VHS to DVD 4 methods?

[sonomablue]

Hi All,

(I posted this in the sticky forum, but in case some folks don't go into older threads, i wanted to double post, to insure some answers. I have belonged to other forums, and i ackknowledge that double posting is usually a no-no. However, it is because of my familiarity with other forums, knowing that some people don't read posts in old threads, that i submit this twice. I will not double post again. Thanks).

I am new to this forum. I have read many posts, did not yet find the type of answer that i was hoping for, so i figured it best to ask my own question(s).

Yes, like others, i have many family VHS tapes that i want to copy to DVD. (I would also like to be able to edit them (cut out bad sections, add table of contents, combine portions from multiple VHS tapes into one DVD, to send out to family, etc.)

I have done some minimal research. Seems like there are (at least) 4 ways to accomplish this. (1) Video capture card in my PC. (2) Analog Capture device. (3) DV Camera. (4) standalone VHS to DVD burner (sony, jvs, samsung, etc.).

(1) I have heard, and read, that there can be problems with (#1) video capture card). Timing/lag issues. for me, i would rather not buy another card for my PC, just personal preference.

(2) I have been leaning towards a video capture device. But in reading this forum, amazon product review comments, cnet product review comments, and other message board comments, there seems to be as many compaints and problems, as there are positive comments. For almost every product out there, there is usually 2 or 3 raving wonderful comments. And then there are the negative comments, people with problems. I really do not want to go through a multitude of problems. I don't mind, at all, dealing with configuration questions and issues. But i do not want to buy Product-ABC, have it not work, and then buy XYZ, and still be dissatisfied. I want something that really works.

(3) I do not have a DV camera, and would rather not invest the money in one (now) just for the sake of using it as a converter device for VHS to DVD conversion.

(4) I had never considered a standalone VHS to DVD recorder, until i read some posts in this forum. I have always thought that a standalone would be decent for a complete copy, but that you would not be able to edit the final product. It 'seems' like, if i understand the posts, that you can edit the final product on your PC.

Oh, one other minor part of my requirements. I want to do this as inexpensively, as possible. I am (currently) hoping to spend between $100 - $200, and end up with a workable solution. I realize that software (for editing) might be additional.

Lastly, i am very pc literate (have had different PCs since 1986, and am very comfortable with many applications. My current desktop is a Dell Dimension XP system that i have had for years. I have recently ordered an HP Pavillion quad core system. However, editing video is one thing that i have never attempted, so i have no idea how it is done, and with what products.

My questions, to start with, are the following three.

(A) with all of your experience (with copying VHS to DVD, using many different devices, and different software) what method would you NOW recommend to me ? (someone who is new to the process).

(b) I it possible to edit (on a windows pc) the DVD movie that was created via a standalone VHS - DVD recorder?

(c) Realizing that my current preferences are #2 and #4 above. Which of those two would be preferable, and why?

thank you for your thoughts and suggestions.

[jman98]

I've never seen anybody given a waiver to double post, so expect one of your posts to be locked.

A shrinking number of DVD recorders sold in the USA have hard drives with some editing capabilities. We had a recent series of posts about a specific Pioneer model that some people like. Maybe that would work for you.

I almost never capture VHS tapes and the few I have done did not have any sync issues, so I have no advice to offer you on this. I just record to my PC via a Hauppauge PVR-350 card, edit on the PC, and create a DVD on the PC. I use VideoReDo and MPEGVCR for editing. I find MPEGVCR easier to use for standard definition video (ie. VHS), but I use VideoReDo if I'm working with high def TV captures. Both products work with standard def and high def MPEG video and are "try before you buy". One of them might be just what you are looking for.

[SingSing]

I want to do this as inexpensively, as possible. I am (currently) hoping to spend between $100 - $200, and end up with a workable solution. I realize that software (for editing) might be additional.

EQUAL

(4) standalone VHS to DVD burner (sony, jvs, samsung, etc.).

[sonomablue]

Jman98,

Thank you for the reply. I will check out the links that you listed.

Sonomablue.

[sonomablue]

SingSing,

Thanks for your reply. Do you know if it "is" possible to edit the final product from a standalone VHS to DVD recorder.

thanks

[SingSing]

Yes, you can edit the video, as long as you have a PC with DVD burner.

First, you most likely want to record to DVD+R/W. so you can re-use the disc many time.

You can use DVDshrink 3.2 to transfer the desirable segments to your harddisk, and then use DVDshrink to combine all these segments into a final DVD. DVD shrink will also compress the video to fit the disc, if necessary.

When the DVD is playing, you can press fast for/backward to get to the beginning of any segments.

[mpack]

I have done some minimal research. Seems like there are (at least) 4 ways to accomplish this. (1) Video capture card in my PC. (2) Analog Capture device. (3) DV Camera. (4) standalone VHS to DVD burner (sony, jvs, samsung, etc.).

Do you have hair? If so, and assuming you want to keep it, then please forget all about doing the captures with a PC (whether via internal card or external capture box). The problem is that the hardware in PCs is just too variable, and so is the state of your operating system (how congested is your hard drive, what percent of CPU is spent on background tasks?). If you are lucky it will work - at least sometimes - if you are unlucky then in a few weeks time you are going to be one angry and frustrated person...

Stand-alone DVD recorders remove all that hardware and OS variability. Provided you make sure to get good quality media, and if the original video tape source isn't totally screwed up then this method of capture will work reliably, every single time.

I have only ever used Sony's, and I can recommend them for their encoded video quality and easy user interface. Some people hate them because of Sony's strict adherence to copyright conventions etc: but if your source is home video footage then this will be no problem for you.

If it was an HDD/DVD recorder then you could do some limited editing (and provide a readable name for the title menu) before burning to disk. But these devices are obviously more expensive than simple DVD recorders. With the latter you can still take the burned DVD to any PC which has a DVD-ROM drive, then use something like DVD Decrypter to extract either the entire video project (to play the DVD from your hard disk) or the elementary video/audio streams (for use as source files when editing / reauthoring). If you want to create a new (edited) DVD then you need DVD authoring software and a DVD burner in your PC.

[sonomablue]

mpack, Thanks.

A guy at work (who does a fair amount of video copying, editing, reformatting, etc) indicated that if I wanted to edit a DVD that was created from a standalone VHS-DVD machine, then i would need to "rip" the files from the completed DVD, in order to get the MPEG2 files. I would then be able to edit or work with the MPEG2 files. (this is currently over my head, since i have never done this before). He indicated that he uses both Premier (by Adobe) and Pinnacle.

He also indicated that every time that you change (enhance, copy, edit, etc.) a movie, that the finished product is likely to be of somewhat lesser quality then what you started with. (I think he indicated that some compression and decompression can be involved in the process, and that can lead to degraded quality. I am probably not being 100% accurate on what he meant (technically) because I do not fully undestand it as much as he does, since he has done this for several years, and I am completey new to the process.

He indicated that his preference would be to purchase a new (or even used) DV camcorder, and use it as the means of converting the analog signals to the digital format that is required to input to a PC's firewire port.

Again, i am still open to all of your comments. I have not done this before (copying VHS to DVD) and i want to be sure that whatever means that i choose - that i won't have regrets, and wished that i had used a different method.

thanks

[mpack]

A guy at work (who does a fair amount of video copying, editing, reformatting, etc) indicated that if I wanted to edit a DVD that was created from a standalone VHS-DVD machine, then i would need to "rip" the files from the completed DVD, in order to get the MPEG2 files.

That's true, thats why I mentioned the "DVD Decrypter" tool, since that is what I use it for. If you look at a DVD disk in a PC drive you will see that it contains a folder "VIDEO_TS" inside of which are .IFO, .BUP and .VOB files. These are the MPEG2-encoded menus and vid/aud streams in a special wrapper file format. DVD Decrypter can either simply copy these files onto your hard disk where they can be played by a software DVD player, or it can extract the individual video/audio streams from them and store those on your PC instead, ready to be used by editing tools and/or a DVD authoring app. DVD Decrypter is primarily a ripping tool of the type your friend mentioned (ie. it can remove the protection from commercial DVDs), but it is also useful as a simple copying tool for DVDs created by your own DVD recorder.

However I can't recommend a VHS-DVD combo machine since I've never used one. I use an HDD/DVD recorder with a normal (my old) VCR connected to its inputs.

He also indicated that every time that you change (enhance, copy, edit, etc.) a movie, that the finished product is likely to be of somewhat lesser quality then what you started with.

Yes, MPEG gets its compression in large part by throwing away fine details that the eye can't see. Put another way, every time you MPEG encode something, a little of the original detail is lost. You don't notice this much on the first encoding if its done at a decent quality (which is what you will get from the DVD recorder), but if you lets say converted it to an AVI, added fancy effects then re-encoded as an MPEG then it would lose a bit more quality - and so on.

However, there ARE tools which can do simple edits directly on MPEGs with no converting and little or no re-encoding. For example you can cut and join MPEG clips this way, with the right (MPEG aware) editing tools. Adobe Premier is over my budget so I can't say if it can do this.

He indicated that his preference would be to purchase a new (or even used) DV camcorder, and use it as the means of converting the analog signals to the digital format that is required to input to a PC's firewire port.

I've never tried to do that with a DV camcorder, so I can't comment at length on this option. My understanding however is that you would end up with a DV-AVI file, which would then have to be re-encoded to DVD compliant MPEG2 if you wanted to author a DVD. This seems like extra work to me. DV is however easier to edit, so I'm told.

[sonomablue]

Mpack, Thanks.

Mpack, or others -

Do you have any general opinions on which vendors (Sony, Panasonic, Samsung, etc.) that you "would" or would "not" consider, if someone were to purchase a standalone VHS to DVD machine.

[gshelley61]

All you need is a decent standalone DVD recorder and a simple MPEG2/DVD-Video editing and authoring program (like TMPGenc DVD Author)

DVD recorders with built in hard drives are very nice because you can do the recording and editing on the DVD recorder's hard drive before burning to disc... bypassing the need for doing it with your computer altogther.

There are not many new hard drive equipped DVD recorders left on the market (Philips still has a couple with 160GB drives available, check Walmart and Circuit City online). Check eBay for used and refurb machines as there will be a better selection as far as brand names, models, etc.

Do not bother with the cumbersome, frustrating and time consuming method of capturing VHS tapes with your computer. Recording VHS to DV tape with a camcorder then editing, encoding and authoring to DVD with your PC is likewise very time consuming and unnecessary... unless you are planning on adding narration, music, graphics, Hollywood style transitions between scenes, etc. Advanced editing and rendering needs to be done in AVI format before encoding to MPEG2 for DVD.

Search in the DVD Recorder section of this forum - there is a ton of info about converting VHS to DVD with standalone recorders in there.

[sonomablue]

gshelley61. very helpful post.

If i do choose a standalone receiver, are there features that are a must have ?

while i was considering a capture device, a big feature that i have been keeping in mind is a firewire connection (since i have heard that USB can lag behind).

Are there features (formats, interfaces, HD, etc.) that are a must have, or should have, on a standalone VHS DVD copier.

thanks.

[mpack]

Are there features (formats, interfaces, HD, etc.) that are a must have, or should have, on a standalone VHS DVD copier.

You keep saying "standalone VHS/DVD" which to me sounds like one of those VHS/DVD combo machines. That is the one option I wouldn't consider, but perhaps that's because the ones I've seen have all been made to be as cheap as possible - and quality is my main concern with these things. I assume you still own a VCR? In that case you shouldn't need to buy a new one, all you need is the DVD (or preferably HDD/DVD) recorder.

Apart from that, I'm a Sony fan, but in fact I've only ever used Sony so I'm in no position to criticise other brands (besides which, I believe your choice of brands is rather limited in the US). I chose Sony after prowling reviews on Amazon, particularly the ones which mentioned quality of the encoded video. I suggest you do the same - but if you see any reviews criticising the machine for being complicated to use... unless it's universal then I'd take that with a large pinch of salt, as there are lots of lazy types out there who don't want to find out what complicated words like MPEG, dub, encode etc mean. You should expect that reading the manual will be necessary for best results, and once you've read the manual it will be pretty easy.

As to other features... well I'm from the UK, so the feature set I would look for is slightly different: eg. I wanted one which could record from an RGB source for highest quality, in the US I don't know what the highest quality video connection types are between a VCR and other devices (S-Video?). I suppose you should also check what recordable DVD formats the device supports (+R, -R, +RW, Dual Layer (DL)) - ideally it should support them all and leave the choice to whatever is most convenient for you.

Just as important as the recorder is the media - check reviews of these as well, and only use media which has a good reputation. You don't want to pick up a DVD-R in a years time and find out that it has clouded over or something like that (and in any case I would keep the rips on my PC as well for backup - I bought a 1TB second drive for my new home PC for precisely this purpose! .

[SingSing]

As to other features... well I'm from the UK, so the feature set I would look for is slightly different: eg. I wanted one which could record from an RGB source for highest quality, in the US I don't know what the highest quality video connection types are between a VCR and other devices (S-Video?).

We used NTSC - Never Twice Same Color.

[sonomablue]

mpack, Thanks.

Thanks for your insight. I agree. No sense having a combination VHS/DVD, since i already have a VHS player.

(In addition to your Sony suggestions, which i am considering, I read some posts in the DVD Recorder section of this forum, and a popular model seemed to be the Philips 3575/3576. I looked at them online and liked what i read. I downloaed the user manual (PDF format).

I now have additional questions. (some of them are due to additional requirements).

I overlooked that i have an additional requirment. To copy my Super-8 tapes to DVD. (After using my VHS recorder for many years (tapes of the kids, growing up, trips to Disneyland, etc), I then purchased a Sony Super-8 camcorder. Therefore, I also need to copy my Super-8 tapes to DVD. And a combination VHS-DVD burner would not help me with the Super-8 to DVD conversion. The Philips 3575/3576 (or the Sony that you mention) will accomplish that - since they have the RCA input interface that the Super-8 camera requires. One could argue that my 'additional requirement' (Super-8 to DVD) is satisified via a DVD recorder (Sony, Philips 3575/6, etc.).

I will restate my PRIMARY requirement is to "copy my VHS tapes to DVD, and be able to do some editing".

There are other factors that i am considering. They are not "must have" requirements, but i would be remiss if i did not factor them into my research.

(1) I have some old VHS movies (Disney movies that the kids watched while growing up). It would be nice to have them on DVD. However, I suppose that some people would argue that the quality (resolution) of VHS movies, was so low that it would not be worth copying to DVD. Also, i read in the PDF manual of the Philips 3575/6, that "copyright protected" movies can not be copied. It also had a line that read "copy once programs can not be recorded on DVD". Does this mean that the DVD recorder would not copy a VHS Disney movie.

(2) Directv Tivo. We have Directv with Tivo. We record a lot of shows and movies (on our Tivo). We then watch the shows at a time that is convenient to us. We love it. 95% of the time, we just delete the show and/or movie after we have watched it. However, on rare occasions, we use the "Tivo to VHS" copy function. It writes the show/movie (in realtime) to a VHS recorder that is connected via RCA connecters.

My question is this: would we be able to put the DVD recorder in place of the VHS recorder, and copy those 5% of our shows to DVD. (an example, my son is away at college, yet he likes the show Prison Break. So we record all the shows during the season. It fills up our Tivo, so we copy them off to VHS, so he can watch them when he comes home for Christmas or summer. Can we copy those Prison Break episodes to DVD? And can we copy any movies that we might record via Tivo?

thanks.

[mpack]

We used NTSC - Never Twice Same Color.

Yes, I'm familiar with that definition of the acronym...

However, like PAL, NTSC just refers to the video encoding, timing etc. Not the transmission method. Some transmission methods damage the video quality, particularly UHF. Composite video is also pretty bad. S-Video is better... But, best quality comes from component video (since each color channel has its own signal wire, these signals won't interfere with each other).

However, my understanding is that component video in the US is a high end feature, whereas in Europe RGB connections (which also a form of component video) is an expected feature of many consumer devices, including sat boxes, DVD players and DVD recorders.

Am I wrong? How do consumer level SD DVD players in the US output their video?

[mpack]

We are now straying into territory where intimate knowledge of the US market may be needed, and which I don't have. Hopefully a US member will comment as well.

Thanks for your insight. I agree. No sense having a combination VHS/DVD, since i already have a VHS player.

Actually, having thought about it some more, there may be some sense in it. If the US market doesn't provide for a high quality video connection between consumer grade VCR and DVD recorder then perhaps a combo machine would provide that connection internally... but this would be very much down to the details of the individual device, and you would need to do your own research on that, or perhaps a US member could advise. Of course the VHS slot isn't much good for Super-8, but hopefully this machine would still have an RCA (ie. composite video) input... but that would be a worrying feature, since it might imply that composite video is used for internal connections too.

And a combination VHS-DVD burner would not help me with the Super-8 to DVD conversion.

Well it might, as mentioned above. You would need to check the spec for any proposed unit.

I have some old VHS movies (Disney movies that the kids watched while growing up). It would be nice to have them on DVD. However, I suppose that some people would argue that the quality (resolution) of VHS movies, was so low that it would not be worth copying to DVD.

Check the price and availability of the Disney DVD as well. I doubt it will be worth your time to convert these, and the official DVD will give much better quality.

Also, i read in the PDF manual of the Philips 3575/6, that "copyright protected" movies can not be copied. It also had a line that read "copy once programs can not be recorded on DVD". Does this mean that the DVD recorder would not copy a VHS Disney movie.

Quite possibly. Commercial VHS tapes are often protected by Macrovision, and the DVD recorder would detect this. There are no doubt ways around this, but frankly, I don't think it's cost effective for you to try.

My question is this: would we be able to put the DVD recorder in place of the VHS recorder, and copy those 5% of our shows to DVD.

Yes. Anything a VCR can record, a DVD recorder can record. The only protection they could superimpose onto a composite video signal (RCA) is macrovision, and your VCR wouldn't be able to record it either if it had that.

[mpack]

Also, i read in the PDF manual of the Philips 3575/6, that "copyright protected" movies can not be copied. It also had a line that read "copy once programs can not be recorded on DVD". Does this mean that the DVD recorder would not copy a VHS Disney movie.

Oh yeah, I wanted to comment on the this bit too.

Bear in mind that for the Philips unit to enforce any copy protection restrictions, something must first (somehow) tell it about those restrictions.

So, what section of the manual did the above para come from? In Europe that section would be related to the internal satellite TV tuner(s) - if any - since digital broadcasts come in a transport stream that includes copyright flags. For composite video (and in my case RGB) inputs it's hard to see - other than Macrovision - where the Philips unit would get the info (and I'm not sure that Macrovision can be carried by an RGB connection - not that that helps you!).

More uptodate recorders might include HDMI inputs, and copyright flags can definitely be carried on those.

[Bjs]

If your going to edit these files after, then forget sony vegas, it will refuse mpegs encoded by many other products.

As for the dvd recorder, it will depend if its able to do anything with the output from the tivo unit, you can only try.

One way around this problem is to have a tv with video/audio outputs, and connect these to the dvd recorders input, it works, but you will not know if it has till you check out the disc after... have to try that with a commercial vhs tape.

Forget using dvdshrink for clipping, it has a bug which affects certain audio types.

This is picked up by demuxing the clips and trying to encode the audio stream using besweet, the cut marks produce timing errors in the besweet conversion log during the process.

Since finding the bug, I have been running other experiments, for vob to mpeg, Ive been currently using Mpg2Cut2 to save the vob parts as mpegs, then simply bringing those into ulead video studio after, without any audio problems.

[sonomablue]

I will attempt to include a screenprint from the 3575 PDF manul.
So you will either see the error message info in my next post, or only this text.

thanks

[sonomablue]

I have not "yet" experienced the error (since i do not yet have the 3575, if i even purcase it). I mention the error because i read it in the manual, and it concerns me.

[mpack]

I have not "yet" experienced the error (since i do not yet have the 3575, if i even purcase it).
I mention the error because i read it in the manual, and it concerns me.

I'd guess that troubleshooting section is a generic one that they use in manuals for many similar Philips products, in the US and elsewhere. My Sony has a similar section in the manual, and it doesn't even have an internal tuner! I'd guess that if I tried to rip a commercial VHS tape with the Sony using a connection method that can carry Macrovision then it might complain... but fact is I've never tried, plus I don't think that RGB-SCART connections (the type I use) can carry Macrovision. All of my recorders inputs are analog, so none of the "broadcast flags" restrictions apply. My Sony has never complained about burning any recorded TV show to DVD, which is all I use it for (apart from the odd VHS conversion).

[redwudz]

I've never seen anybody given a waiver to double post, so expect one of your posts to be locked.

I deleted the duplicate post.

Moderator redwudz

[sonomablue]

Redwudz - I respect your ability to, and your choice, to remove the duplicate posts. However, i seriously question why you (or the Admin) turn the thread "VHS to DVD conversion - Am I expecting too much?" into a sticky thread (stay at the top). I am new to this forum, and I would imagine that my initial interest (how to copy VHS to DVD) is shared by many. Yet that thread (no offense) is of no help at all. Yet, you 'stick' it to the top. I challenge you, go back and re-read the thread, and imagine that you are a new member of this forum. Is there enough substanial information to warrant a sticky thread. I would suggest that you remove the sticky bit, and let if fall down the list. If it is useful, people will post and keep it near the top. Otherwise, it will descend downward.

thanks.

[DereX888]

sonomablue, the PC CAPTURE METHOD is the only way to achieve simply the best quality professional transfers, possibly fix any problems arising from inferior analog devices used in the past, etc.
and...
Yes, you may loose your hair in the process of learning it if you are a "n00b".
Yes, it is not easy because best programs were not designed for occasional Ma&Pa users.
Yes, you need some more than basic "how to use IE" knowledge if you want to use them to their full extent.
Yet again - PC Capturing is the only way to achieve truly professional work results, and I hope none of those naysayers who can't even setup their Windows to run correctly won't even dare to say otherwise

So, if you are not computer savvy and/or completely new to digital video on PC, yes - forget the PC Capture Method. It won't work for you.
In such case just get the best standalone DVD recorder you can afford (notice: I don't say "the most expensive", it is almost never equal to "the best") and be done with it in no time and painlessly (specially do so if "its a 1 time deal" for you - if you are just wanting to transfer those aging 20-30 old tapes of your family videos; there is no point in learning digital video quirks for you).

The way I see it, your 4 options are actually only 2 options:

either go PC Capture way if you are confident you still have ability to learn something new (your budget of $200 is probably more than enough to build from scratch any decent dedicated videocapturing computer based on used PC with 2+GHz Pentium4 CPU),

or go with standalone dvd recorder - you don't even need the harddisk-based model (just "invest" in couple of extra DVD+RWs and if you are not satisfied with simplistic menus and other options you can still lash-up and do excellent job of editing DVD-Videos created with such standalone recorder on your *existing PC*, for which you won't need much of the software: most basic tools you'll use as a n00b are freeware, and maybe you'll need to buy just some n00b-friendly dvd-authoring software or a multipurpose program such as TMPGEnc DVD Author with which you can edit/encode audio/author very easily).

(and for the future: DO buy at least DV or HDV camcorder for yourself - not for "digitizing old videos", just so from now on you'll start archiving your family events or leisure times on a digital format and won't have such dilemma in the future).

[sonomablue]

DereX888 - thanks for your post. I will consider both. Not that it matters, but I am not a Ma&Pa user, but maybe you are posting for me, and for others. Personally, I have had PCs since 1985 (dos, win3.1, 3.11 for workgroups, win95, win98, NT, 2000, XP, and now Vista. In fact, just last night I downloaded XP Service Pack 3 (for my XP system). I hadn't even heard that Windows was releasing any new SPs (I thought that they were dropping, or at least sunsetting the support for XP, and the next thing i see, a new SP. It took a long time to download (even over my broadband connection), and even longer to install. I had the patience (over 90 minutes) but i can imagine some "Ma&Pa" users, getting impatient in the middle of such a long install, and turning of their PC, and BSOD. I would not want to be working for M/S - for the next few weeks ... as novice users start taking the download. Back to me, i have worked in IT since 1984 (mainframe, unix, and windows support). So not only am I not adverse to technical things, i do it for a living. Maybe it is, in part, for that reason, that i have been considering a possibly easy solution. I deal all day long with technical issues, and sometimes i just want to go home, and take it easy. (In fact, i am on-call 7x24 this week for our support group, and just got paged, and am now off of a meet me line, after fixing a problem on a unix server). For me, i sometimes long for a nice quiet day at home, without having to deal with too many technical issues.

But since you indicated that the best quality of capture is via a capture card, I will raise that back up on my list, as a possible solution. Thank you for that tidbit.

Have a great day. And watch out for XP service pack 3.

[Jeremiah58]

All you need is a decent standalone DVD recorder and a simple MPEG2/DVD-Video editing and authoring program (like TMPGenc DVD Author)

DVD recorders with built in hard drives are very nice because you can do the recording and editing on the DVD recorder's hard drive before burning to disc... bypassing the need for doing it with your computer altogther.

Ditto.
I will never use any other mode of VHS>DVD, for home videos, and I did try all of them.

[pepegot1]

My method is:
1: VHS recorder, copy to DVD recorder (stabilizer attached to VCR to preclude Macrovision).
2. Edit with VideoRedo
3. Burn TDA

VHS quality shows improvement using my JVC DR-10S
Cheap-No Way!

[DereX888]

DereX888 - thanks for your post. I will consider both. Not that it matters, but I am not a Ma&Pa user, but maybe you are posting for me, and for others. Personally, I have had PCs since 1985 (dos, win3.1, 3.11 for workgroups, win95, win98, NT, 2000, XP, and now Vista. In fact, just last night I downloaded XP Service Pack 3 (for my XP system). I hadn't even heard that Windows was releasing any new SPs (I thought that they were dropping, or at least sunsetting the support for XP, and the next thing i see, a new SP. It took a long time to download (even over my broadband connection), and even longer to install. I had the patience (over 90 minutes) but i can imagine some "Ma&Pa" users, getting impatient in the middle of such a long install, and turning of their PC, and BSOD. I would not want to be working for M/S - for the next few weeks ... as novice users start taking the download. Back to me, i have worked in IT since 1984 (mainframe, unix, and windows support). So not only am I not adverse to technical things, i do it for a living. Maybe it is, in part, for that reason, that i have been considering a possibly easy solution. I deal all day long with technical issues, and sometimes i just want to go home, and take it easy. (In fact, i am on-call 7x24 this week for our support group, and just got paged, and am now off of a meet me line, after fixing a problem on a unix server). For me, i sometimes long for a nice quiet day at home, without having to deal with too many technical issues.

But since you indicated that the best quality of capture is via a capture card, I will raise that back up on my list, as a possible solution. Thank you for that tidbit.

Have a great day. And watch out for XP service pack 3.

As you've noticed, my reply was for you *and* for other potential users who may read this topic (you have to always consider the fact that anything asked and answered on message boards may be available to anyone for years to come...).
I don't know you, thus I had no clue are you a novice or a pro
From what you've said, I wouldn't hesitate and go with a PC, specially if you have any unused machine or parts to make dedicated capture PC. I wouldn't even buy any new parts (like capture card) since older used ones fro few bucks should be fine (as last as you'd choose good model). DVD-Video specs haven't changed since 1996, and there are plenty of better and excellent older cards out there, while newest ones will only have i.e. better 3D gaming capabilities. Seriously, if you have "spare" 2+GHz/256+MB machine, all you'll probably need is a capture card and maybe 2nd hdd (if you are going to do capturing more than just few times).
I've built my own last "PC PVR" in 2001 and its still fine today 7 years later (in that time I did some upgrades not related to capture much, like maxing out RAM and CPU speed for its mobo), and still no standalone dvd recorder can match it Yes I do have and use standalone recorders too, but whenever I need to transfer anything that require fiddling, fixing, or it just have to be perfect - I use that PC only.
Just my 0.02

Wish you a great day as well.

/edit/ oh, XP SP3.... I have only one XP-based machine at home and it was smooth and problem-free when I did it. However I remember our IT guys b*tching for entire month when they were upgrading XP boxes in our offices, so you're not alone

[oldfart13]

My latest DVD recorder aquisitions were 2 Dayteks that cost me a grand total of $2.24! The shipping was 10 times that. Yes, they are hard drive units. Even if they are both DOA, I can probably restore at least 1 to working condition, or use either the HDD or DVD burner alone. No, I haven't used the PC for capturing since we got out of the old VCD/SVCD days on this board. Good for you for tweaking...I never could see the need unless your original recordings were multi-generational dubs or somesuch. For that, I have access to pro equipment from the local TV station anyway. For what the original poster wanted to do, the DVD recorder would work just as well for anything so long as his source material is in fairly good condition. For stuff that might be Macrovision protected, he'll have to read more. Even many capture cards had problems that way when I used to use my old All In Wonder card. No problems now with the DVD recorders (and I got rid of all those sync problems as well). I've been building PC boxes since the late 80's but going back to buiding a dedicated capture only PC system would be a waste of my rather limited time. Everything I need to do I can do in post production. That's what the PC is for these days...