VHS tape recorded with a problem camcorder screwing up players

[perceptionist]

I am trying to get all my old VHS home videos backed up onto DVD. There is one particular tape I recorded back in 1992 using my aunts camcorder which was riddled with issues. But I managed to get 1 good tape out of it.

Whenever I play this tape I can get the picture to be just fine with extensive manipulation of the tracking as auto tracking will never hit it correctly. After playing for a while the picture eventually goes black but I can still hear the sound, but its choppy.

If I rewind the tape to a part that played fine a few minutes ago...it too is black with choppy sound and now tracking does not help. If I put a known good tape in the same player.... Picture is black with sound and tracking does not help.

Not sure what fixes it but eventually the player will work fine again long after I have given up trying. But if I put the problem tape in it... It screws up all over again....

I really want to back this problem tape up but I am afraid it will ruin my player.

Does anyone know what might be happening?

Thanks,

Mike

[edDV]

It was recorded on a machine with incorrect tape path alignment (e.g. scanner guides, worn capstan etc.). To play it properly you would need the original recorder or misadjust a machine to match the original. Tracking only goes so far. A good VCR mechanic has the tools to do this right.

He/she could misadjust your machine to play (capture) the tape and then adjust it back to spec.

[perceptionist]

Thank you for the reply.

How is it that it temporarily messes up my player?

The only way I could figure out how to fix it was to unplug it and try again a few hours later.

Simply unplugging and trying again right away does not help even with a good tape.

[Video Head]

Hi perceptionist,

I would like to know what issues the camcorder had and what brand and type of tape it is.

My initial suspision is that the magnetic layer of the tape is being rubbed off on the heads of the VCR. This is causing the black picture. When you put the known good tape in and play it, it produces a black picture until it has scrubbed the heads clean again.

Many inexpensive brands of VHS tape used inferior adhesive to bind the magenetic layer to the plastic film. This caused the magnetic layer to be quickly transfered to anything it touched...such as the heads on your VCR. It could also be caused by over zealous tensioning in the VCR or a combination of both.

This will probably not cause your VCR any problems but could effect the tapes you play after it. The magnetic layer is being transfered from the first tape to the heads of your VCR. It is then being transfered to the next tape when it makes contact with the heads. The magnetic material will then become embeded in the second tape. This can cause playback issues, such as ghost images.

As you wish to try and preserve this tape it would be best to not play it. Take it to a professional transfer service in your area and explain the problem to them. They may be able to help.

VH

[edDV]

Good point. I missed the part about a good tape not playing after.

[perceptionist]

Well the label on the tape says "Focal" however I am sure you will agree to allow for the possibility this might not be the original label.

The tape itself has no markings on it, even the usual digits that are normally near the anti erase tab.

The cam I used would often clatter and finally stop altogether. Once in a while I could get it to work for a while.

[Video Head]

I would like to put blame on the equipment but it is most likely the tape. If it is not labeled Sony, JVC, Fuji or another reputable brand, then it is suspect. No label is worse.

Much like today, when people in this forum ask if the quality of media makes a difference, yes it does. It made a diffence with VHS tapes and it makes a difference with DVD's. An inexpensive brand might hold out for 5 or 10 years, but when you get to 20 or 30 years (redwudz?) archival then it makes a difference. My original Sony ED Pro tapes from the '80's all still look great...just not upscaled to 1080p.

VH

[perceptionist]

Hey I just found 3 more tapes I forgot I had that were made with the same camcorder and cause the same issues.

2 of them are confirmed "Scotch" and the 3rd is an unknown.

All of these tapes with the issues will play just fine at first for like 5 minutes then will begin to mess up the player. I am sure that it is not that particular part of the tape because later on after the player is working again, it will play the part that previously screwed up.

I understand what "Video Head" was saying about the magnetic layer coming off on the head, seems to make sense, but wouldn't that make the tape unplayable after the layer came off of that part of the tape?

I am still able to play the problem tape after the player recovers from whatever it is these tapes are doing to it... granted its for only like 3-5 minutes.

BTW, these tapes affect 3 different players I have tried in the same manner.

I might try to find a professional back up service hopefully one that will understand what the issue is and not just give my tapes back saying they are bad... I know they contain all the info... its just a matter of extracting it.

[Video Head]

"but wouldn't that make the tape unplayable after the layer came off of that part of the tape?"

Probably not. The magnetic layer is thick - all tapes leave magnetic material behind every time they are played. That is why video heads need occasional cleaning. Some rental tapes in the 80's and 90's would wear out to the point that some tapes had clear spots on them. Reviewing, pausing and slow motion had a huge effect on this and you can see the video "break" or have multi coloured lines and interferance where the tape has been paused or rewound frequently...usually at the best point of the movie.

VHS tape is not forever...

VH

[edDV]

The gunk left on the heads is mostly the binder glue that has seeped to the magnetic surface. Such tapes play like they are sticky.

[videobread]

Might be bad tape. I had a bad batch years ago. The oxide was coming off the tapes and plugging up the heads on my VHS recorders. I had to clean the heads repeatedly on several of my dubbing VHS units. I lost one unit. I returned the rest of the batch, several hundred tapes. Never had the problem again. They were bulk loaded VHS tapes. You never really knew what brand you were getting. They always claimed FUJI, but these were some crap off brand.

[edDV]

Might be bad tape. I had a bad batch years ago. The oxide was coming off the tapes and plugging up the heads on my VHS recorders. I had to clean the heads repeatedly on several of my dubbing VHS units. I lost one unit. I returned the rest of the batch, several hundred tapes. Never had the problem again. They were bulk loaded VHS tapes. You never really knew what brand you were getting. They always claimed FUJI, but these were some crap off brand.

This happens as magnetic tape ages but some raw stock was notorious for early problems. Certain batches of Ampex reel to reel audio tape were notorious but the problem also exists for VHS and Beta. In most cases the magnetic particles don't rub off, instead the binder glue seeps to the surface making the tape too sticky to play.

Restoration experts are able to "cook" these tapes in an oven to vaporize the glue and make playback possible. The fix is destructive so you have a limited window to get the tapes to play before they deteriorate.

For helical tape, these experts use special open transports that can be adjusted to vary guide angle and tension to make even difficult tapes playable. They earn every penny they charge.