AVI with DIVx or XVid codec?

[Sierraguy]

I'm batch converting a ton of Mpeg-2 files to AVI to be streamed to an XBox 360 and Samsung BD-C5500 via TVersity on XP Media Center Ed on P4 2.8ghz / 4gb RAM. (I'll be upgrading the PSU and Video card to an Nvidia Cuda-based card...) I can run some of the conversions on my laptop (i7-820QM, 8gb RAM). The MPeg-2 files I have don't allow for ffd/rwd and it gets frustrating starting from the beginning of a movie if tVersity hiccups. I need AC-3 (5.1 if avail)... For the record and as a disclaimer, these are all movies I personally own.

I've seen the pros and cons of XVid and DivX but only in posts that are years old.

What is the current opinion on XVid vs DivX in an AVI container? highest quality, ease/speed of encoding... I know there is a trade-off. I know.. Mkv, H.264 etc, but XVid or DivX in an AVI container common between the two devices.

Soooo... For the experts, in an AVI container, which would you use and what encoding tool... Something that will keep the video/audio settings of the original file so I can batch these runs. Possibly a tool that is current and supported... Most on the "tools" page are years old. I've been trying DVDFab Converter... AVI.Net and AutoGK take 3 hours per file for a 2-pass run.


On a side note.. I own DivX Plus converter if necessary... But that thing appears to be as slow as molasses!!!! Running it makes me feel like I'm back in my 486 DX2/66 days...

[manono]

I've been trying DVDFab Converter... AVI.Net and AutoGK take 3 hours per file for a 2-pass run.

Then don't run 2 passes. Do 1-pass Q-based VBR encodes. In AutoGK that would be Target Percentage, with the default 75% being a good number. It'll cut the overall time considerably, although not in half. There's lots more involved than just the video encoding.

[Sierraguy]

So do you recommend XVid or DivX in the AVI container? For quality... Speed...

And will running a single pass at 75% avoid the video degradation I see in the conversion profiles for DVDFab. I mean DVDFab takes a 720x480 mpeg-2 file and explicitly crops the frame size and resolution... Sometimes down into the 4xx by 3xx range..

I don't want to drop resolution in the AVI just to force the player to upconvert it again. It's like the photocopy scheme... Shrink - expand - shrink - ... and you will lose quality.

Which tool do you recommend? Are there any that are still supported? Even if they aren't opensource? I tried "Any Video Converter" and it compressed the heck out of the AVI so much you could tell when displayed on a fullsize TV...

[manono]

So do you recommend XVid or DivX in the AVI container? For quality... Speed...

I don't really recommend anything. Xvid will give good results in a much faster time as compared to x264 which will give better results for the same file size, or the same quality for a much smaller file size, and take a lot longer doing it.

And will running a single pass at 75% avoid the video degradation I see in the conversion profiles for DVDFab.

I don't (and won't) use DVDFab for anything but decrypting newer movies to the hard drive, so I don't know the answer to that question. However, a 75% XviD encode is slightly better than an average quant 3 and is generally considered to be pretty good quality. Try it and compare. I think AutoGK uses 720 widths for its Target Quality encodes so if you want, say, a 640 width with a smaller file size, set it in the Advanced Settings.,

Which tool do you recommend?

Me? Personally? I don't use any all-in-ones. I do it all manually. However, for ease of use, and for getting good results when you're just starting out, and if you want XviD or DivX AVIs, it's hard to beat AutoGK.

[Sierraguy]

Ya know, in 5 lines of a response you have helped more than the "experts" in the DVDFab forum did in 3 paragraphs of telling me I know nothing and am looking for a handoout.

If MediaInfo shows that the aspect ratio is 720x480 (4:3) then the encoder (autoGK) should carry that into the Xvid in the AVI container right? And not result in cropping and degraded resolution... I'm being told that because I don't have the original IFO then I am out of luck... Because the Mpeg-2 doesn't have the aspect ratio flag...
Does Media Info calculate the Aspect Ratio or read it from the Mpeg container?

I'm just trying to avoid destroying quality by converting to the AVI format I need. My players (xbox and samsung c5500 bluray) will give me full ffwd/rwnd in AVI format coming off of TVersity. In Mpeg format, no such lock. Any hiccup in the video stream and the player will drop the stream entirely and it will have to be restarted from the beginning. Mass conversion of my library to AVI gives me my original audio track with ffwd/rwd/etc... Other formats supported, i.e. mp4, are only supported on the XBox with 2 channel audio...

I'm trying to convert to a format that is portable... And the AVI (xvid/divx) is supported by booth of my devices...

Sound like a sane path to follow? Am I missing anything?
You did sell me on not using DVDFab for conversion. The support sucks.. And tools like AutoGK are at least beloved by a larger population... And more helpful!

[manono]

If MediaInfo shows that the aspect ratio is 720x480 (4:3) then the encoder (autoGK) should carry that into the Xvid in the AVI container right?

If from a DVD source it won't get played in that aspect ratio (3:2), but get resized (if 4:3) to some 1.33:1 ratio. AutoGK will do the same - crop and then resize to some 1.33:1 ratio such as 640x480. If you want 720x480 (720/480=1.5=3:2) and want your player to do the resize, it's possible with AutoGK, but I'd recommend a different program.

I'm being told that because I don't have the original IFO then I am out of luck... Because the Mpeg-2 doesn't have the aspect ratio flag...

Being told by whom? AutoGK will take either IFO or VOB input. If you have multiple VOBs, load the first one and the rest get loaded automatically. VOBs carry their own DAR flag. Sometimes, very rarely, that DAR may be different from that in the IFOs, and since DVD players usually get the DAR from the IFOs, it's possible to wind up with the wrong aspect ratio when using AutoGK. If that ever happens to you (and the chances are it won't), you can change the DAR in the Hidden Options (CTRL-F9).

And tools like AutoGK are at least beloved by a larger population... And more helpful!

Well, I do have a dog in this hunt, as they say, being a mod at a different forum, a mod for GK and AutoGK. So I'm not entirely impartial. There are other good and similar programs you may or may not want to try, ones such as StaxRip, avi.NET, XviD4PSP, and others.

[jagabo]

In my opinion Xvid is slightly better than Divx at similar settings. The one place where Divx has an advantage is with the fastest settings (which normally you would only use in single pass mode for video capture). Divx's fastest settings are twice as fast as Xvid's.

[PuzZLeR]

Well, maybe I have a dog in the hunt too, since I'm a Mod of the DivX Forums (for when they're running.) But I will be impartial, and this is what most Mods would say anyway honestly.

I personally use DivX, but will say that Xvid is very good too. I have my opinions, but Jagabo's comparison of quality and speed are pretty much a common opinion among many.

Both codecs have differences only really due to the quality of the encoder (and maybe some stamps in the stream) but are both compliant MPEG-4 ASP in an AVI and fully compatible with each other, and will work in the same devices ceteris paribus. However, although they don't discourage use of it, DivX can't guarantee compatibility of the Xvid codec on a DivX Certified device simply because they have no control over it or its profiles. But having said that, especially if you avoid GMC and QPel, you shouldn't have a problem if you wish to use Xvid with a similar profile.

As for the tool to use, you did not really purchase DivX Converter in a way, only the codec. Converter exists in your package as a token bonus encoder for completion and a starter tool to get the hang of encoding if you're a newbie, and to ensure compliance with devices. But serious encoders do move on to other apps, such as those suggested, but I personally will recommend it old-school with VirtualDub, and VirtualDubMod for batching, etc. It may be in the "old pages" but it's still excellent today, and the best (in my opinion) for full control DivX/Xvid encoding.

About using 720x480 resolution, be careful. DvD uses non-square pixels to have a perfect 4:3 ratio. If you don't take this into account with MPEG-4, and AVI, you will have a square pixel aspect ratio (PAR) of 1:1 on a 720x480 resolution and it will look distorted compared to the source. You must encode anamorphic or adjust the PAR flag with an MPEG-4 tool. Or you can encode with PAR=1:1, but change the resolution to 640x480 to keep the aspect ratio of 4:3. Your choice.

But keep in mind, some players, especially the older ones, won't recognize this flag and will assume PAR=1:1 regardless of what you use. This is not a problem with DivX/Xvid/AVI, but simply a bad decoder or a defect (as Manono would say ) with the player.

I will also highly recommend using one-pass quality based encoding as Manono did. This will save you lots of time and get you the quality you want and you don't have to fiddle and mess with different bitrates in your testing. Two-pass is really only good for an exact file size, and was very useful during the "burn-it-on-a-CD" days. Today it's just as passé as using your old 486 for video.

[jagabo]

I would recommend Target Quantizer (constant quality) encoding too. You always get the quality you ask for. There's no guessing about what bitrate appropriate for the particular video.

[PuzZLeR]

I would recommend Target Quantizer (constant quality) encoding too. You always get the quality you ask for. There's no guessing about what bitrate appropriate for the particular video.

I always say, especially for people that may be new to it that exact bitrate encoding for all video is like trying to fit the same clothing size on all humans.

Constant quality encoding and a quality level is like a fit and a fashion - it ensures that no human will wear anything too tight or too loose, and every square inch of fabric will be used optimally regardless of how much will be needed.