Comcast HDTV and DVR recorders

[Jestak]

Greetings,

I have a few questions and I hope someone will have the definitive answers:

I have COMCAST HDTV. I use their HD DVR Motorolla.
I was using the Panasonic DMR-50H model to record from non HD channels until last week when a lighning hit and destroyed it.

1 - Is it possible to buy a DVR that can record HD channels on COMCAST? if yes, can you point me to a DVR that can record COMCAST HD channels? Also, will it be able to select channels, have integrated TV Guide like the Panasonic I had?
2 - If it is not possible to record HD channels, if I buy a normal "low-res" DVR, after the turn to digital in 2009, will it still work or will it stop to be able to record?

Thank you

[MozartMan]

If you want to record HD from cable in original quality without re-encoding try this:

http://replayguide.sourceforge.net/dct6412/index.html

It works perfect for me. Also, some channels are not recordable, like HBO-HD.

[CrazyCanuck]

If you are looking for a DVD recorder that records HD, only the Japan market have a few models ($2,000 and up), nothing in the Americas yet. If you've been reading the post on where the HDD recorders have gone, I suspect that we will not get any HD recorders here, only PVRs. I'll be looking at Jestak option very closely.

[CrazyCanuck]

Sorry Jestak, I meant MozartMan's option.

[Jestak]

Greetings,

ok, thanks guys. So what about question #2? If I buy a normal one, will it work just as fine as now when the move to digital will be done? right now, the panasonic has a tv guide that auto update and it makes it easy to record new programs.

Thank you

[CrazyCanuck]

Hi again, short answer, no the tv guide feature will not work on any dvd recorder with that feature. The TV Guide feature runs on NTSC analog feeds, once the US goes digital (ATSC) in February 2009 (August 2011 in Canada), the tv guide will not work anymore. We will need to record via the AV input lines with our NTSC-based recorders.

[Jestak]

Greetings,

Ok, the TV Guide will no longer works. Another question: Will the channel tuner will work, so at least the DVR can change automatically channel and not be used like with Direct TV and you need to sep up manually the channel with the satellite box and setup the DVR on channel 3 all the time?

Thank you

[CrazyCanuck]

Sorry again, the NTSC tuners will not work, as you described, we'll have to set the channel manually on the box and then set the DVR on the appropriate line input (L1, AV-1 and so on) not sure what would happen on channel 3 as I never tried that, I record my PVR via S-Video line input, I think that channel 3 will be dead also.

Basically our old dvd recorders will need to be operated like "tunerless" recorders.

[Jestak]

Greetings,

Thank you very much for the answers!
So, bottom line, we'll be stuck with the rentals from the telecom companies. There is nothing on the market that will work after the transition.

I am still puzzled a little bit because COMCAST is advertising that if you are a COMCAST customer, you don't have to do anything when the conversion to digital will occur. It is false I guess because all thoise customers with no digital box and still using their TV/VCR/DVR tuners won't work anymore.

Thank you

[usually_quiet]

Greetings,

ok, thanks guys. So what about question #2? If I buy a normal one, will it work just as fine as now when the move to digital will be done? right now, the panasonic has a tv guide that auto update and it makes it easy to record new programs.

Thank you

If you are recording OTA, a Dish DTVPal converter box may be useful. I purchased one for mainly for watching TV, but with the hope that I might also be able to record using its timers and my analog devices if I wanted to. It isn't perfect, but it is pretty decent, though somewhat more expensive than other CCEB's once tax and shipping are added. It's the only one I know of that has event timers and claims to provide TVGOS support.

I don't own anything using TVGOS, so I can't say how well it works. There are some reviews for it online if you Google it. I can't remember which ones have information about the use of TVGOS with this box.

[edit] To clarify, I am using an antenna with this box, not cable. It is useless for digital cable.

[edDV]

Greetings,

Thank you very much for the answers!
So, bottom line, we'll be stuck with the rentals from the telecom companies. There is nothing on the market that will work after the transition.

I am still puzzled a little bit because COMCAST is advertising that if you are a COMCAST customer, you don't have to do anything when the conversion to digital will occur. It is false I guess because all thoise customers with no digital box and still using their TV/VCR/DVR tuners won't work anymore.

Thank you

I'm unfamiliar with the "TV Guide" on the Panasonic DMR-50H, but nothing major is happening to cable analog channels in Feb 2009. Secondary issues are going to lead to a reduction of cable network analog channels but the local analogs will stay as they are until the situation is evaluated again in 2012.

Locals will also be available as digital MPeg2 using QAM (not ATSC) modulation. Your tuner would need to support unencrypted QAM tuning direct from the cable (no cable box required).

Few cable systems still get the local broadcast signals off air. Most already have a digital microwave/fiber feed from the local broadcaster and that is encoded to analog NTSC by the cable system. None of that changes in 2009.

[wabjxo]

I am still puzzled a little bit because COMCAST is advertising that if you are a COMCAST customer, you don't have to do anything when the conversion to digital will occur. It is false I guess because all thoise customers with no digital box and still using their TV/VCR/DVR tuners won't work anymore.

What they say is true since the ONLY thing that'll change in Feb 2009 is the OTA/antenna signal will be all-digital, except for some low-power stations, etc.

With cable or sat, you *should* see NO changes except maybe some new digital channels. Your cableco is prob. already converting some digital channels to analog for their analog-only subscribers. Some cablecos actually send only analog even tho they charge more for "digital pkgs" (as described in this post).

Cable subscribers are supposed to continue receiving their "normal" stuff until at least 2012... the only unknown is how and if cablecos and sat providers will try to "take advantage" of the situation to try and rent their boxes any way they can, incl. dropping all unscrambled channels except the ones they have to carry for emergencies, etc. (locals).

With a digital-tunered DVDR like the Philips DVDR 3576, you can receive any digital channels via antenna or cable that aren't scrambled, now and in the future. You won't need a digital converter box wherever you have a 3576.

Click my signature for more info.

[CrazyCanuck]

OK, I get a better picture of the issue, I've always thought (my error) that Comcast was a cable box based service only, didn't really think about just pure cable feed without a box. In that case, cable companies might have a grace period where they can send the analog feed along the digital feed, but that might be only for a limited time before they shut the whole analog feed down for TV broadcast. that would be the only way to be able to continue using NTSC tuner equipment. Does this mean that we'll still be able to use TV Guide (TVGOS)? Not sure anymore, we might be lucky for a while. I guess we have to wait and see what happens when they'll "pull" the switch.

[wabjxo]

CBS has bought Gemstar, who provides all TVGOS systems, and they're supposed to "broadcast" a digital TVGOS signal somehow... don't know details or if it's actually working now, but there *should* be something in the future provided by CBS either OTA or ???

Technically, cablecos can continue to send their signals to subscribers any way they want, essentially, as long as it's over their physical cable lines... virtually no one will be authorized to send analog signals over the airwaves (OTA) after Feb 2009, thus converter boxes need, but then again, only for receiving digital channels thru an antenna (OTA).

The govt messed up in the beginning by claiming analog signals can no longer be "broadcast" which meant "over-the-airwaves in analog waveform" since cablecos don't really "broadcast" their signals and satellite companies send their signals via microwave uplink and downlink. Neither really "broadcasts" their signals over the airwaves.

[edDV]

OK, I get a better picture of the issue, I've always thought (my error) that Comcast was a cable box based service only, didn't really think about just pure cable feed without a box. In that case, cable companies might have a grace period where they can send the analog feed along the digital feed, but that might be only for a limited time before they shut the whole analog feed down for TV broadcast. that would be the only way to be able to continue using NTSC tuner equipment. Does this mean that we'll still be able to use TV Guide (TVGOS)? Not sure anymore, we might be lucky for a while. I guess we have to wait and see what happens when they'll "pull" the switch.

In the USA, the FCC has mandated that cable analog service for the locals be maintained until 2012. There are hardship exceptions for small 550MHz cable systems that allow them to go "all digital" so long as "basic analog" customers are given a cable box without additional fee.

In Canada, things are moving slower. There is no rush to eliminate analog OTA NTSC broadcasts.

[usually_quiet]

On further thought, what I wrote before is misleading.

There are instructions for setting up the DTVPal to work in conjunction with a TV or recording device currently using analog TVGOS, even if one is going to watch/record the signal from a cable box or cable.

Also, when turned off, the DTVPal will allow analog cable signals to pass through. (I don't know if the same thing happens to digital signals. I'll have to borrow a digital TV to test it.) When turned on, the DTVPal's analog pass-through feature does not work with cable, and of course it can't convert a digital cable signal, per the regulations governing CECB's.

[Jestak]

Greetings,

Where is the best place to buy a Panasonic DVDR with hard drive in USA on Internet? Panasonic website is useless (as usual), Amazon has almost nothing, Walmart either.

I am used with a Panasonic and I liked it. I noticed Walmart has the Philips
http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product.do?product_id=10059151

Would you recommend the Philips over the panasonic? (I can relearn how to program those crappy things...heheh. BUt I would prefer not).

Thank you

[wabjxo]

Well, I've got three of last year's Philips model, the 3575, and I highly recommend the new 3576, Much simpler than Panny, Pio or Toshiba, but gets the job done very nicely for me and many others.

Click my signature for lots of organizaed info.

[usually_quiet]

I don't think Panasonic makes any HDD DVD recorders for the US market anymore, just plain DVD recorders now.

I have been drooling over the Philips for a while now. Looks like they might be gone before I can scrape together the cash to buy one.

[wabjxo]

I wouldn't count them out for next year yet, cuz they say in their press release they'll stop "development work in September" which might mean the next-gen unit is in the works, but it'll be the last they design and develop.

They also say they'll stop producing DVD recorders "after 2009" as yet another clue that 2009 MIGHT be the last year for one of these... just can't COUNT on it, I suppose!

[jagabo]

I think unusually_quite's view is closest to reality:

https://forum.videohelp.com/topic350882.html#1861748

most US cable providers will soon switch to encrypted digital service with cable boxes... The reduction of analog cable channels has already begun in my area

Cable companies will soon only transmit the required OTA channels as analog. The question is, how soon?

[edDV]

I think unusually_quite's view is closest to reality:

https://forum.videohelp.com/topic350882.html#1861748

most US cable providers will soon switch to encrypted digital service with cable boxes... The reduction of analog cable channels has already begun in my area

Cable companies will soon only transmit the required OTA channels as analog. The question is, how soon?

And the other side of the argument is found in the AVS Comcast forums where digital customers are demanding more HD channels at higher bit rates. Currently nearly half the cable system bandwidth goes to the ~$35/mo. extended analog customer. The $100+/mo. HD plan customers wants more and better HD content or they will switch to another service.

[usually_quiet]

Comcast's pricing must be different where edDV lives. Where I am, basic analog cable is $12.45 for what will soon be 18 channels. However, more subscribers have Comcast's Standard analog cable, which runs $55 for what will become 55 channels next month. For $59 (plus $5 for a cable box), Digital Starter will provide 65 channels. Of course there are a few more levels of digital service beyond that. For $9 HD can be added to any of the other packages, digital or analog. What is available in HD varies according to the digital/analog packages one has subscribed to. There are people who have packages totalling $100 or more a month, but I suspect they are less than 20% of the total.

What irks me most is that Comcast has raised rates for analog customers while cutting the number of analog channels available, and advertising that nothing will change for us. In this area, antenna reception is frequently not good and even satellite doesn't always work well. Cable has been entrenched here for over 30 years. Verizon is moving in but isn't yet available everywhere. That's lucky for Comcast because a lot of people are fed up with them.

[edDV]

Yep the $35/mo. price for "extended" analog is ancient. Just looked. "Basic" analog is now $15.50 and "Standard" analog is now $51.65. With these packages and a QAM capable tuner you can also get the digital locals including HD when broadcast in HD.

The digital plan levels are now (box extra)

"Digital Starter" $52.65/mo.
"Digital Preferred" $86.59/mo.
"Digital Preferred Plus" $99.60/mo.
"Digital Premiere" $114.60/mo.

HD adds $8/mo. *
Add HBO to any of the lower 3 and you hit $100/mo.


*Current HD offering here is 7 locals plus 25 cable HD plus 2 regional sports HD plus 5 extra cost premium HD channels (HBO,etc.)

Each analog channel dropped allows 2 or 3 digital HD channels to be added.

[lacywest]

Interesting ...

Here is one at J and R Audio ... but it is PAL ... http://www.jr.com/panasonic/pe/PAN_DMREH67

Also at J and R Audio >> Pioneer DVR-550H-S Multi-System DVD Recorder with Built-in Hard Drive

160GB Hard Drive / Up to 455 hours recording time / 7 Recording Modes / Analogue TV Tuner / HDMI Interface / DV Terminal IEEE1394 ... Link >>> http://www.jr.com/pioneer/pe/PIO_DVR550HS

Read This >>> http://www.amazon.com/review/R3T9GFBP54SFIR/ref=cm_cr_pr_viewpnt#R3T9GFBP54SFIR

10 of 10 people found the following review helpful:
Excellent for the US market!, April 22, 2008
By Regina Walter "DVDwoman"

The previous review on this item, where it is stated that this unit does not work in the U.S. is completely inaccurate. The unit will play and record in both Pal and NTSC (US market). It has innitial settings that allow the user to select either of these formats and also to play on a television for either. The user just needs to set those settings to NTSC for both record and play. The unit does come with PAL as the default setting but there is simple code you input into the remote that changes it to NTSC. At that point, it is fully functional for the US market. All controls work in the US as well as the timer record. The only difference is that in inputting the date and time, you must rememeber that it uses military time, thus 11 PM is 23:00 hours and the date is recorded in terms of day / month / year. All the menus are in english and it is far better than units previous sold in the US. It has a DV input, and also can be used as a music jukebox. It still offers and manual mode that allows the user to adjust the bitrate to fit your project perfect on a disc. It is superior in editing than any other machine, you can cut cut clips from any part of a title. It works with all discs including both dual layer formats and automatically moves to the second layer when dubbing from the HDD to the media. It is the only unit to do this. It has 12 bit video, thus the image is better. It is superior with menu creation on discs. It also includes the former remote control that users loved. It is the best DVD/HDD machine on the market and works perfect in the U.S.


Panasonic is still making DVD Recorders with Hard drives in them ... but are not available in the USA ... bummer

PANASONIC DMR-EX88EB-K
Huge recording capacity with this Panasonic Diga series DVD recorder with 400GB hard drive. Featuring an integrated digital tuner, 7 day electronic programme guide, full HD 1080p Up-Conversion and a SD memory card slot.

Link >>>
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Link >>>
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[Jestak]

Greetings,

Did I read somewhere the Philips can record from digital channels because it has a digital tuner?
if so, does that mean the digital channels on COMCAST (100 and more) could be recorded too?

Thank you all of you guys for the enlighting answers.

[jagabo]

It has ATSC (over the air) and QAM (cable) digital tuners. You will only be able to get "clear" (unencrypted) QAM channels -- likely limited to your local broadcast stations and a few others. Most of the digital cable channels are encrypted so you will not be able to view them with the QAM tuner.

[wabjxo]

Greetings,

Did I read somewhere the Philips can record from digital channels because it has a digital tuner?
if so, does that mean the digital channels on COMCAST (100 and more) could be recorded too?

Thank you all of you guys for the enlighting answers.

The Philips 3575 and 3576 can record any analog or digital channel that's not scrambled.

Here's a post with some more info.

[zoobie]

What irks me most is that Comcast has raised rates for analog customers while cutting the number of analog channels available.

Exactly...and also downgrades the PQ

Comcast absolutely blows and with their shoddy marketing and legal practices are soon to break into the top 10 worst companies in the USA

[jagabo]

What irks me most is that Comcast has raised rates for analog customers while cutting the number of analog channels available.

Exactly...and also downgrades the PQ

How else are they going to make their too low bitrate digital channels look better!