NTSC/PAL DVD player

[jonas more]

I have a DVD player that will play both NTSC and PAL DVDs but the playback is not very smooth when viewing PAL discs.

Is this a common problem?

Are there any players that will play back PAL DVDs correctly?

Anthony

[ntscuser]

I have a DVD player that will play both NTSC and PAL DVDs but the playback is not very smooth when viewing PAL discs.

Is this a common problem?

Yes. Another problem is widescreen PAL recordings being squashed when viewed on a non-widescreen TV.

Are there any players that will play back PAL DVDs correctly?

Yes, but you also need a TV monitor which can display 50Hz european PAL video. The type of 60Hz "PAL" TV often found in the USA is for Mexican TV which is really a variant of NTSC.

[FulciLives]

If you have a TV with a DVI or HDMI input then the best DVD player for PAL to NTSC conversion is the Oppo Digital DV-981HD model.

http://www.oppodigital.com/

The DV-981HD model uses the Faroudja DCDi chipset (but only on the HDMI output) and this is a superior chipset for PAL to NTSC conversion.

Please note that Oppo Digital currently makes two other models (the DV-980H and DV-970HD) that are capable of PAL to NTSC conversion but they do not use the superior Faroudja DCDi chipset.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

P.S.
All of the Oppo Digital models are region free.

[jman98]

Are there any players that will play back PAL DVDs correctly?

Yes, but you also need a TV monitor which can display 50Hz european PAL video. The type of 60Hz "PAL" TV often found in the USA is for Mexican TV which is really a variant of NTSC.

Such TV monitors are almost impossible to find in the USA. Unlike in Europe, multistandard TVs are incredibly difficult to find here.

You are dead wrong about Mexican TV, which is normal NTSC. There are some weird PAL variants in Brazil, Argentina and Uruguay that are partly NTSC based and partly PAL based, but I think you are really talking about what most of us call a "psuedo-PAL" TV signal.

[jonas more]

Thanks guys...

I have been using Canopus ProCoder 2 to convert my PAL DVDs to NTSC and most of the time I am happy with the results.

I have this one particular DVD that is being a real pain in the arse.

I keep getting these huge horizontal lines that look kind of like exaggerated interlacing artifacts.

I was hoping to find a reasonably priced DVD player that would play the movie correctly so I could just hook it up to my stand alone DVD burner and back it up that way...

FulciLives... how does ProCoder compare to the NTSC to PAL conversion methods you have outlined on several occasions?

Anthony

[FulciLives]

I don't use ProCoder but my understanding is that it has no special ability to do PAL to NTSC ... which really makes it just like any other encoder. Well actually you can do a proper PAL to NTSC with just TMPGEnc Plus which I suppose makes it somewhat unique.

Any chance you can post a sample of the original PAL DVD Video? Perhaps cut out a small portion using a VOB cutter tool such as VobEdit.

There are sites that allow you to post files for free so other people can download them. I normally use the following website:

http://www.rapidshare.com/

That website will allow you to post multiple files for free but each file cannot be more than 100MB in file size. A 100MB VOB should give us a very good sample to work with ... even half that size should make a great sample.

If I have a sample then I can perhaps recommend a proper way to convert from PAL to NTSC.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[robertazimmerman]

Oppo 980H plays NTSC and PAL discs very well! With the proper hacks, you can also make the player region free and have it upconvert encrypted discs to 1080i over component cables!

Very nice and very cheap!

Roberta

P.S. Please excuse all of the exclamation marks!

[MOVIEGEEK]

I can vouch for the Oppo's,I have a 970 and PAL looks good to me.

[jonas more]

Well actually you can do a proper PAL to NTSC with just TMPGEnc Plus which I suppose makes it somewhat unique.

Thanks for your reply. I ran a clip through TMPGEnc and it looks great!

Thanks again,
Anthony

[jonas more]

FulciLives...

I was looking over your guide to convert PAL to NTSC with TMPGEnc and you mention opening the unlock.mcf file in TMPGEnc.

That .mcf file seems to be missing from my program.

Could you please let me know where to go to download it or tell me how to create one?

Anthony

[jagabo]

It's normally here:

C:\Program Files\TMPGEnc\Template\Extra\unlock.mcf

TMPGEnc's not a great PAL/NTSC converter. It uses a fuzzy bilinear resizing filter and it just duplicates or drops frames to convert frame rates. So you get jerky, slightly blurry video.

The Philips DVP-5960 and 5982 are decent PAL to NTSC converting players. They can be made region free with a few button clicks on the remote.

[jonas more]

It's normally here:

C:\Program Files\TMPGEnc\Template\Extra\unlock.mcf

Thanks for the reply. I found the folder that contains all the .mcf files but none are titled unlock.mcf

Would it be possible for you to open up your unlock.mcf file in WordPad and copy and paste the contents here?

TMPGEnc's not a great PAL/NTSC converter. It uses a fuzzy bilinear resizing filter and it just duplicates or drops frames to convert frame rates. So you get jerky, slightly blurry video.

Thanks for the warning... I used TMPGEnc to deinterlace (only) a PAL video clip and then used ProCoder to convert to NTSC and the results were actually pretty good...

Thanks again
Anthony

[jman98]

I have this one particular DVD that is being a real pain in the arse.

I keep getting these huge horizontal lines that look kind of like exaggerated interlacing artifacts.

I'm wondering if this is really a field order problem. A guy I know gave me a copy of a DVD he bought at a street market in Malaysia and it looked like this. It was a field order problem. I ripped the DVD, fixed the field order, burned it to a new DVD+R disc and it was fine.

[jagabo]

unlock.mcf in zip archive

unlock.zip

[SingSing]

Many low cost DVD players will play NTSC as well as PAL DVD with NTSC TV. Just go into a Target store, and check out the Philips, Trutech or LG DVD player.

Note : Again! DVD contains video pixels, and not video signal.

[jonas more]

I'm wondering if this is really a field order problem. A guy I know gave me a copy of a DVD he bought at a street market in Malaysia and it looked like this. It was a field order problem. I ripped the DVD, fixed the field order, burned it to a new DVD+R disc and it was fine.

I changed the field order but it didn't help. It seems that ProCoder is having a problem deinterlacing this particular video. After I deinterlaced with TMPGEnc I converted it to NTSC with ProCoder without any problems.

Anthony

[jonas more]

unlock.mcf in zip archive

unlock.zip

Thanks man

[FulciLives]

If you follow my guide on PAL to NTSC using TMPGEnc Plus then you will get good results. Granted it might not use the best resizing method but it does good enough and again if you follow my guide you will not have a frame rate issue (i.e., no duplicate or dropped frames). If the internal resizing bothers you then you can use a simple AviSynth script to do the resizing instead but once you get into using AviSynth you might as well just use it and another encoder such as CCE or HCenc etc.

Granted this method works best if the source is progressive PAL but it can also do OK with interlaced PAL if you deinterlace.

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[jonas more]

If the internal resizing bothers you then you can use a simple AviSynth script to do the resizing instead but once you get into using AviSynth you might as well just use it and another encoder such as CCE or HCenc etc.

I have never used AviSynth or CCE but I am giving it a try using this guide http://www.eggshellskull.com/pal2ntsc/

Granted this method works best if the source is progressive PAL but it can also do OK with interlaced PAL if you deinterlace.

I know this will be a very unpopular statement but I have used Nero for progressive PAL DVD to NTSC conversion and the results were great.

What exactly is the best way to convert interlaced PAL to progressive NTSC?

Anthony

[jagabo]

What exactly is the best way to convert interlaced PAL to progressive NTSC?

There is no "best" way. It's a matter of what you prefer.

For low motion material I would use AVISynth's

AssumeTFF()
LeakKernelDeint()
LanczosResize(720, 480)

encode as 25 fps progressive MPEG 2, then use DGPulldown to add pulldown flags for 59.94 fields per second. This will playback about as smoothly as 24 fps film sources with 3:2 pulldown.

For high motion material:

AssumeTFF()
LeakKernelBob()
LanczosResize(720, 480)
ChangeFPS(59.94)
SeparateFields()
SelectEvery(4, 0 3)
Weave()

Then encode as 29.97 fps interlaced MPEG 2. This will be a little jerky but will have better temporal resolution than the first method (50 vs 25 time slices per second).

Some people prefer ConvertFps() to ChangeFps(). ConvertFps() creates blended frames like many hardware PAL/NTSC converters.

For some material you can use motion vector techniques to create in-between fields/frames. This can work well when there is little motion blur in the video. In AVISynth you can do this with MVTools. This post:

https://forum.videohelp.com/topic335127.html#1744209

shows the use of MVTools to change from 20 fps to 23.976 fps. With a combination of that technique and the second script above you could generate very smooth 29.97 fps interlaced video. But some material may show very odd distortions.

[rayden54]

Many low cost DVD players will play NTSC as well as PAL DVD with NTSC TV. Just go into a Target store, and check out the Philips, Trutech or LG DVD player.

Could you recommend a specific low cost player, please? Preferrably one that can be region hacked. And, how well do those cheap players handle PAL to NTSC? The one I've got now has such a terrible jitter that you'd think the characters are dancing.

That OPPO DV-981HD player really looks cool. But, it'd be a bit of a waste on my tv.

[jagabo]

Check out the Philips DVP-5960. Or the DVP-5982. These are inexpensive (~US$70), easily available, are pretty good with PAL->NTSC conversion, play Divx/Xvid/MPEG files on data discs, and can be made region free with a few button presses on the remote. no s-video output though. Only composite, component, and HDMI.

[budz]

get a philips from best buy or wally worlds.

philips 3140
http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?skuId=8216414&type=product&id=1166840037410
https://www.videohelp.com/dvdhacks?dvdplayer=philips+3140&hits=50&Search=Search

philips 5982
http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?skuId=8192733&type=product&id=1164157002483
https://www.videohelp.com/dvdhacks?dvdplayer=philips+5982&hits=50&Search=Search

philips 3960, HDMI WALMART.COM
http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product.do?product_id=5584897#Item+Description
https://www.videohelp.com/dvdhacks?dvdplayer=philips+3960&hits=50&Search=Search

All of those models up above are all NTSC & PAL. I posted the region free hacks as well.
Take your pick and I'm sure you'll be satisfied with any one of those players.

[NickV]

I just got the DVP-5982 at Sam's club and being ignorant, called Phillips Tech support about all region and was told that any sold in the US were region 0 or 1 only. Then I found lots of mentions of hacks when I looked on the web. Well, I hooked it up, and had difficulty on HDMI having it say no video signal, and fussed with the cable to no avail, and for then accidentally touched the front of the case, and it started playing. I looked at a USA DVD which played fine, and then tried a english Pal dvd I got for my wife at christmas. I hadn't done the hack stuff or anything, and lo and behold it worked and played fine, with nothing else done. . . It was clearly marked region 2 and I won't be able to try any others for a couple of days when some other english DVD's get here. . . but what is going on? Why did it work "straight out of the box" -- it wasn't supposed to!

[jman98]

NickV - Welcome to the forums, but you should have started a new thread on this. This thread has nothing specific to do with DVP-5982. We generally take a dim view of "thread hijacking" and "grave robbing" (digging up old threads from months ago and commenting on them) and you're guilty of both. Please be more careful in the future.

Best guess - either the DVD is actually coded for region 1 and 2 (it might even be all regions) or there was a mistake and your player was accidentally left in region free mode. Just because a DVD box says a DVD is for a certain region that does not mean it is correct. I have many DVDs from Hong Kong that clearly state on the box "region 3 only" but in fact do not contain any region coding. I've seen various combinations of regions on DVDs, like DVDs coded for regions 1-4, or 1, 2 and 4. Even DVDs coded for just regions 1 and 2 would be possible. The best way I know to tell what region is on the DVD is to find the old DVD Decrypter program (you'll have to find it on P2P networks) and open it with that. It can tell you what regions the DVD is coded for. You can also try playing it on a PC with something like PowerDVD or WinDVD and if it really is only coded for region 2, they will refuse to play it and offer you a chance to change the region setting on your PC's DVD drive, but do NOT do that! Just exit out of that without changing the region on the drive.