I've posted about this before but what I want to know this time is if there is an easy download of a program that lets you optimize video files for youtube. I only have Vegas version 4 so it's not the most up to date.
I need something similar to Compressor on a Mac (I have Windows) that can de-interlace, undo the stretch (720x480 -> 640x480) and basically make the file a lot smaller. Upscaling to 720p would be a nice feature since I've been told many times here that enables more bitrate from youtube but it's not absolutely necessary.
Is there a basic easy to use software I could download to do this?
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Finally got a chance to play around with Vid coder. By previewing video, windows media player will not show the video for H.264 even after I downloaded FFDshow which I believe is a codec to play all these encodes in basic players like WMP.
It sounds fine but without picture, I have no idea how the video turns out.
When I preview the encode using the MPEG-4 video codec setting, I can see the video preview in Windows Media Player but it looks very choppy and jittery, like it's missing a bunch of frames. I've selected "keep framerate" and then tried 29.97 (which the NTSC video is). The 29.97 setting seems to help but it still doesn't look as smooth and fluid as the actual avi file.
It also freezes and windows shuts it down whenever I try to preview a 2 pass encode, fyi. -
Depends on what your definition of "optimize" is
When people say "optimize for youtube", that usually includes higher quality deinterlacing, stabilization, specific denoising , levels corrections, high quality upscaling without aliasing, among other things. No "easy to use" program will offer all of these. There is going to be some trade offs involved here
For your current problems, the reason it doesn't seem smooth is you're probably starting from DV-AVI source, which is 59.94 fields per second. WMP automatically bob deinterlaces this to 59.94 FRAMES per second. 29.97 FRAMES per second is half the frames, so it looks choppy. Sites like youtube only support up to 30FPS, so you have no options unless you use another host that doesn't re-encode
For playback , you probably don't have a directshow mp4 splitter installed, like haali media splitter. Also, your computer specs might be too old to handle AVC, even SD -
It is a DV capture rendered into an AVI file. So is double frame rate in WMP just a preview thing or do I need to do something so that it doesn't take out half the frames of the actual file?
I went ahead and rendered one of my shortest videos with H.264. Unlike the preview, I could play this rendered file just fine in WMP and it looks smoothed out and glossier yet the video noise appears to be more noticable. The fuzzy look is probably due to deinterlacing but I'm not sure if I like that trade off. I've uploaded it to youtube as a test file. Seems ok but I did get a message after uploading that the video audio may be out of sync.
http://youtu.be/JZ8ZB3sgsb8
here's the actual upload for comparison which was just straight from the AVI file. I did add the 4:3 stretch code to make it display 640 instead of 720x 480.
http://youtu.be/JZk2rtcgrhwLast edited by Knightmessenger; 8th Nov 2011 at 17:39.
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The double frame rate is normal for interlaced video ; that's how interlaced video should look. If you play directly from your camera and hook it up to the TV it will look like that. Each field is unique and becomes a frame when it's bob deinterlaced. So you're watching 59.94 FRAMES per second , but each field isn't a "real" frame - it's more like a half frame. It only contains part of the information of a true frame, that's why you get "jaggies" and deinterlacing artifacts
The quality in WMP playback isn't the best, because it's meant for realtime playback and needs to be fast. It will noticably be smoother. Slower deinterlacing algorithms (e.g. in avisynth) attempt to interpolate the missing information, and quality is better
This is a very old bob deinterlacing comparison, and slowed down, but it gets the point across. You can right click to save, and play in a media player
https://forum.videohelp.com/images/guides/p1934885/stockholma_0-520_q3_yadif_mvbobmod_t...mca4_tdtmm.avi
Single rate deinterlacing means you throw out 1/2 the information. ie. You only keep 1/2 the fields and these become frames , so 59.94 fields/s becomes 29.97 frames/s
Double rate deinterlacing or bobbing means you keep all the temporal information. Essentially each field becomes a frame so 59.94 fields/s becomes 59.94 frames/s
If your final goal is youtube, you have no choice between single or double rate. Even if you upload a 59.94p video, youtube will throw out 1/2 of the frames. But in that example you could smooth it the motion subjectively by using a software stabilizer, so even at 29.97 it will look more pleasant. Stabilizing also means fewer differences between frames , so this means better quality per frame at a given bitrate - that's why it's one of the items listed in the list above in my earlier post. For shooting , if you had used a steadicam , stabilization rig, or tripod, you wouldn't need (or as much) software stabilization. Software stabilization has list of pros and cons as well - it's not all fun and games
yet the video noise appears to be more noticable. The fuzzy look is probably due to deinterlacing but I'm not sure if I like that trade off
PS: nice Boba Fett costume!Last edited by poisondeathray; 8th Nov 2011 at 18:08.
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I understand what interlaced video is. Is there a way with Vid Coder to combine both fields into 1 frame and thus half the video isn't discarded by youtube? What did you think of the differences in the two video samples?
I don't have a stedicam but I have found simply having the camera attached to a small tripod without the legs stretched out helps as a counterweight and has roughly the same effect. -
I don't use vidcoder, but this technique is called blend deinterlacing, you usually don't want to do that. Arguably it's the worst type of deinterlacing because everything is blurry as hell and looks double image or "ghosting" (a 50-50 mix of adjacent fields).
What did you think of the differences in the two video samples?
I don't have a stedicam but I have found simply having the camera attached to a small tripod without the legs stretched out helps as a counterweight and has roughly the same effect. -
if your source is interlaced use the decomb default filter in vidcoder, as it uses yadif in slower mode on only interlaced artifacts. the same result can be had with deinterlace in slower mode but it will affect all frames interlaced or not, so make sure your source is interlaced before using it.
--
"a lot of people are better dead" - prisoner KSC2-303 -
are there any other settings that are best for youtube uploading? I'm particularly unsure about the Quality setting under the video tab. Target size, avg bitrate and constant quality, I think I understand what all those mean but I'm not sure which will do best or what settings I should give.
Like is 70097 bitrate and 256 mb target size more data than youtube will ultimately use and therefore a lower setting might have the upload not get as much discarded? -
I went ahead and posted the latest video I had ready after encoding it. Very disappointed in the final output as it stutters like crazy. I understand the video noise and shakiness of the camera don't help but to have it so jerky and not maintain the fluid motion it had originally makes it all for naught.
http://youtu.be/32qQVvtkt0s
Everything else about the video is good. The picture isn't darkened for no good reason, the picture looks fairly sharp for such a highly compressed file, there aren't jaggies and there is not a lot of blockyness. -
Originally Posted by YouTube
Strangely, that particular message only appears on the new upload page for YouTube.
See here for more details:
http://www.google.com/support/youtube/bin/answer.py?answer=1297408
That YouTube message did my head in when I saw it first time until I read the above link.
So I went back to the previous uploader: http://upload.youtube.com/my_videos_upload?forceui=3Last edited by mike20021969; 9th Nov 2011 at 06:58.
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Knightmessenger, sorry to be off-topic, but how did you upload a nearly 17 minute video to YouTube? Are you allowed to upload videos of any length? Do you have some sort of special account? 15 minutes (really 16 minutes) is the usual maximum allowed length for us mere mortals. And, of course, as pdr says, the problems caused by an interlaced 29.97fps video being reduced to progressive 29.97fps are dwarfed by the lack of a steady picture to begin with. That thing looks nasty and all that shaking drastically reduces the overall quality because all that unnecessary camera movement takes many bits to encode, bits that would otherwise have been used in the rest of the video.
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Apparently you just enter your cell phone #
http://www.techkamal.com/how-to-increase-youtube-video-time-length-limit-to-infinity/#axzz1dFAQ8KQB -
Oh, thanks. I didn't know that. Now all I need is a mobile phone (over my dead body).
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I've noticed YouTube de-interlaces all uploads with a resolution of 854x480 or lower - even if the video is flagged as progressive.
They don't even use a decent de-interlacing filter like YADIF, but instead drop every other line which halves the vertical resolution...
*slow handclap* -
I got message while uploading to Youtube that I am enabled to upload videos longer than 15 minutes, not heavy poster, total about 15 videos, not so many viewed, not sure what the criterias are ...
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1 original video
2 youtube video
3 bob deinterlaced (if youtube applied a simple field resize this is what it would look like)
No loss of resolution in #2 when looking at the resolution patches, just the typical compression artifacts -
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_MU1KM7Ojus
Watching the video at 480p on YT (with the player expanded) and the downloaded .flv shows half the vertical resolution.
Here's the video I uploaded: -
I'm going to guess it's a PAL 25FPS issue, that might incite YT to butcher it
I re-encoded your source video with 29.97, and it looks fine (look at the 480p version)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h0FoH4wo8mc
I'll do some more tests, there might be other factors causing it to deinterlace it -
25fps re-encoded looks fine too....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jiiy7A9QswA
Might be an encoding or container issue signalling YT to deinterlace (different mp4 wrapper like mp42 vs isom)
EDIT:
Nope, even your original looks fine uploaded on my standard account
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mkY3bGmETI8
Maybe they don't like you ? -
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It's gets deleted immediately after upload as it's detected as a duplicate. Changing the filename doesn't work. I want to keep the original there as a reference, but I've uploaded a new test which works properly:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HkJwpEOORag
When did you upload the file? Maybe they changed some processing that day? (they always make changes to stuff)
No idea what date the bug first surfaced and if it affected all users though. -
It's gets deleted immediately after upload as it's detected as a duplicate. Changing the filename doesn't work.
Another finding (at least it's new to me; I don't use YT that much), is that 720p versions get allocated more audio bitrate than their SD counterparts. It used to be the same as far as I can recall. A 480p version might get ~128kbps but 720p gets ~150kbps . That's another good reason to upscale SD sources for YT IMO -
Youtube allows me to upload videos longer than 15 min also and I never gave my cell number. My videos are clean and are all original content, so I assume that has something to do with it...............
Got my retirement plans all set. Looks like I only have to work another 5 years after I die........ -
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