VideoHelp Forum
+ Reply to Thread
Results 1 to 19 of 19
Thread
  1. Member
    Join Date: Sep 2009
    Location: United States
    Search Comp PM
    Specifically, I'm talking about VHS tapes. The proper way is to have the entire length of tape on one spool and stored vertically, but does it matter which spool the tape is on (top or bottom)?

    Thanks!
    Quote Quote  
  2. Member Cornucopia's Avatar
    Join Date: Oct 2001
    Location: Deep in the Heart of Texas
    Search Comp PM
    Sort of. Matters a WHOLE LOT for analog audio tape, because it is recorded longitudinally. Much less so for analog video tape, because is is recorded helically (makes diagonals on the tape). In both cases, the way that magnetic fields imprint on adjacent layers/rolls means that when you store tapes in their common/default state (heads-out, aka spooled to the beginning on the source reel) gives you pre-echo, whereas storing tapes tails-out, aka spooled to the end on the take-up reel, gives you post-echo. And psychologically, pre-echo is MUCH more noticeable than post-echo.
    Because of the azimuth/polarity-type recording used in newer analog formats (as well as digital formats), either is nearly eliminated. And with digital formats, which use error-correction code, this is basically completely eliminated.

    So, upshot is: if you want to be anal-retentive about it, store them (VHS) tails out and then rewind before playback. Otherwise, heads-out is fine.

    Similarly, if you wanted to be a perfectionist about it, you would also "smooth-fastwind + rewind" (maybe even more than once) to exercise the tape first before playback. This helps with physically loosening the tape from its packed state making it less prone to tracking errors (supposed to redistribute/replenish the tape lubricant also, for the same reason).

    Scott
    "When will the rhetorical questions end?!" - George Carlin
    Quote Quote  
  3. Member
    Join Date: Sep 2009
    Location: United States
    Search Comp PM
    Very helpful, thank you! One question, by "smooth-fastwind + rewind", do you mean fast forwarding/rewinding it while it's playing?
    Quote Quote  
  4. Banned
    Join Date: Oct 2004
    Location: New York, US
    Search Comp PM
    -30-
    Last edited by sanlyn; 19th Mar 2014 at 04:23.
    Quote Quote  
  5. Member
    Join Date: Sep 2009
    Location: United States
    Search Comp PM
    Originally Posted by sanlyn View Post
    Originally Posted by MasterOfPuppets View Post
    Very helpful, thank you! One question, by "smooth-fastwind + rewind", do you mean fast forwarding/rewinding it while it's playing?
    N o !
    I assume then that doing that is bad for the tapes from your message. How does one "smooth-fastwind + rewind" then? My main VCR just speeds up when rewinding after a few seconds.
    Quote Quote  
  6. Banned
    Join Date: Oct 2004
    Location: New York, US
    Search Comp PM
    -30-
    Last edited by sanlyn; 19th Mar 2014 at 04:24.
    Quote Quote  
  7. Member
    Join Date: Sep 2009
    Location: United States
    Search Comp PM
    Thanks for the info everyone!
    Quote Quote  
  8. Member
    Join Date: Aug 2010
    Location: San Francisco, California
    Search PM
    Originally Posted by Cornucopia View Post
    So, upshot is: if you want to be anal-retentive about it, store them (VHS) tails out and then rewind before playback. Otherwise, heads-out is fine.
    Normal (non-HiFi) audio tracks are linear just like audiotape, so tails-out storage and rewinding before playback will decrease audible print-through.
    Quote Quote  
  9. Member Cornucopia's Avatar
    Join Date: Oct 2001
    Location: Deep in the Heart of Texas
    Search Comp PM
    @JVRaines, Yeah, pretty sure that's what I said above.

    @OP, "smooth fastwind/rewind" is a feature only available to pro reel-to-reel audio recorders and a few highest-end VTRs. In that mode, it (usually) keeps the capstan applied, but does not engage pressure of the tape onto the surface of the R/PB heads. Then it winds at a steady pace, not "accellerating" like most do. This keeps a mild amount of tension in the tape to keep it straight and to wind in a nice smooth pack (not to loose nor too tight) but doesn't incur head wear nor tape wear, and it doesn't risk the possibility of tape snapping (which happens sometimes during regular winds).
    Since you're not likely to encounter it, I probably shouldn't have mentioned it...

    Scott
    "When will the rhetorical questions end?!" - George Carlin
    Quote Quote  
  10. Member
    Join Date: Sep 2009
    Location: United States
    Search Comp PM
    Originally Posted by Cornucopia View Post
    @OP, "smooth fastwind/rewind" is a feature only available to pro reel-to-reel audio recorders and a few highest-end VTRs. In that mode, it (usually) keeps the capstan applied, but does not engage pressure of the tape onto the surface of the R/PB heads. Then it winds at a steady pace, not "accellerating" like most do. This keeps a mild amount of tension in the tape to keep it straight and to wind in a nice smooth pack (not to loose nor too tight) but doesn't incur head wear nor tape wear, and it doesn't risk the possibility of tape snapping (which happens sometimes during regular winds).
    Since you're not likely to encounter it, I probably shouldn't have mentioned it...

    Scott

    Sorry for the late reply. Thank you for the clarification!

    One more question, does it matter how you store the tapes as follows?

    Last edited by MasterOfPuppets; 24th Feb 2014 at 12:53.
    Quote Quote  
  11. Member Cornucopia's Avatar
    Join Date: Oct 2001
    Location: Deep in the Heart of Texas
    Search Comp PM
    No, but the first one is more likely to topple over by accident, being top heavy.

    Scott
    "When will the rhetorical questions end?!" - George Carlin
    Quote Quote  
  12. Member
    Join Date: Sep 2009
    Location: United States
    Search Comp PM
    Originally Posted by Cornucopia View Post
    No, but the first one is more likely to topple over by accident, being top heavy.

    Scott
    Thank you and everyone else for the information!
    Quote Quote  
  13. Banned
    Join Date: Oct 2004
    Location: New York, US
    Search Comp PM
    -30-
    Last edited by sanlyn; 19th Mar 2014 at 04:24.
    Quote Quote  
  14. It defently makes a difference for tapes that havent been played in many years thats for sure.
    Quote Quote  
  15. Member Cornucopia's Avatar
    Join Date: Oct 2001
    Location: Deep in the Heart of Texas
    Search Comp PM
    Originally Posted by sanlyn View Post
    The tape windings in the images in post #10 are uneven, with many humps and bumps. Tapes feed into the tape path more smoothly if they are rewound to the end, then to the beginning, without playing, so that the windings are more smooth. This is known as "packing" the tape. MAnmy people use this technique before capturing a tape, in order to get smoother playback for digital transfers.

    Also , if Mr. Monk saw those images he'd have a stroke.
    We kind of went over that already. I'm pretty sure the example photo given was mean to visually choose between top-resting vs. bottom-resting vertical storage. Esp. since that is the same photo, just rotated 180.

    Scott
    "When will the rhetorical questions end?!" - George Carlin
    Quote Quote  
  16. Banned
    Join Date: Oct 2004
    Location: New York, US
    Search Comp PM
    -30-
    Last edited by sanlyn; 19th Mar 2014 at 04:24.
    Quote Quote  
  17. Member
    Join Date: Sep 2009
    Location: United States
    Search Comp PM
    Originally Posted by VideoChunkster View Post
    It defently makes a difference for tapes that havent been played in many years thats for sure.
    What makes a difference?
    Quote Quote  
  18. Banned
    Join Date: Oct 2004
    Location: New York, US
    Search Comp PM
    -30-
    Last edited by sanlyn; 19th Mar 2014 at 04:24.
    Quote Quote  
  19. Member
    Join Date: Sep 2009
    Location: United States
    Search Comp PM
    Ah, got it.
    Quote Quote  



Similar Threads