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  1. Had no issues at all until the cable box was switched out, yesterday. with the standard box we could record anything we wanted, even popular programs.

    Have not changed anything in the hookups except for the hdmi cable now instead of coax. tried to record a show last night and got this new error. tried a different channel. thought i tricked it by hitting record while changing the channel. it cut it off 7 seconds in.

    currently using (as before) the 3 colors going from cable box to DVR, than another set from DVR to TV.

    I am trying to record standard definition channels. So why isnt it working? Do i need to call cogeco and get them to somehow remove copyright protection? Is there some other workaround i can use?

    im not trying to distribute the shows or share them online or anything like that. im just trying to be able to watch the same program later in my own home.

    I read someone elses post about trying to get the magnavox to record via "line 1" instead of "channel 3". mine is not that advanced. theres no input button on the remote for the DVR at all. its very basic.

    Anyone?? Something? This is very frusterating as I am not trying to participate in anything illegal.
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  2. Member
    Join Date: Feb 2006
    Location: United States
    Search Comp PM
    the copyright protection is in the program. your cable company cannot remove it.
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  3. Well then why was it not detected before on the exact same program?

    Thats the part im not understanding at all.
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  4. Banned
    Join Date: Oct 2004
    Location: New York, US
    Search Comp PM
    You've given no information about your old cable box or your new cable box. All we know is that you have a "cable box" and a Magnavox DVR, with no details about either. Other than that, if your old cable box was analog your cable service has been updated and your new cable box receives different programming. The digital transition involved more than just sending you a new digital image. It was also designed to prevent you from making your own recordings without renting your cable company's DVR. Even if you had their DVR, you could not make copies of its recordings or transfer them to disc or other storage. Some of the stations you receive now might not have copy protection, but often your old DVR will pick up what it thinks is a false copy protection signal.

    Perhaps some details about the models of the gear you're using could result in a better answer. The "3 colors" of wiring that you mention must refer to composite video and stereo audio (yellow, red, white). If you are now using an HD digital box, some of your standard definition broadcasts will arrive pillarboxed through that cable box output (you should be using s-video anyway, for better quality). But that's just guessing because we have no details about your hardware.
    Last edited by sanlyn; 19th Mar 2014 at 05:36.
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  5. A few months ago I read something about new video players and TV's coming out without analog connectors or analog capabilities disabled when an HDMI connection is active at the same time; I can't remember where I read it, but I found this that explains it nicely.

    You can see if this is what's happening by disconnecting the HDMI from the cable box and viewing the output of the DVR instead.
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  6. Originally Posted by nic2k4 View Post
    A few months ago I read something about new video players and TV's coming out without analog connectors or analog capabilities disabled when an HDMI connection is active at the same time; I can't remember where I read it, but I found this that explains it nicely.

    You can see if this is what's happening by disconnecting the HDMI from the cable box and viewing the output of the DVR instead.
    already thought of that and tried it... it doesnt work. same error.

    As far as what im using... the old box i can tell the exact model as its already sent back but it was motorola. This new box is "Pace"

    if i remember right, analog is where they cut out almost all channel signals, which owuld be direct coax to TV with no box... thats what my bedroom has. very few channels.

    This other setup im referring to had the box, it was digital (after the transition began we got the box to keep our channels in the main room, so it was a digital box too)... the only difference between functionality is that this one has HD capabilities as well as the red/yellow/white cords. the other one had another coax out spot which was connected to the TV instead of the HDMI. thats all thats changed as far as hookup/functionality.

    The recorder is magnavox cmwr1006

    the only thing i can think of is hooking the coax cable up directly to the recorder when i want to record but that would be a royal pain.

    I hate that so many people do illegal things that doing legal things is impossible!
    Last edited by pawprints1986; 19th Feb 2014 at 21:21.
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  7. What is the error you're getting? FYI, all colored RCA connectors are analog, except for digital audio, the orange one. The "legality" of things as nothing to do with preventing you from doing what you wish, greed however...
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  8. Originally Posted by pawprints1986 View Post
    the only thing i can think of is hooking the coax cable up directly to the recorder when i want to record but that would be a royal pain.
    Not a pain at all. If your recorder has a digital tuner that can record directly from the cable (only likely for local broadcast channels) that's your best bet. Use a Y adapter for the coax cable. Send one output to the recorder, the other to the cable box.

    Otherwise you'll need a video "clarifier" to strip the CGMS-A signal from the cable box analog output.
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  9. Member
    Join Date: Aug 2006
    Location: United States
    Search Comp PM
    I assume you are in Canada, since Cogeco operates mostly in Canada, and from what I understand, Canada allows cable service providers to do pretty much whatever they want to do regarding the copy protection placed on the programming they provide. Possibly this problem arising when it did is a coincidence and not really related to getting new equipment. Cogeco may simply have decided for some reason to change the copy protection applied to the channels you want to record at exactly the same time you decided to upgrade your cable box, and that is why you suddenly lost the ability to record them.

    Did you try connecting the coax out from the Pace cable box to the coax in on the DVD recorder, and then setting up the DVD recorder to record from channel 3 or 4 to see what happens? Is the DVD recorder able to record that way? If not then the copy protection is probably intentional on Cogeco's part and not some kind of false copy protection detection.

    Your DVD recorder does not have a digital tuner and Canadian cable services have been encrypting all digital channels for years, so you can't record anything digital that way. If you still have some analog channels you might record those by connecting the coax cable from the wall directly to the DVD recorder.

    Analog copy protection is carried in the vertical blanking interval, which is not a part of the signal that we can view on a TV, although it provides closed captioning and some other information that consumer electronics can use. If you are really desperate, there are devices known as "video stabilizers" that remove copy protection from a composite video signal. This is one example, and it is supposed to be good, but it isn't cheap. http://www.xdimax.com/grex/grex.html There is a seller on Amazon.ca http://www.amazon.ca/XDIMAX-GREX-7-4-Grex-Video-Stabilizer/dp/B00AXEOGDK/ref=sr_1_1?ie...qid=1392909532

    If you don't like that solution, then you will have to look into renting a DVR from Cogeco to be able watch programming at a more convenient time.
    Last edited by usually_quiet; 20th Feb 2014 at 10:42.
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  10. Banned
    Join Date: Oct 2004
    Location: New York, US
    Search Comp PM
    Many cable providers have encrypted the entire stream, requiring you to use a cable box to view an unscrambled signal. Therefore you won't pick up channels directly through the cable to a DVR or TV the way you formerly could. This is a trend in both the US and Canada.

    As previously mentioned, trying to use HDMI and analog outputs at the same time won't work with many cable boxes. You say you have a "Pace" cable box, but Pace makes many models. A model number will be somewhere on the case. In any event the new set top boxes output signals in ways that are different from the old analog or digital-SD boxes. Many channels broadcast a 1920x1080 HD signal; composite analog and s-video analog outputs are incapable of transmitting HD formats (component cable, however, can carry HD material). Rather, the circuitry reduces that composite or s-video signal to an SD 480-line frame that looks just like your old 4:3 signal. Wide screen images are letterboxed. An oddity that often occurs is that a 4:3 image is pillared inside a wide-screen frame. When the wide-screen, pillared image is downsampled to SD, the pillared image itself is imbedded in a letterboxed frame, so what you get is a tiny 4:3 image inside 4 black borders on the right, top, left, and bottom. That's the image that your Magnavox will record. On top of that, many of those odd images are copy-protected. Whether or not this happens with your own box depenmds on the box, but that's the way many HD boxes operate. Some channels will look "normal", i.e, a 16:9 letterboxed image in a 4:3 frame through your Magnavox. But those, too, could be copy protected.

    Using a black box between TV and recorder or between cable line and recorder is an iffy proposition. The broadcast industry continually rearranges that copy protection signal. A black box that works today might be worthless tomorrow. Many such black boxes eventually are forced to discontinue production after being hauled into court. In the long run your best bet is to find new ways to record programs.

    Two methods are available. The first is to rent the cable company's DVR. Those devices are designed with copy protection. You cannot copy or transfer the recordings to other media. That is, you can't unless you want to go through the headache of obtaining additional devices to transfer or re-record those programs to another device. The forum has several threads that discuss ways around this, but be prepared to do a lot of reading, a lot of researching, and a lot of spending.

    The other method available is to purchase recording devices designed to cope with cable box output and copy protection. Most of these devices are capable of very good to excellent copy-free recordings. However, they record to a computer, not to a DVR. Even if they could record to a DVR, it would have to be an HD DVR (good luck finding one of those in North America). Most of these devices work with the component (red-green-blue) and stereo or sometimes digital audio output and will record in HD or SD formats. A few can record via HDMI. The recording format is not MPEG ("DVD"), but usually AVCHD, which is similar to BluRay. You will have to play those recordings on the computer or with a BluRay player or an outboard media player. These players work with component, USB, and/or component connections. They will not connect with your yellow-red-white composite wire.

    Times and technology have changed. The changes are not always consumer-friendly, but are always profit-friendly. There is an advantage, however, despite all the headaches: digital HD and even digital standard definition are vastly improved over what you've been using.
    Last edited by sanlyn; 19th Mar 2014 at 05:37.
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