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  1. Member
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    Hi everyone.
    I did a few searches in Google and in this forum, but i'm still unclear on the steps required to convert from Pal to Ntsc.

    I have a video file in .avi extension (about 30GB), which is in Pal format (25FPS).
    Now, i'd like to convert this file to NTSC (29fps), but the final converted file should be in AVI format again and not to a DVD or something else.
    When i was searching, i found out that this is very unclear.
    I'd also like to add that i'm looking for a tool which does not separate the audio from the video, because when you join them latter it creates syncing issues. I know that syncing can be fixed after trial and error but it might take you a month.

    If anyone can point me to the right direction, i'd appreciate it.

    Thank you.
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  2. I'm a MEGA Super Moderator Baldrick's Avatar
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    Is it a interlaced dv-avi video?
    Why do you need it in 25fps? If you are only need it as avi it can be anything because computers doesn't care about pal and ntsc. Or do you need it be in 25fps for a dv output to camera or something?
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  3. Member
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    I believe it's interlaced but i'm not 100% sure. How can i verify this? With what tool?

    Why do you need it in 25fps? If you are only need it as avi it can be anything because computers doesn't care about pal and ntsc. Or do you need it be in 25fps for a dv output to camera or something?
    I don't think you read my post, or maybe i posted it the wrong way.
    Like i was saying, i have an .avi file in PAL format (25Fps). I would like to convert this .avi file to another .avi file but with NTSC format (29fps).
    The question is not 'Why do i want to do this" but 'How can i do it'.

    Thanks.
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  4. Originally Posted by engert100
    I don't think you read my post, or maybe i posted it the wrong way.
    Like i was saying, i have an .avi file in PAL format (25Fps). I would like to convert this .avi file to another .avi file but with NTSC format (29fps).
    The question is not 'Why do i want to do this" but 'How can i do it'.
    AVI is a container not a video format. You first have to check what's in that container and if you want it back in a AVI, you must decide what format to use.

    You supply very scarce information. IMO, if someone ask you for some more details to possibly help you better, you better not reply on it the way you do. Nobody gets paid for it to help you.

    Chris.
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  5. Member
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    Sorry, but that's the reason i posted in the newbie section. I don't know the correct terms. It be the same if i were to talk to you in biomed language terms. I didn't know avi was a container. And the only details that were asked were: 'It is interlaced or not'. I think it is, but i'm not 100% sure.
    I think my explanation was simple enough though. From .avi to .avi but from Pal to Ntsc.
    Now that we get that cleared....what should i check in the avi container to make this conversion possible?

    Thank you again for your help.
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  6. Member
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    Also, after searching in Google again today, i found out that converting the avi container from 25fps(pal) to 24fps you can actually play it in a NTSC dvd player.
    I tried doing that using virtualdub but i get audio syncing issues.
    I also tried this topic here: http://forum.videohelp.com/topic300144.html but i get audio syncing problesm again. So audio syncing is a big problem for me right now, i was wondering if there is a simpler process to convert .avi video without splitting the sound.
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  7. Also, after searching in Google again today, i found out that converting the avi container from 25fps(pal) to 24fps you can actually play it in a NTSC dvd player.
    You're talking about a DVD/MPEG-4 player that can play AVIs? They were on the money to ask why you want to do this. Since you're (admittedly) new to this, then perhaps you don't know that you shouldn't have any problem playing a 25fps AVI in an NTSC player. I don't, and neither do other people have problems doing that. Of course, it'll have to be converted to an XviD or DivX AVI first.

    You trying to shut off any questions about anything other than the conversion is only proving your ignorance. I mean, first you actually wanted to convert it to 29fps, a pretty silly thing to want to do. To convert it to 24fps (23.976fps, actually), without having to also adjust the audio, will require either blending frames together and creating a blurry mess, or dropping unique frames and making a jerky-playing mess. It would be much better for you to keep it at its original 25fps form.

    So, we ask again, why do you want to do this? And in what format is this 30 GB AVI at the moment? DV, maybe? If you don't know, open it in GSpot and find out. The solution could be as easy as opening the AVI in AutoGK and letting it convert it to an XviD or DivX AVI for playback on a DVD/MPEG-4 player. Depends on the current AVI format, though.
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  8. Originally Posted by engert100
    Also, after searching in Google again today, i found out that converting the avi container from 25fps(pal) to 24fps you can actually play it in a NTSC dvd player.
    I tried doing that using virtualdub but i get audio syncing issues.
    That's to be expected, VirtualDub doesn't transcode the audio. Thereby 24 fps should then be 23.976 fps. You have to be more precise.
    And a NTSC DVD player can't play 23.976 unless your AVI is a DivX and your DVD player supports that format.
    And if so, then the way to convert to 23.976 depends on the source. That's why Baldrick asked you if it's perhaps interlaced DV video from a camcorder or something.

    Download Gspot and that will tell you what the video format is inside the container. Also tell what your goal is. You want it back into a AVI. Your talking about a DVD player?. Why do you let people guess what you actually want to do with the converted avi?

    Chris.
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  9. Member
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    Manono thank you for your straightforward response. This is what i was looking for.

    You're talking about a DVD/MPEG-4 player that can play AVIs? They were on the money to ask why you want to do this. Since you're (admittedly) new to this, then perhaps you don't know that you shouldn't have any problem playing a 25fps AVI in an NTSC player. I don't, and neither do other people have problems doing that. Of course, it'll have to be converted to an XviD or DivX AVI first.
    I have no idea what you're talking about. Layman terms please. If you're talking about playing a pal dvd on a dvd player that will do a 'on the fly' conversion and display it on a NTSC tv, than yes i am aware of that option, but i'd rather not do it. I want to do the conversion myself.

    You trying to shut off any questions about anything other than the conversion is only proving your ignorance. I mean, first you actually wanted to convert it to 29fps, a pretty silly thing to want to do. To convert it to 24fps (23.976fps, actually), without having to also adjust the audio, will require either blending frames together and creating a blurry mess, or dropping unique frames and making a jerky-playing mess. It would be much better for you to keep it at its original 25fps form.
    If i keep it in 25fps, can i play it in a NTSC DVD Player and display it on Tv?

    So, we ask again, why do you want to do this?
    I want to do this so i can display the PAL video on my NTSC dvd player. I want to convert the video, use a video authoring program so i can create a nice DVD with menus and play it in a NTSC dvd player.

    And in what format is this 30 GB AVI at the moment? DV, maybe?
    Please see the attachment image for this.


    The solution could be as easy as opening the AVI in AutoGK and letting it convert it to an XviD or DivX AVI for playback on a DVD/MPEG-4 player. Depends on the current AVI format, though
    Whoa dude. Layman's terms please. I have no idea what you're talking about.

    I really appreciate your help.
    I'm not trying to offend anybody here, i simply don't know what you're talking about so please keep it on layman's terms and slowly reval the details.
    Thanks again.

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  10. Member
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    Originally Posted by Chris K
    Also tell what your goal is. You want it back into a AVI. Your talking about a DVD player?. Why do you let people guess what you actually want to do with the converted avi?

    Chris.
    Hi Chris.

    You see the problem i'm having for about two weeks now, is that i have this PAL dvd disc that i'd like to convert to NTSC. During these two weeks i've tried many methods posted in this forum and other methods i found on Google.
    The only problem that's really pissing me off is AUDIO SYNCING. I just can't do it at this point.
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  11. Originally Posted by engert100
    I want to do this so i can display the PAL video on my NTSC dvd player. I want to convert the video, use a video authoring program so i can create a nice DVD with menus and play it in a NTSC dvd player.
    Ah, now we're getting somewhere. You don't have a DVD player that can also play AVIs. Nor does your DVD player play PAL DVDs (I would guess). Players that can do both are pretty cheap, and can be gotten from Wal-Mart, Amazon.com, or other such places.

    Well, you don't want or need to convert your DV AVI (that's what it is, according to GSpot - a Type 1 DV AVI, and almost certainly interlaced) to an NTSC DV AVI, as it will be better, faster, and preserve more quality to go directly to NTSC DVD.

    My suggestion is FAVC. It can do the conversion, keeping the audio and video at the same length, and give you a finished NTSC DVD ready for burning to disc. Judging from the screen pic, it looks like it can also create an IMG and also burn to disc for you(?). Maybe someone else that's used it can confirm or deny. When it comes to the choice of encoder (QuEnc or HC), go with HC.
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  12. Member
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    Hi manono. Thank you. I will try FAVC.
    The part that i don't understand is: HC . Is this used togerther with FAVC or is this separate?
    If separate, which should i do first?

    Thanks for your patience.
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  13. FAVC is a front end and GUI for a bunch of other freeware programs. Among the most important are AviSynth for frameserving and the MPEG-2 encoder. You have 2 choices for the encoding, and, in my opinion, HC is the better of the 2. So, yes, the HC MPEG-2 encoder is integrated into FAVC. I think once you get everything installed, and then just have the GUI to work with, all the hard stuff takes place behind the scenes, and you'll have a relatively painless experience (he says wistfully). I hope it supports DV video. Otherwise I, or someone else, might have to walk you through this. That'll be much more painful. For all concerned.
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  14. Always Watching guns1inger's Avatar
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    It does support DV. It uses avisynth behind the scenes, and will use Microsoft's DirectShow DV filter, which is standard in XP.
    Read my blog here.
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  15. Thanks. And there's even a brand new guide to FAVC available, the first I've seen:

    http://www.videohelp.com/guides/favc-video-to-dvd-guide-id1037#1037

    And I was wrong about it burning to disc for you. While it can create the IMG file, ready to burn, you'll have to do the actual burning yourself. You'll want to test out the new DVD yourself anyway, to make sure the audio is in synch and that everything works as expected. And on the last page of that guide, it links to a couple of burning guides.

    The menu options are pretty rudimentary. I hope that's OK with you.
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  16. Member
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    Manono thank you very much. I followed the instructions and created a dual layer dvd (8gb) in the NTSC system and audio is perfectly synced with the video. I left the computer running last night because i have chosen the high quality settings with a 2pass variable bitrate.
    Now, everything looked great but i see a lof of quality loss on the video. I see too much compression.
    Now, if i load these files in ULEAD DVD WORKSHOP to create some nice menues, i'm pretty sure when i'm done with the project in DVD WORKSHOP it will compress it again. This is the reason why i wanted a .AVI to .AVI in the begining.
    Why do you think i'm having so much compression on video? Again i chose the BEST(slowest setting) and a 2pass VBR (according to the guide)
    And now a personal question. What program(s) do you use (and i hope there's a guide) to do your conversion from PAL to NTSC?
    Like i said earlier in this thread, i followed this guide here: http://forum.videohelp.com/topic300144.html but i'm having audio syncing issues. So, i just wanted to try your version of conversion again because i'm not to satisfied with the video quality.

    Thanks mono and everyone else for your help.
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  17. Hi-
    Why do you think i'm having so much compression on video?
    Couldn't say, especially since you created an 8 GB DVD. Perhaps if you uploaded a small sample of the encoded video I, or someone else, can figure it out. DV can be very difficult to encode, especially if this is someone's homemade job, with lots of jumpy camera work.

    And I don't know how FAVC handles the PAL2NTSC conversion for interlaced video, if it deinterlaces it first (which could lead to the kinds of things you're seeing) and then encodes it as progressive video, or keeps it interlaced with a proper interlaced and resizing conversion. Again, I'd have to see a piece of the result. Unless maybe it shows you the AviSynth script it uses.

    Me, I do it manually, from creating the script to encoding in CCE or HCEnc, to authoring with Muxman, and on those rare occasions where I need a menu (I usually work with DVDs which already come with menus), I'll create them using DVDAuthorGUI to author. I've never used FAVC or other all-in-one programs (except a very brief period with DVD-Rebuilder (which doesn't do PAL2NTSC)). As for a PAL2NTSC guide, it's unpublished and sitting on my hard drive, while I figure out what to do with it. You'll find plenty of other guides listed on this site:

    http://www.videohelp.com/guides?searchtext=&tools=&madeby=&formatconversionselect=&how...or+List+Guides
    This is the reason why i wanted a .AVI to .AVI in the begining.
    At this stage in your learning process, I'd venture to say there's no way on earth you'd be able to do a proper interlaced PAL2NTSC AVI conversion. Not without a whole lot of help. Why not upload a small 10 second piece of the DVD so we can have a look?
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  18. Member
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    Thank you for your help mono, but i give up.
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  19. Member turk690's Avatar
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    For converting a valid DV AVI file (such as one that has been been shot with a DV camcorder, NOT a file of any persuasion muddied by any MPEG ersatz as in those lifted from DVDs that has 24fps film origins) from PAL to NTSC or vice-versa, I use FireStore DV Standards Conversion 1.51 (www.focusinfo.com/dvconversionsuite). It costs, but is easy, painless, and after a few tweaks does produce valid PAL or NTSC DV AVI streams none the worse for the original in quality, with audio & video in perfect sync, no stuttering or juddering. I am in Saudi Arabia which uses PAL for distribution, but my productions sometimes have to be sent to the USA and/or the Philippines, which both require NTSC, and which precludes insisting that end viewers "buy a multi-system PAL-NTSC DVD player for the task".
    For all else NTSC/PAL conversion of already existing 24fps film-originated DVDs, this site is chockful of tips and how-tos on the matter which is a good resource.
    For the nth time, with the possible exception of certain Intel processors, I don't have/ever owned anything whose name starts with "i".
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  20. Member
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    Hi mono, actually your sugesstion of buying a dvd player that can convert Pal cd will work out in the end. Why?
    Because i play the Pal dvd in the Philips player, then i connect audio/video cables from the output of the dvd player, and input them into my pc. And.... there you go, now you have a 29.97 fps video synced with sound.
    Good idea!
    Thanks.
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  21. Always Watching guns1inger's Avatar
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    And an analogue generation loss as well. You lose.
    Read my blog here.
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  22. Member
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    Better analog conversion then audio out of sync conversion.
    Unless, there is a digital device, like i mentioned in another thread, where i can convert the original DV CAM tape digitaly and import it into my pc.
    These divices cost around $10000 i believe. I'd buy if i find the one which will do the job.
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  23. Member turk690's Avatar
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    As I've said in my previous post, you capture the DV tape, open the captured DV AVI on your PC HDD in FireStore, then convert. Perfect sync. Costs, but NOT $$thousands. Digital all the way. Valid DV AVI files produced that can be exported back to tape of the appropriate system easily or NLEd. This IS the only way I'm able to make a project in Premiere with both PAL & NTSC assets without having to go through Premiere's wretched interpret footage command.
    For the nth time, with the possible exception of certain Intel processors, I don't have/ever owned anything whose name starts with "i".
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  24. Member
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    Thank you turk690. I was looking at the firestore and it looks like a very good product and reasonable in price.
    This is definately in my top ten list to buy.
    Currently in the past week, i've been working with some people in my local tv stations to see if they can point me into the right direction into buying equipment which will do Pal to Ntsc conversions (and vice versa) and also this equipment should be able to take any type of media like Mini-Dv, DvCam, Vhs, regular music tape etc and to be able to convert .avi files .mpg files etc etc.
    Something like this, cost around $10.000. This is what i've been looking for recently. I'm trying to pinpoint the right product before i spend that kind of money. But, firestore seemed like an excellent product for coversions.
    Thanks again.
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  25. Now there's a hopefully useful piece of info I didn't know either.

    I have some .avis I want to burn to disc, only to find that they are 25FPS. They are .avi and Divx/Xvid that my standalone player will play but I thought the .avis also had to be of an NTSC framerate and not of the PAL 25. I deleted them off my HDD as soon as I realize they were PAL. I have been reading up on what it takes to convert PAL to NTSC and whether it's worth messing with. Now I read that my standalone player should have no problem playing them if they are 25 FPS PAL, as long as they are DIVX/XVID avis.

    Am I understanding correctly?

    Thanks

    [quote="manono"]
    Since you're (admittedly) new to this, then perhaps you don't know that you shouldn't have any problem playing a 25fps AVI in an NTSC player. I don't, and neither do other people have problems doing that. Of course, it'll have to be converted to an XviD or DivX AVI first.
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  26. Am I understanding correctly?
    Yeah, but his were DV AVI, so he would have had to convert to XviD or DivX AVI first. There are some XviD settings that standalones don't like, but in principle your player should play them OK. Why not burn to CD and try? Mine and the other 2 players I had before it play just about any framerate under the sun. I have a lot of silent film AVIs with unusual framerates.
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  27. My .avis are already in xvid/divx format, it's just they are PAL 25fps. I found that they do indeed play on my standalone, but lots of jaggies. Can I correct that by converting them to ntsc xvid/divx avis?

    Thanks
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  28. Better never than late, eh? Do they play with jaggies on the computer? Can you cut a sample for upload somewhere so we can have a look?

    I haven't ever seen a 25fps AVI that was OK on the computer and wasn't OK in the DVD/MPEG-4 player (assuming nothing screwy with the XviD settings), but I suppose it's possible. You could make an easy test to find out. Load the AVI into VDubMod, set the Video for Direct Stream Copy and then go Video->Frame Rate->Change To 23.976fps. Ignore the fact that the audio will go out of synch. You could even disable it in the Streams section. You just want to find out if changing the framerate will make any difference. Then File->Save As, give it a new name, wait a minute until it's done, burn to disc, and test it out.
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  29. No jaggies on the computer. I wonder if it could be the way my TV is handling it. I have Toshiba 47" LCD. All 25fps xvid/divx avis I have will play on my standalone and all have jaggies on the TV. Hmmmmm...... I'll try that test you suggest.

    Thanks

    Originally Posted by manono
    Better never than late, eh? Do they play with jaggies on the computer? Can you cut a sample for upload somewhere so we can have a look?

    I haven't ever seen a 25fps AVI that was OK on the computer and wasn't OK in the DVD/MPEG-4 player (assuming nothing screwy with the XviD settings), but I suppose it's possible.
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  30. Did as you suggested, ran a 25fps avi file thru VirtualDubMod set at 23.976 fps and burned to cd. Video looks great on standalone player, no jaggies as with the same file at 25 fps. Like you said, audio is out of sync, but the vid seems to jump a frame or so every now and then and then the audio is in sync for a while.

    Got the jaggies problem fixed, now if I could just make the audio stay in sync for the whole vid.
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