate drive they've ever bought has been crap and only Western Digital has been great for them.

    He also points out that if you have brownouts, your disk drive can get corrupted from this. I speak from firsthand experience here. Despite working in IT for a living, I can be cheap at times and for many years I never had a UPS at home. Every year or two, my Windows PC would get some kind of unrecoverable error that would prevent the disk drive from booting. EVERYTHING on the disk that cared about was still there and I could mount the drive and get to my stuff, but the damn thing wouldn't boot and Windows Recovery couldn't fix it. I'd have to reinstall from scratch. It got so that eventually I realized that if chkdsk ran and found stuff it fixed, that was my sign that I was about to be screwed and I was months away at best from the same problem all over again. A few years ago I did a new PC build, bought a UPS and I've yet to see that problem. I live in a place where brownouts happen at least once a month. So I do understand the fear of chkdsk. In theory it doesn't cause any problems to run it, but my experience is that once it starts finding problems on a regular basis or it finds many problems for the first time, your disk drive is on its way out.
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  6. Mentally Deficient Mr.Delusional's Avatar
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    @jeanpave

    Is this the same computer that you asked about whether it's safe to put in front of an air conditioner?
    Here is the other thread. http://forum.videohelp.com/threads/364872-Computer-in-Front-of-Air-Conditioner
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  7. Member Cornucopia's Avatar
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    If it is about that other overheating business, you had best get that fixed first. And by fixed, I mean DO an actual test with a HW temp-checking app, and suck it up and take it to a PC service/repair shop. Unless you don't care about your data, you'll lose much more than just the box if you ignore this. And Nelson37 is right - most of those replacement fans are less than $10. Stop being a cheap-skate about it.

    What I said above about the PS/brownouts goes DOUBLE for hard crashes due to overheating.

    Scott
    "When will the rhetorical questions end?!" - George Carlin
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  8. Member
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    Originally Posted by Nelson37 View Post
    If chkdsk flags a problem, that is because it's a problem. If you don't want to be told about the problem, or have it fixed, then don't run it. Just wait till it stops working altogether.

    My advice would be to have somebody else run it and interpret the results for you. You're not doing it right.

    No, no, no... Chkdsk does NOT run by itself. I used to always run it. On my own initiative. For safety.

    But recently I've encountered other problems after running chkdsk, as described above. So I'm wondering whether I should give up running it (for safety. 'Cause it doesn't seem to help... DOES IT?)

    See my conundrum?

    Thanks.
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  9. Member Cornucopia's Avatar
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    Running it does not CAUSE problems, per se, just exposes ALREADY EXISTING problems. (It does, however, flag as bad areas which the OS might need and assumed were OK - but which have proven to be corrupt. Once they're flagged as bad, if the data that existed there didn't get correctly relocated ahead of time, you'll have "holes" in your data - which could be user data or could be CODE, including the OS). It IS supposed to help, but only if run BEFORE it gets to such a bad state as you are already in.

    Nelson37 was not suggesting that you were having Chkdsk run by itself, he was suggesting that instead of you doing it and interpreting it using your own set of assumptions (which he and I find inadequate or skewed enough to be suspect), that you let someone else run it for you & do the interpreting of the results. Whereby, you should have a more accurate assessment of what's really happening and what's the best remedial avenue.

    Scott
    "When will the rhetorical questions end?!" - George Carlin
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  10. Member
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    Originally Posted by Mr.Delusional View Post
    @jeanpave

    Is this the same computer that you asked about whether it's safe to put in front of an air conditioner?
    Here is the other thread. http://forum.videohelp.com/threads/364872-Computer-in-Front-of-Air-Conditioner

    Yes.
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  11. Member
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    Originally Posted by Cornucopia View Post
    Running it does not CAUSE problems, per se, just exposes ALREADY EXISTING problems. (It does, however, flag as bad areas which the OS might need and assumed were OK - but which have proven to be corrupt. Once they're flagged as bad, if the data that existed there didn't get correctly relocated ahead of time, you'll have "holes" in your data - which could be user data or could be CODE, including the OS). It IS supposed to help, but only if run BEFORE it gets to such a bad state as you are already in.

    Nelson37 was not suggesting that you were having Chkdsk run by itself, he was suggesting that instead of you doing it and interpreting it using your own set of assumptions (which he and I find inadequate or skewed enough to be suspect), that you let someone else run it for you & do the interpreting of the results. Whereby, you should have a more accurate assessment of what's really happening and what's the best remedial avenue.

    Scott

    I don't need your advice. I know what your impression of me is.

    So would you please cease invading my threads?
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  12. Member
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    Originally Posted by Cornucopia View Post
    I have a variety of brands including WD myself and none is much better or worse than the rest.
    Total BS! western digital sucks balls! Would I keep criticizing them every time I come here, despite huge fans like this cornucopia guy trying to bully my opinions, unless I really experienced a lot of shet due to their incompetence??...

    Now enough about that!

    Moderators, could you please talk to cornucopia to not post in my threads anymore? I really hope not to see a response from him anymore.
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  13. Member
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    Originally Posted by jman98 View Post
    I agree with what Cornucopia posted. And for every person who hates Western Digital disk drives, there's another person to tell us that every Seagate drive they've ever bought has been crap and only Western Digital has been great for them.

    He also points out that if you have brownouts, your disk drive can get corrupted from this. I speak from firsthand experience here. Despite working in IT for a living, I can be cheap at times and for many years I never had a UPS at home. Every year or two, my Windows PC would get some kind of unrecoverable error that would prevent the disk drive from booting. EVERYTHING on the disk that cared about was still there and I could mount the drive and get to my stuff, but the damn thing wouldn't boot and Windows Recovery couldn't fix it. I'd have to reinstall from scratch. It got so that eventually I realized that if chkdsk ran and found stuff it fixed, that was my sign that I was about to be screwed and I was months away at best from the same problem all over again. A few years ago I did a new PC build, bought a UPS and I've yet to see that problem. I live in a place where brownouts happen at least once a month. So I do understand the fear of chkdsk. In theory it doesn't cause any problems to run it, but my experience is that once it starts finding problems on a regular basis or it finds many problems for the first time, your disk drive is on its way out.

    Hey, do you want to help me, or influence my strongest opinion ever?

    western digital is run by morons who have no idea how to build long-lasting hard-drives. Do you really think a stranger posting on the Internet - you - can influence my opinion on this?
    That was a rhetorical question, in case you didn't put two and two together, or didn't want to.

    But, really, this is what you take from my problem?
    I posted six paragraphs in that first post, and you focus on that one sentence about wd?
    You don't want to help me, do you?
    You must be cornucopia's friend, or something?

    If that's the case, I don't need any advice from you, either. Go help other people.
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  14. Member
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    Originally Posted by Mr.Delusional View Post
    @jeanpave

    Is this the same computer that you asked about whether it's safe to put in front of an air conditioner?
    Here is the other thread. http://forum.videohelp.com/threads/364872-Computer-in-Front-of-Air-Conditioner

    Well, you see, I want to know if I should run chkdsk for safety or just not bother with it. The computer restarts when I'm working on something, usually, so in the middle of an action. There could be data loss, no?

    But is chkdsk useful at all, or just a waste of time?

    (A waste of time that could even create other problems? I've experienced a case or two, in the past, where running a chkdsk damaged a failing drive even more.) (I don't know if I have a failing drive now, though, because there are no direct indications to suggest that yet.)
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  15. Hi ,

    @jeanpave :

    > So, should I give up chkdsk after a system error reboot, or what?

    1) Re-run in safe mode .
    2) If it's OK . Stop , and re-run in "activ desktop" mode .
    3) If it's OK . Re-run in normal mode ou previous good one .

    If appear a message , use an other computer to find what it means .
    ===

    Big question , why your computer has crashed ?
    You'll have to investigate , who is the faulty : bios , processor , memory , hard drive , etc. .

    Cheers .
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  16. Member
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    [QUOTE=jeanpave;2324569]
    Originally Posted by Mr.Delusional View Post
    @jeanpave
    <snip>

    But is chkdsk useful at all, or just a waste of time?

    (A waste of time that could even create other problems? I've experienced a case or two, in the past, where running a chkdsk damaged a failing drive even more.) (I don't know if I have a failing drive now, though, because there are no direct indications to suggest that yet.)
    The short answer: Chkdsk is virtually useless and generally a waste of time. In your case, YES it could cause damage or hide other problems (such as overheating, bad power supply or failing hard drive, all of which were posted above).


    The long answer that I posted in a previous thread of yours, http://forum.videohelp.com/threads/362591-Big-Format-Issue-Is-External-HDD-Failing/page2

    "Remembered something that may be the cause of the OP's problem.

    As mentioned earlier, every hard drive has bad sectors. Windows aggravates this because chkdsk / scandisk will block out suspected bad sections of the drive and never tries to use them again (even when running scandisk /r (recovery). I've had a couple of drives "fail" because the allotted number of bad sectors was exceeded because Windows cannot / will not recover / reuse them. SpinRite was able to recover these 'failed" drives because the "bad" sectors were actually okay.


    Here's what the SpinRite site says about chkdsk / scandsk:

    Source: https://www.grc.com/sr/faq.htm

    "How does SpinRite compare to ScanDisk?

    SpinRite and ScanDisk are entirely different types of products. ScanDisk replaces the original DOS CHKDSK command, which verified the logical file system structure of the hard drive (the newer CHKDSK command no longer performs that function). Microsoft created ScanDisk because people were switching off their computers without first exiting Windows. This resulted in corruption of the file system.

    ScanDisk can also perform a read-only "scan" of a drive's surface to check for any unreadable sectors which it will then remove from use by the file system. However, ScanDisk does not perform data recovery, maintenance, or surface analysis of any kind. Unlike SpinRite, it does no data pattern testing, defect scrubbing, data relocation or unreadable sector repair and recovery. ScanDisk was never designed to perform those functions.

    If your hard drives are acting up, the best thing to do is to run SpinRite first (a quick scan at level 2 is fine) to check for and repair any obvious read-trouble on the drive. Then, knowing that the "lower-levels" of the drive are okay, run ScanDisk to check and verify the "higher-levels" of the drive's file system. SpinRite is the best and only tool for long-term low-level data integrity maintenance, and ScanDisk is a useful free tool for checking the operating system's file system at a higher level."


    As much I love SpinRite, I can't recommend it if your drive is 2TB or larger. There's a well documented error that I've recently experienced myself that causes it to fail on 2TB or larger drives. If you drive is 1.5TB or smaller, SpinRite is THE way to go to see if the drive is really good or bad. 2TB or larger will have to wait until 6.1 or 7.0 are released.


    I'd exercise caution when calling out veteran posters and bumping a thread when your questions have been thoroughly answered. Don't know if you followed or posted in Gamemanico / Gamemanico2's threads, but you're potentially headed own down the same path.
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  17. Member fritzi93's Avatar
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    Since this thread appears to have run its course...

    I certainly wouldn't say chkdsk is useless, at least in one specific situation. Bear with me.

    I have a 4 year-old SSD (OCZ Vertex). It has some peculiarities:

    1) It's impossible to update the firmware, goodness knows I've tried.
    2) It seems to develop bad sectors every 6-8 months, like clockwork. I suspect something in the firmware buggers TRIM or GC.

    Anyway, I first ran into the latter when I couldn't image the drive. Nor could I restore an image. (I back up weekly with the free Seagate version of Acronis). Time to pitch it, right? Instead, I did some digging in the OCZ forum and found out how to put the SSD in "engineering mode" by jumpering the pins on the back. That reset (and wiped) the drive. Voila! I could restore the last good image. (Mind you I also have a "gold" image, i.e. an image done after clean install with all my programs configured).

    Some months later, same thing. This time, I ran chkdsk /r and it fixed it. Meaning I could now successfully image the drive, and also restore an image.

    So now when I do a backup, running chkdsk /r is part of the preparatory routine, along with running sfc, ccleaner and scans with MBAM and SAS. You may say that it's not worth the trouble, why not replace it? Well, it takes maybe 5-10 minutes extra. And the drive has given good service otherwise.
    Pull! Bang! Darn!
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  18. Member
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    Originally Posted by aazerty View Post
    Hi ,

    @jeanpave :

    > So, should I give up chkdsk after a system error reboot, or what?

    1) Re-run in safe mode .
    2) If it's OK . Stop , and re-run in "activ desktop" mode .
    3) If it's OK . Re-run in normal mode ou previous good one .

    If appear a message , use an other computer to find what it means .
    ===

    Big question , why your computer has crashed ?
    You'll have to investigate , who is the faulty : bios , processor , memory , hard drive , etc. .

    Cheers .

    I'm trying to investigate, man, that's why I'm asking here, I'm asking people who are supposed to be much more experienced with computers.
    I don't know enough about computers to investigate a crash by myself...

    So, you see, it may be real easy for you to say "investigate"! But what do those crash reports mean? Do you know? I don't. (I've been asking people, but all most of them want to know is more and more specs of my computer.)

    P.S. Oh, and I've already done the safe-mode testing, yes. No problems, no errors there.
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  19. I'm a MEGA Super Moderator Baldrick's Avatar
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    I have cleaned the thread. Please TRY and behave. No more idiot,*******,etc comments.
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  20. I disagree strongly about chkdsk being useless or bad. Spinrite may be SLIGHTLY better, but the difference is small in the real world, and there is one absolutely, positively overriding factor - EVERYONE with Windows Already Has Scandisk, and it is ILLEGAL to use your copy of SpinRite on someone else's PC.

    A Maserati may be better than a Chevy, but few have them and for getting groceries, the difference is negligible, while the Chevy may actually be superior.

    SpinRite's time as a valuable tool has come and gone. A new drive is cheaper than the program. The amount of data potentially at risk is worth far more than the replacement for a flaky drive.
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  21. Hi ,

    @jeanpave : !!! INVESTIGATE !!! is a wide word .

    If needed :

    _ take off your memory modules . lightly clean the pins of the connectors .
    __ replace them ( changing the bank eventually )
    __ sometimes it's better , buying news one more bigger .

    _ remove dust everywhere , specially fan blades .

    _ if the PC is aged , consider changing :
    __ the thermal paste over the processor .
    __ the power supply .

    _ have a look at the dialog box "task manager" to see how is running :
    __ the processor
    __ the memory

    _ read the reports given by Windows ( i don't know the name exactly ) .

    _ enable "DrWatson" , for the future crash .

    _ etc.

    Cheers .
    Last edited by aazerty; 2nd Jun 2014 at 05:36.
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